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this post was submitted on 19 Oct 2023
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The fog of war is real and initial BREAKING NEWS reports should be treated with healthy skepticism until we get a clearer picture of the evidence.
There was pretty good video evidence almost immediately though. And additional video/picture evidence has come out to support it.
It's actually an interesting case because there wasn't actually much fog of war here. The confusion here is the information warfare.
Just like this should also probably be treated with skepticism... The people investigating are going to be from groups which want the narrative to be true. Israel controls the people who come in and out. The people investigating. Theyanipulate the news and the facts.
Whoever has more money and power controls the narrative in this world. It's the way it's been for decades if not centuries. The victors write history and they print the news articles before it becomes history.
Yeah but then how do they control their innate antisemitism feelings
If it weren’t anti semitism they would apologize. Instead they are now saying that it doesn’t matter because they have done it before and completely forgot about the victims they claimed to be outraged about.
I'm not anti-semitic. I love every Jewish person I've met so far. However, I am anti-zionist. Putting this up front so you can ignore everything else after...
It doesn't matter who did this attack or accident or whatever. I never had an opinion on who did it. I still don't. Why it doesn't matter though is because either side has done plenty of horrible things. For example, Israel told people to feel south, then attack the civilian convoy. Attacking a hospital would have been a particularly bad example, but it never should have been used as the primary example because there are unquestioned attacks on civilians that can be pointed at. Why does anyone need to use an unverified claim? I always thought it was stupid.
Similarly, people were sharing claims about babies being beheaded based on one person's statements. This claim still can't be backed up and Israel has said it won't investigate it. Why did anyone ever spread it except that it sounds particularly bad? There were plenty of horrible acts that weren't in question.
People just need to chill out and wait for varification for things that aren't well known before spreading them. It just makes whatever you're supporting look incompetent if it's wrong later.
Has it been confirmed that Israel were behind the explosion at the convoy? It hasn't had as much news analysing it as the hospital strike.
I don't know. I guess there's always going to be fog of war. Regardless, even before any of this current escalation, Israel had an internationally verified 23:1 kill count. There's so many events to point to that there's no need to focus on any particular one. It's important to find out who's involved, but we can't know right now, and likely will never know for many of them. That's just how war goes.
Oh that's a shame. Would be nice to have more clarity on that. I'd avoid posting claims that Israel are definitely responsible for that whilst also asking for people to verify things before spreading possible misinformation.
As you say there's enough bad to go around as it is.
Behadead babies is confirmed by numerous sources. Both the convoy and hospital have been shown to be most likely Hamas or PIJ by independent analysis. Same with 500 deaths at the hospital which analysis showed that it's unlikely to be more than a couple dozens. Tragedy and horrendous, but I don't see anyone condemning PIJ for it or calling them to stop firing rockets.
The main issue here is the burden of proof. It seems that Hamas word is taken at face value while Israel is always considered as lying. You either check facts, and then need to check the claims of both sides, or not. You either care about civilians and then need to care about civilians from both sides or not.
The last couple of weeks showed, at least to me, that many of the people that claim that they care about facts and civilians only do when it's for the "right" side.