I've been trying Lemmy for a little while and wasn't sure how to feel about it.
Today, I wanted to start blocking the most high-censorship instances until I could find a fully zero-censorship instance and simply block all the ones with censorship. Filter bots, not people.
When I looked into it further, I found out there are no zero-censorship instances, because Lemmy relies on a broken "federation" system where each instance is supposed to be able to fetch posts from other instances, but it's never been finished to reach a fully working state. Lemmy's official docs say you can't even do federation over Tor at all. This means it uses DNS, so it won't actually allow Lemmy instances to fetch posts from each other freely, it just gets blocked instantly and easily, every time the authorities feel like blocking anything.
So you can only ever have the "average joe lemmy" and "average joe reddit" with everything approved by the authorities, and then "tor copies of lemmy" and "tor copies of reddit" where you have free speech but you can only reach other nerds.
People seem to think Lemmy is different because this weird censorship fetish is extremely popular and most of you are happy to see bans happen to certain people, not just bots, so a small Lemmy that censors certain people feels fundamentally different from a big reddit that censors more people. But it's the exact same thing, it's reddit.
When reddit was smaller, you could say basically anything you wanted there, they just wouldn't let it reach the main audience. Then it got too big, and any tiny part of the audience you could reach would be too big, so they won't let you talk at all.
Lemmy is now the small part of reddit where you can say whatever you want, separated from the main audience, until too much growth happens and you have to move again.
It's not actually a solution to reddit. It's not designed to be different, it's designed to match the past today and then match reddit's present tomorrow, while being part of a system that's about the same in past, present, and future.
Last year, this year, and next year, you're posting somewhere it won't be seen by many people, and the system that charges people for ambulance rides is getting another year of ambulance ride revenue, facing no organized resistance. There's no difference here.
Lemmy urgently needs federation between onion service instances and DNS addresses in order to actually do what most users seem to wish it would do: allow discussion outside what the corporate authorities allow, while outgrowing reddit & helping undo the damage social media has done to human communication.
Edit - I was banned from my instance, and before being unbanned, some of my comments seem to have been removed. I apologize if I hurt anyone's feelings, but it seems pointless to try to discuss this topic here. I'll give a few more replies, and then suggest any further responses be directed to me on nostr, where there are no bans. I've also had a good time posting on PieFed while I was banned, so I'll probably keep spending time there. If anyone's curious, I had a thread about this topic on PieFed too. Btw, instead of the misplaced focus on bots, I should have said filter spam, not people earlier in this post.
I'm not lying. I am stating the facts.
You run the tor binary and connect to it over socks5 and make connections to places (onion or not) through that socks5. If the app doesn't support socks5 you need to bodge it and redirect connections from the app into socks5 through some other means.
(At least that is the old way, with arti things are changing, but it's still in development, and when we are talking about onion services the old tor binary is still necessary)
You are lying about your previous lies, and then stating unrelated facts to confuse people.
To be clear for others reading this: "you run the tor binary" doesn't mean "the app runs the tor binary" it means you, the user on the system. Lemmy doesn't need Tor built-in to use Tor, and while the user I'm replying to is trying to confuse you, their explanation in this comment does match that reality
I am not.
I never meant that the app has to, the user can too.
No, but then the individual lemmy instances would have to bodge tor support, as I have been trying to say. And since they very likely don't, tor based federation wouldn't work with those instances.
It does.
Seems like another lie.
I don't believe you. If true, advice: better phrasing in future disagreements.
Didn't ask.
Yep.
Go add Tor support, it's a better use of your time, https://github.com/LemmyNet/lemmy
Or add to the docs how each individual instance can connect over Tor.
Incorrect. Sharing important information online is a good use of my time. Contributing code to non-P2P internet stuff is a bad use of my time. Bad is worse than good. "Better" is the opposite of "worse."
That's more in line with what would be a good use of my time, but wouldn't it be more fitting for someone who has the information on hand to do it?
Like, if you're about to explain it to me so I can copy and paste your explanation into the docs, why not just put it in the docs yourself?
"Lmao, I'm too important to work on this thing I want! Everyone else should do it for me!
Do it! Do it NOW!"
No thanks. Do it yourself.
Why should I do something you want done, that I'm not interested in?
Why are you asking that like there's an answer?
There isn't. That's my point. You are thumping the table and making demands and no-one has any reason to do anything.
Incorrect, and seems like shallower projection / more embarrassingly dumb gaslighting than you've mostly been doing.
Okay, so you're not making demands. So what now then? It's not going to happen unless you do it yourself, or somehow convince Lemmy to change direction (unlikely).
Currently answering yet another dumb question you can't possibly have really needed to ask.
Incorrect. Someone else could also do it themselves or "convince Lemmy to change direction" (i.e. pay a dev to do a fork or whatever you mean?)
Incorrect. "Convincing Lemmy to change direction" (i.e. paying a dev to do a fork or whatever you mean) is the type of thing I kinda tend to do
Yeah, but no-one of any relevance seems to be interested in doing this.
So you do have longer plans here despite claiming in other replies that you're not really that bothered.
Which is it? "Yeah" or "no-one of any relevance seems to be interested in doing this?"
Did you misread what I said so "yeah" seemed compatible with "no-one of any relevance seems to be interested in doing this?" Or are you just acting incredibly dumb as a weird form of gaslighting?
I don't often use the phrase "not really that bothered" and I never implied I have no long-term plans. Do you have me confused with someone else?
I can't rule out the prospect, but I see no particular reason to assume that there's anyone both capable and willing to do what you want.
You realise "not really that bothered" wasn't meant to be a direct quote of you, right? It was just some posts I read from you on this where you seemed to downplay your investment in this.
Good for you or sorry that happened or whatever
Was it in quote marks at the time? Is there some reason I wouldn't realize that? I don't really remember
Don't get what you're saying
No, it was not in quote marks.
Typical.
Replying late because of my ban
Alright, not sure what we were talking about anymore though, coming back 5 days later from being banned
Sounds like you need to work on your communication skills
Heads up, if you reply to this I might not see it because I was banned here so it doesn't seem worth trying to have much discussion here. If you have anything to say to me, try the nostr version of this thread