He made it as a producer first and that's where he was always most interesting. Even his early albums that I love had corny bars. But the beats and vision were great for a solid run of albums. Initially success gave him the ability to put the right people in the studio.

But cracks were already showing a decade ago and now it's laughable.

Edit: if you're really interested watch this. It's three years old and it's gotten worse since then (but he's made follow-ups).

It's a deep dive but there's a lot there

Edit2: I didn't even listen to it because he's been using ai voice clones of his voice on his writers / collaborators demos. It's weird. He thinks it's the same as autotune but it's not.

[–] madame_gaymes@programming.dev 2 points 4 weeks ago (2 children)

Corny bars I can handle, love 'em even. I listen to Aesop Rock / Hail Mary Mallon and MF DOOM a fair bit, so yea... 😅

I used to work for a company that made samplers/boards/synths, and I do remember there being a lot of chatter about the production side of things. One of my buddy's at the time ran a fairly successful studio and couldn't stop talking about some of the releases.

Thanks for the deep dive! I dig that stuff, too.

[–] ArcaneSlime@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 points 4 weeks ago* (last edited 4 weeks ago) (1 children)

"Corny bars I can handle, I listen to two of the literal best rappers of all time"

Madam I cannot abide, there's absolutely nothing corny about either of those dudes, and the lyrics always have double or triple meanings (sometimes self referential).

Now, someone like Plies? Yeah, corny all day.

"You got da prettyest set a pussy lips I neva seen, if I wanna eatchya I can eatchya cause ya pussy clean."

But the guy who wrote daylight/nightlight? Naw.

"All I ever wanted was to pick apart the day

Swallow up the pieces, spit 'em at your species

Beached in a city of lost barnacles and leeches

Night Light got me when the daylight went to evenin' (day turns night)"

[–] madame_gaymes@programming.dev 3 points 4 weeks ago (1 children)

I think we have different definitions of corny, I don't mean it as an insult at all. Something can be both corny on the surface and have a deeper meaning IMO. I chose Aesop and DOOM because they both have that level of, "serious, but written like a joke", and it's part of why I love their work so much.

Conversely, Run The Jewels is almost always serious and direct. They have some corny stuff, too, but again I'm not belittling anything about their work. Just pointing out a difference in the vibe, Aesop and DOOM tend to lean a little more into the comedy when they write is all. Some times comedy has the deepest meaning.

The example you gave about Plies is just garbage. There's nothing there. Never listened to them, but if that's what their lyrics are like then I'm not interested.

[–] ArcaneSlime@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 4 weeks ago (1 children)

Fair enough, yeah we must be using different definitions lol. To me corny is nothing but an insult.

Oh Plies is basically my definition of a corny motherfucker, he's terrible. My favorite he does is a song called Bruh bruh that ends every line with "bruh bruh." (Sidenote, album was called "Goon Affiliated" before gooning existed, but still, goddamn that's funny.) Mrs. Pretty Pussy (the song I quoted earlier) is also just as bad, doubly so because the singing itself is almost cornier than the lyrics.

To me, wordsmiths like Aesop and DOOM, and even El-P and Killer Mike (though tbh I like Company Flow more than RTJ), are the farthest from corny one can get.

[–] madame_gaymes@programming.dev 2 points 4 weeks ago* (last edited 4 weeks ago)

I always think of corny in relation to romantics. A lot of times doing things for your partner, especially cliche things, is referred to as corny. However, it doesn't detract from the relationship or how they feel about each other.

Clearly, we agree on the wordsmith definition, at least

[–] can@sh.itjust.works 2 points 4 weeks ago* (last edited 4 weeks ago) (2 children)

I started with My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy because I loved the King Crimson sample flip. Then I went to the beginning and listened in order from there. I loved Yeezus' sound when it came out (still so). Daft Punk produced 4 tracks on it.

Also, that's really cool. I'd love more info about your time the company. What kind of gear, anything.

[–] madame_gaymes@programming.dev 2 points 4 weeks ago (1 children)

I was with Akai from the MPC Renaissance up to MPC Live/X.

Got to meet Q-Tip when the Ren released, that was probably one of the coolest things that ever happened. Too bad the company is owned by a piece of shit misogynist and Akai's main idea guy does nothing but rip the rankest farts all day long.

[–] can@sh.itjust.works 2 points 4 weeks ago

That is extremely cool. Love Q-Tip and have some AKAI stuff but bought second-hand. I did know about the owner.

[–] Skullgrid@lemmy.world 0 points 4 weeks ago* (last edited 4 weeks ago) (1 children)

I started with My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy because I loved the King Crimson sample flip.

Jesus fucking christ that was an awful use of a great song. The way he forced it to be autoplayed in a mission for Saints Row was a crime against art.

He's literally no DOOM.

Now DOOM could take leftovers and turn them into 3 star dining.

[–] can@sh.itjust.works 0 points 4 weeks ago (1 children)

I love DOOM too. It's not a competition. They have different styles.

[–] Skullgrid@lemmy.world 1 points 4 weeks ago (1 children)

Ok, let me be clearer. He doesn't know how to sample, his music has always sucked and he's literally an egomaniac.

The only reason I bought up DOOM was the last time I said he ripped off king crimson , people said I didn't understand sampling or hip hop or whatever. But that's what he did, he took an ill fitting part from a well known song and ruined it.

[–] can@sh.itjust.works 1 points 4 weeks ago (1 children)

It's subjective. What do you think of this chop?

[–] Skullgrid@lemmy.world 1 points 4 weeks ago

I think it's a waste of time to even try, I had my fill when I was forced to hear his ass during saints row, and when I went outside in the 00s.

If he wanted people to give his music a fair shake, maybe he shouldn't have saturation bombed his junk and acted like a literal maniac.