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I've got a spicy take, but desperately want to get it off my chest
(sh.itjust.works)
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this post was submitted on 02 Nov 2024
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I fervently disagree. I think you can view it in a very optimistic and utopic way.
When confronted with his friend's sentience and individuality being questioned, Captain Picard chose to debate on the basis of data being a person and deserving rights. Sure you could've just said that data was a person because Starfleet accepted him. But does that specifically extend to all androids or beings in similar circumstances? I think it's a good character moment for Picard that he chooses to argue on the basis that star fleet is better than stripping away someone's agency. And he wins too. Ultimately the federation comes to agree with that view point. Thats why it is a utopic society. Because when faced with a moral dilemma they didn't simply choose "technically legally correct" they chose "morally right".
You forgot that it was starlet that created the need for this legal argument in the first place.
If the judge was truly moral; this trial would never have happened. If starfleet was moral, the docheberger that wanted to dismantle data would never have been a member.
Also the other best defense would have been to ask docuheberger to prove he’s not just a machine, and crusher explain in intricate detail how they can reassemble Ryker’s brain. And reattach Ryker’s limb after Warf rips it off.
(Okay, so maybe I don’t like Ryker.)
Yeah they encountered something new in the universe and they had to decide on what to do. They decided to do the moral thing for moral reasons. Starfleet isn't a utopia but it's utopic because of instances like this where the right thing is done for the right reasons.
The fact they had a trial to determine data’s personhood and that it was agonizingly close, that they were actually considering denying it.
If they were truly moral, the question would have never come up; or Maddox and the general would have been slapped down with a scathing “don’t be evil”.
Also, at that point data was hardly new- he’s been in starfleet for 20+ years in which Data earned his place as a decorated Lt. Commander.
In any case, this isn’t even a question for a starfleet court - this would fall under civil purview, and even hearing the trial is a miscarriage. (Also the IFP courts probably have some sort of test that doesn’t require destructive testing. Details.)
Yeah sitting down and discussing all viewpoints before coming to consensus is clearly beneath Starfleet. They should just automatically know the right thing to do (which is obvs what I think is right) and clearly a interplanetary civilisation wouldn't have any sort of conflict of interest/opinion.
Obviously the guy suing should understand data is clearly a person despite being a new 'unique' form of life in the universe that they have never interacted with before. Like come on are you telling me everyone in the federation hasn't watched tng and become emotionally attached to the characters like I have.
Stoopid episode 0/10
Except that’s not what’s happening here. This is a criminal trial under military/starfleet law to determine if Data has the right to refuse.
This isn’t some arbitration hearing this is a criminal trial. Remember, they came and ordered him, Picard tried to stop it and failed so Data resigned his commission.
Maddox’s argument is that a toaster doesn’t get to do that. (Conveniently ignoring that toasters aren’t commissioned officers to begin with.) it’s prima facie an attempt to coerce data into doing research that will almost certainly kill him; for dubious scientific benefit.
Fascesiousness aside, yes. That’s exactly what should have happened.
Remember that thing called the Prime Directive? several core bits would simply not work without some definitive test as to who or what has personhood and who or what doesn’t.
Maddox’s position has the same level of standing as the recent Florida case against newspapers, where the judge responded “It’s the 4th Amendment, idiot.”
Even further there’s 20+ years of Data passing as a person so well that no one before The Jackass ever questions it. Almost like, because he meets the criteria in the same way that Jackass or Picard or Troy or even the blue barber guy does.
It’s only when Jackass wants to destructively clone Data that it’s even brought up as a question.
So YES, ABSOLUTELY, this trial should never have been allowed to ever happen.
Nope you are nitpicking and biased bye bye