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submitted 11 months ago by conditional_soup@lemm.ee to c/uspolitics@lemmy.world

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Hey, so, I was hoping someone could break down the strategy or rationale behind team Biden's current messaging? Cards on the table, I plan on voting for him in the general election and primary, but the Biden camp's messaging seems insane to me. I know a single person irl who's doing well financially right now, everyone else is feeling the pain. The messaging so far seems to be (and please correct me if I'm wrong): everything is fine actually, and we should all be praising him, and it doesn't matter if you disagree because the other guy is Hitler. It just comes across as super disconnected, I don't know any IRL left/Dem voters that resonate with it, and it honestly reminds me of the general vibe of the HRC campaign from 16. This election is too important to fuck up, so this messaging has got me concerned. Can someone explain how this is supposed to win Biden the election?

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[-] Candelestine@lemmy.world 3 points 11 months ago

Pretty simple really, it is precisely a riff on HRC's overall strat. He's trying to court the moderates, who generally think the economy should be priority #1.

He has a finite number of things he can say, and what appeals to one group is less appealing to another. If you can think of a platform that might appeal to both newer leftists and the older boomer dems and the independents all simultaneously, then that would be better than what he's doing.

But otherwise he's going to feel like he needs to shore up his support wherever its weakest, that's just logical. So, he talks up his economy. He's not appealing to his base like Trump does, he's trying to recruit people that don't particularly like him. Trying to compromise, like a veteran statesman from a checks-and-balances government. Build coalitions. Reach across the aisle. All that crap.

My thoughts anyway.

[-] conditional_soup@lemm.ee 3 points 11 months ago

I guess that makes sense, but why tell people how they're feeling? That seems like a poor strategy.

[-] Candelestine@lemmy.world 2 points 11 months ago

I agree. Frankly, he's not the most charismatic guy around, he's never really been good at it. It's a bit of an asset for him sometimes, as certain political attacks kinda slide off his back, since he just comes across as mild-mannered grandpa who speaks his mind too much and kinda just wants everyone to shut the fuck up and focus on the problem.

But it's a double edged sword. HRC also had the charisma of a muddy log, which is why Obama trounced her so hard. She's an analytical policy wonk, she needs chalk, blackboards and essays, not people. He had both policy chops and charisma, so won pretty handily.

Bernie also has policy and charisma.

Importantly, it's useful to remember that the trait of charisma itself is considered profoundly negative by certain workin-man sorts. Kinda a "shut up and get to work, stop manipulating people" kinda thing. So they actually like these dry, crusty sorts. I think you'd have to be older than 40 though, you'd have to pre-date things like The Simpsons and South Park, which utterly trashed this worldview for every generation for probably the next few decades at least.

[-] Varyk@sh.itjust.works 2 points 11 months ago

What messaging are you referring to?

I hear about Biden's achievements vs. the harm done by the Trump administration.

[-] conditional_soup@lemm.ee 2 points 11 months ago

If I'd had infinite time and foresight, I would have brought receipts. As is, I'll say that both on Lemmy and Mastodon, I keep seeing posts and articles that are saying "Americans aren't happy with the economy but they're actually confused and everything's great." On Lemmy, if you point out that the messaging doesn't resonate with your personal experience, you're usually in good company, but you'll get dogpiled on Mastodon from what I've seen.

[-] Varyk@sh.itjust.works -1 points 11 months ago

Oh, I see. The American economy is doing really good right now by all common metrics, so presenting your personal experience might not carry much weight in a discussion that looks for a connection between the current presidential administration and a bad economy when it's so easy to point to all the metrics of a good national economy.

That doesn't mean you're experiences are wrong, you might be attributing certain price hikes to decisions higher up the food chain than they occurred or something like that.

It's difficult to draw specific lines of consequence from the current administration's economic policies to the price of eggs, but it's really easy to point to the fact that the egg companies artificially increased egg prices to maximize profit during a vulnerable time for most Americans.

You could try asking some specific questions about the economy in relevant communities.

Or me. I have a lot of time.

[-] conditional_soup@lemm.ee 3 points 11 months ago

See, I don't think Biden is directly responsible for my grocery prices, but when my wages have been flat and my monthly costs keep going higher and higher despite decreasing our living standards, it really makes me roll my eyes when I see team Biden crowing about how great the economy is doing. I know Biden isn't putting the screws to me, but the messaging is divorced from my reality, as well as that of most people I know. The only person I know who's doing particularly well is doing so because they sold a house that they were given by their parents. I have a gut feeling that the numbers they're citing are being gamed, and beating your chest about gamed numbers and telling Americans that they shouldn't be upset because the numbers look great just doesn't go down smooth and taste great for me.

