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Are LoRa networks a way around the surveillance state? (lemmy.world)

submitted 1 day ago by brownsugga@lemmy.world to c/privacy@lemmy.world

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I’ve recently discovered meshtastic and related tech. With the trust vacuum around cell phones and data scraping and tracking etc, I basically assume the government et al can see what’s up on my iphone constantly.

For interpersonal communication regarding civil disobedience, protest, resistance etc-- do LoRa devices offer an actual solution? or am I very mistaken?

I’m posting from a laptop that I converted to Linux (not tech savvy so that was a project) from behind a VPN- genuinely looking to hear from smarter people than me regarding privacy and secure communication

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[–] XLE@piefed.social 15 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

Meshtastic might start to be useful in a use case like

the Internet is demolished in an area
power is not out, or at least everybody has enough batteries to last for a while
a large actor is not driving around looking for LoRa device broadcasters (this one basically rules out avoiding surveillance)
All you need is SMS tier texting

It's also got so many limitations, I really don't know what an optimal use case would be.

Devices can't be too far apart or the connection won't work.
Devices can't be too close together or the network will get overcongested*
Devices can't be too many hops away, or the message won't make it.
Data transfer speeds range between slow and extremely slow
You need either a specialized piece of hardware - which currently isn't very good - or a separate phone to message people.

* I don't know what a network that's too congested looks like, but if a surveillance state feels like cracking down on communications to the point of shutting down the internet, they could probably rove around finding people with these stations.

[–] Telorand@reddthat.com 4 points 1 day ago (1 children)

...they could probably rove around finding people with these stations.

True, though the benefit of these and other kinds of community-run decentralized networks is that it becomes harder to disrupt those networks. It's not impossible, but they're often built around an idea of, "But what if this node goes down?" so they have ways to address those issues or make it so that it's easy to deploy new nodes.

Still, if things are to the point that the government is cracking down on hobbyist radios, you've probably got lots to consider regarding the best ways to communicate with other dissidents and activists.

[–] XLE@piefed.social 2 points 15 hours ago (2 children)

It seems to me that a mesh network would only be useful if the internet went down and it was an accident. The one successful use case I've heard was during a natural disaster. If the internet is shut down intentionally, such as the case of the Iran protests, having a communication beacon sounds like a really bad idea...

[–] Telorand@reddthat.com 3 points 14 hours ago (1 children)

Dangerous? Probably.

Bad? I mean, at some point, it becomes a risk assessment. Organizing at the risk of physical discovery might still be worth it, depending on your goals and what you're willing to sacrifice. The benefit of these networks is that you don't need tons of funds or construction ability to set them up. Whether you are an activist, a hobbyist, or a political dissident, you don't need a government or business to do it for you.

It's not really my place to determine what someone's best strategy is, as strategic factors are likely always changing.

[–] XLE@piefed.social 2 points 13 hours ago

I'm no expert either. But I did download an app on my phone called Tesla Radar, and if you use it, you will discover the unique Bluetooth IDs of any Tesla car that drives past your phone while it's passively scanning. I'm not smart enough with LoRa radios to know or understand if are similar issues with those...

[–] cynar@lemmy.world 1 points 13 hours ago

There is always the option for gorilla node deployment. They need very little power, so solar etc is an option, and the hardware is relatively cheap.

A cheap drone could easily place nodes in hard to reach locations e.g. top of telephone poles. You now have an anonymous node that is trivial to connect to but harder to disable.

It's far from perfect, but a good option.

I also now have the image of a node built into a drone. Then it bolting, like a startled sparrow, when they try to remove it...