358

Harris says US will ‘under no circumstances’ permit forced relocation of Palestinians (www.cnn.com)

submitted 11 months ago by Stamau123@lemmy.world to c/world@lemmy.world

115 comments fedilink hide all child comments

Vice President Kamala Harris said in a meeting Saturday with Egyptian President Abdel Fattah el-Sisi that Washington will not allow for the forced relocation of Palestinians or any redrawing of the current border of the Gaza Strip.

“Under no circumstances will the United States permit the forced relocation of Palestinians from Gaza or the West Bank, the besiegement of Gaza, or the redrawing of the borders of Gaza,” Harris said, according to a statement from the vice president’s office.

you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments

[-] SkepticalButOpenMinded@lemmy.ca 5 points 11 months ago

Is it “mere talk” when Biden says US support for Israel is unconditional? No, we can and should criticize him for that because those words encourage Israel to act without restraint. But, conversely, when the US signals that they will not support actions like forced relocation, we should also see that as a corrective, not “mere talk”.

To your point, in IR theory, there also exists phenomena such as the paradox of empty promises, where making unfulfilled promises can worsen human rights. But that claim is more nuanced: the problem occurs when promises are empty. That doesn’t mean all promises are empty or promising doesn’t matter. Public declarations are a necessary step (but insufficient on their own) to justify further action.

[-] Aceticon@lemmy.world 2 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

Your oversimplified what I wrote and then from that highly reductive take you built an overcomplicated argument.

If certain statements are reliably not followed by action that further the state objectives then "they're all talk", if they are reliably followed by such action then they're not.

Whilst statements by themselves can logically neither be accepted as trully meant nor dismissed as "just talk" in the absence of any track record at all (i.e. first time your hear such things from such people) because there has not yet been time to observe if they're followed by action or inaction leading to a conclusion about the statements being meant or "just talk", when there is a track record one can most certainly extrapolate the likelihood of such statements now being meant or "just talk" if in the past such actors reliably followed such statements with action or inaction.

As it so happen, US Administrations, Democrat and Republican, including those were Biden was, invariably followed statements were they claimed they were going to make Israel do or not do something, with no effective action towards their state objectives or even with actions which were counter those objectives.

In fact the there not being a 2 state solution in Palestine even though various US Adminidtrations claimed to favour it is exactly because NOT ONCE has any of those Administrations acted to punish the Israeli Government for their actions against the Oslo Agreements, quite the contrary: Israel has kept being supported economically and military all the while it acted against the wished stated by the various US Administrations.

It is thus entirelly logical to expect that statements from the US Administration about imposing anything on Israel are "just talk", and totally illogical to ignore the track record of decades of "stating one objective and the acting in opposition to it" by the US with regards to Israel.

[-] SkepticalButOpenMinded@lemmy.ca 2 points 11 months ago

Nowhere in your first comment do you make anything like the argument in your second comment. You say that my summary is reductive and that I built an “over complicated argument” by talking about broken promises. But then you essentially argue that this will be a broken promise!

Your second argument is more reasonable, and not at all over complicated, which is why I anticipated it. The problem with your fatalist take is that “mere talk” precedes, not only broken promises, but also fulfilled promises. Honestly, if your cynical take is right, then there’s no reason to expect anything from any party ever. Cynicism is depressingly fashionable on the left.

this post was submitted on 02 Dec 2023

358 points (95.9% liked)

World News

38965 readers

2223 users here now

A community for discussing events around the World

Rules:

Rule 1: posts have the following requirements:
- Post news articles only
- Video links are NOT articles and will be removed.
- Title must match the article headline
- Not United States Internal News
- Recent (Past 30 Days)
- Screenshots/links to other social media sites (Twitter/X/Facebook/Youtube/reddit, etc.) are explicitly forbidden, as are link shorteners.
Rule 2: Do not copy the entire article into your post. The key points in 1-2 paragraphs is allowed (even encouraged!), but large segments of articles posted in the body will result in the post being removed. If you have to stop and think "Is this fair use?", it probably isn't. Archive links, especially the ones created on link submission, are absolutely allowed but those that avoid paywalls are not.
Rule 3: Opinions articles, or Articles based on misinformation/propaganda may be removed. Sources that have a Low or Very Low factual reporting rating or MBFC Credibility Rating may be removed.
Rule 4: Posts or comments that are homophobic, transphobic, racist, sexist, anti-religious, or ableist will be removed. “Ironic” prejudice is just prejudiced.
Posts and comments must abide by the lemmy.world terms of service UPDATED AS OF 10/19
Rule 5: Keep it civil. It's OK to say the subject of an article is behaving like a (pejorative, pejorative). It's NOT OK to say another USER is (pejorative). Strong language is fine, just not directed at other members. Engage in good-faith and with respect! This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban.

Similarly, if you see posts along these lines, do not engage. Report them, block them, and live a happier life than they do. We see too many slapfights that boil down to "Mom! He's bugging me!" and "I'm not touching you!" Going forward, slapfights will result in removed comments and temp bans to cool off.

Rule 6: Memes, spam, other low effort posting, reposts, misinformation, advocating violence, off-topic, trolling, offensive, regarding the moderators or meta in content may be removed at any time.
Rule 7: We didn't USED to need a rule about how many posts one could make in a day, then someone posted NINETEEN articles in a single day. Not comments, FULL ARTICLES. If you're posting more than say, 10 or so, consider going outside and touching grass. We reserve the right to limit over-posting so a single user does not dominate the front page.

We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.

All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.