[-] Varyk@sh.itjust.works 2 points 11 months ago

Sure.

They're correct that the dollar is stronger against other currencies around the world, and that the GDP is growing and unemployment is going down and all of that, but what you're talking about is an institutional and political war against equitable wealth-from-production distribution that is tied directly to conservative judges and politicians.

Biden policies like investing in green infrastructure and energy, and handing out a few thousand dollars to some students are good policies, and they're about as much as any center left Democratic president could hope to achieve in such a polarized political climate, but conservatives and conservative media have tricked Americans into voting away their rights and installed supreme Court justices that have also voted away your rights.

Corporations being able to donate unlimited campaign funds to the wealthy, selfish candidates at the top who wish to preserve their wealth and power was an explicitly conservative victory.

Biden is not progressive except in comparison to the extremists that are labeled conservatives in the United States.

Biden has, though, been enacting social and economic policies that benefit Americans directly since he's been elected, with many achievements I didn't think he'd be interested in passing or be able to pass.

Direct covid relief, school lunches for kids, veteran health care reform, appointing a high and important number of minority judges, gun reform, reversing the military trans ban, directly combating climate change, lowering national debt, investing in infrastructure, the current administration is doing a lot of things that change the actual fabric of how the country is run and the way Americans will experience life in their country but are not flashy or instantaneous; the problems you are describing come directly from wealth disparity and union busting driven by conservative interests.

The Biden administration is going to tout the numbers that most people and news outlets pay attention to(president high number, okay he good), but their practical social achievements that unfortunately most people don't care about and most news outlets don't report on are going to benefit the country and individual Americans far more than a percentage point of GDP they can also lay claim too, and far more than all of the troubles the last administration brought the states.

Trump directly raised prices on domestic goods, directly raised prices on housing, directly removed protections on the environment, there's just no comparison between the two administrations.

Biden is mopping up after Trump in addition to enacting new positive policies that directly benefit Americans.

On paper, Biden's administration is and has been much better for America than the disaster Trump has been and would be, and behind the scenes, the social and judiciary appointments biden's made are going to make American life better in those metrics you were talking about and beyond.

[-] conditional_soup@lemm.ee 2 points 11 months ago

I wish they'd talk more about these policies and their effects instead of just saying "wow, the economy is great, you guys", but another commentor pointed out that that's give the republicans something to attack.

[-] Varyk@sh.itjust.works 2 points 11 months ago

The White House main page lists their larger policies that have had the effects we're talking about, the White House has released large press statements and articles are written about each beneficial act that has been legislated, there are countless third party articles about those policies, but a flood of misinformation and misleading articles from the conservatives might distract you from these truly impressive policy achievements.

With the equivocation and misrepresentation of policy achievements that conservatives are trying to spew as far and wide as possible, it's easy for the casual or unwary American newsreader to become incorrectly convinced that 10 opinion pieces have equal merit as the practical real world effects of these policies.

It's also important to note that the achievements we're taking about are complex policies that positively affect millions or hundreds of millions of people in myriad ways and not as simply comprehended or recalled as the reportings of the new hourly or quarterly update of any one of the inarguably positive economic statistics everybody is asking the White House about.

They are getting the word out, and you have to be critical of the news landscape so that an empty, opinionated hit piece doesn't denigrate or carry the same weight as the practical, concrete achievements made by the Biden administration.

[-] Froyn@kbin.social 2 points 11 months ago

"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."

Joe starts tossing policy and Don will use it as ragebait with no retort of viable policy.
Remember, glorious GOP/Trump Healthcare plan? (2 more weeks till we see it /s)
Remember the "Death Panels" the GOP promised the masses with the ACA?

It is easier to destroy something someone else built than it is to build something of your own.
Less is more and I'm having a hard time believe the 100 senior citizens that picked up the phone or the 50 "random people in Rural Texas" that answered the survey are reflective of the average person (political polling).

[-] conditional_soup@lemm.ee 1 points 11 months ago

This is probably the best answer I've read so far, I think.

[-] the_q@lemmy.world 1 points 11 months ago

You said this election is too important... Why is that?

[-] conditional_soup@lemm.ee 1 points 11 months ago

Because while Biden and the Democrats kinda suck, the republicans openly have plans to dismantle the republic and initiate something more on the order of a classical dictatorship or neofeudalism. I'm not an accelerationist, myself, and I don't exactly trust that any revolution is going to go the way I'd like it to, so for me it's a choice between getting Jeff Bezos' balls in my face as he dunks on us for another four years or getting shot or imprisoned because I didn't retweet our republican/billionaire gentry. It's a shitty, but obvious, choice.

[-] the_q@lemmy.world 1 points 11 months ago

You answered your own question then. That's why the messaging doesn't need to clear because the alternative is the real message.

[-] conditional_soup@lemm.ee 0 points 11 months ago

Wasn't this HRC's strat in 16? Can someone remind me how that went?

[-] the_q@lemmy.world 1 points 11 months ago

Oh shit! You're right! The previous president when Hilary ran had shown that he was a criminal! He showed that he wanted to overthrow our government! Wait... No wait. That's now. Before Trump was a novelty. This time he's proof positive of a fascist regime.

Also, don't think that me or anyone else reading this post and seeing your "I'm just asking questions" play acting that we don't know that you're a Trump supporter trying to sow dissent.

[-] conditional_soup@lemm.ee 0 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

Haha, holy shit, wow, buddy. If that's what you need to soothe the cognitive dissonance, sure, but I've never voted for a Republican in my life. Just to let you in on a secret, you can still be critical of the people you vote for, it's an important part of being a participant in a democracy. I'm being critical of this strat because I think it's a fucking garbage strategy, they're going to fuck it up with their wrongheaded bullshit, and they're going to hand the election and the future of the country to Trump. I came here hoping I was missing something, but apparently not. The plan is literally "2016 but it's totally going to work this time you guys, I swear". Jesus wept.

[-] stevecole90099@lemmy.world 0 points 11 months ago

This election is too important to fuck up, so this messaging has got me concerned.

If the election is that important, then maybe vote for someone who is actually sending out a clear and sane message that you agree with.

Even Hitler tried to do what he thought was best for his country and made it clear that was his goal. Sad thing is he probably would have succeeded too if he didn't fuck with everyone else too.

I don't plan on voting for another 4 years of what is currently going on and the guy that sent 7.2B worth of our tax dollars to a country of terrorists and then refuses to step in when they continue killing innocent people probably doesn't deserve your vote either.

I really hope there is a better choice than what we've seen the last two times. Otherwise, we're all screwed no matter what way it goes.

[-] conditional_soup@lemm.ee 2 points 11 months ago

I voted third party last election, so, I hear you, but the republicans have made it crystal clear that they intend to dismantle the republic and establish something like neofeudalism or a classical dictatorship if they win. I am specifically going to vote against that this election.

[-] stevecole90099@lemmy.world 2 points 11 months ago

Yea, hopefully, there is a better choice when the time comes, but WW3 or Civil War 2 is probably more likely than getting a decent candidate anytime soon that actually has a chance of winning.

[-] the_q@lemmy.world 0 points 11 months ago

This kid is empathizing with Hitler, folks.

[-] stevecole90099@lemmy.world 0 points 11 months ago

The Germans voted him into power for a reason, but who knows, maybe they just wanted to vote blue no matter who or maybe his "make Germany great again" speeches where just to die for.

If you can't see how and why someone like Hitler got elected to be the leader of Germany and made it as far as he did, then how are you going to stop it from happening again?

But yea, that's just nonsense, I'm just sad his re-election was stolen from him by the Americans. \s

[-] the_q@lemmy.world -1 points 11 months ago

You sure know a lot about Hitler.

[-] stevecole90099@lemmy.world 0 points 11 months ago

Seems like the type of guy everyone should know about. 🤔 He is responsible for the murder of between 5 and 17 million people, but I guess you probably don't think they are worth knowing about either?

[-] the_q@lemmy.world 1 points 11 months ago

Lol oh you caught me! I'm not a Nazi like you! Dang I was trying to infiltrate your group and try to take you guys down!

Lol you're garbage, bud.

[-] stevecole90099@lemmy.world 0 points 11 months ago

Lol you're garbage, bud.

Says the guy who thinks people shouldn't know about Hitler. Sure sounds like you got something to hide?

[-] thesmokingman@programming.dev 0 points 11 months ago

The messaging doesn’t matter because the Democrats are capitalizing on the “he’s not Trump” vote. Unless you make seven figures or more, you are not the audience for presidential messaging. You don’t matter.

this post was submitted on 30 Nov 2023

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