browle

joined 1 week ago
[–] browle@feddit.uk 1 points 16 hours ago

I actually also used LLM to provide the draft texts which I then reviewed context-wise. However, as I also responded to some other comments, I will (actually have already) changed to not use LLM anymore. Instead, I am drafting all my responses on my own and just have LLM polish my English :-)

[–] browle@feddit.uk 1 points 16 hours ago

Hey huppakee. Thanks for your feedback. I like your suggestion about using llm to practice my English skills. I will most probably try to do so. I believe it could be quite more efficient rather than using those common apps like babble or dualingo, because it the LLM can be told to be super-specific to me! As to browle.com: yes, I have been using LLM quite a lot to do the research - as you can see I am now at more than 900 brands that were analysed. I could not have done this research without LLM actually. But, I set the rules, the boundaries- therefore it acts on my behalf. My personal motivation on browle is actually to make us all more aware about our decisions when we buy something. My personal opinion: Europe is a great place to live and to work. We should be proud about what we are, what we do and what we stand for. When I break a small part of this down to "my personal buy behaviour" I try as much as possible to favour EU made products.

[–] browle@feddit.uk -1 points 17 hours ago

OK, thanks for your feedback. And I am not taking it as a personal attack - no worries. I am writing this and the reply before, completely on my own - without any help of LLM or other tools :-) It may be the English that I am used to apply from my normal work in business! Have a good one!

[–] browle@feddit.uk 4 points 20 hours ago (5 children)

Yes, indeed. I received similar feedback from others as well. I believe you are fully correct. I actually used LLM to review my comments/posts. I got your point and fully agree with you. I will make sure, that in moving forward I will only use LLM to a strict minimum and keep my own personal language (as non-English-native speaker ;-)). Thank you very much for this, trolske!

[–] browle@feddit.uk 1 points 20 hours ago (2 children)

Hi asudox. No, I am not an LLM. But I did use LLM for reviewing my posts (especially because I am not English-native speaker). But I fully get your point and I will make sure moving forward to keep the LLM review to a strict minimum, and will put more focus on my own, natural language :) Thanks a lot for pointing it out to me! Much appreciated.

 

Last week someone here posted a list of welted shoe and Shetland knitwear makers, partly to make the point that "just one line made in UK" is a common dodge. I said I would check them. Here is what came back.

Ten new names, nine listed, one rejected.

Knitwear, which turned out to be the actual gap

Shoes were already well covered. Knitwear was not, and the comment made that obvious.

Jamieson's of Shetland runs the only commercial wool mill on the islands, at Sandness. Fleece is graded, scoured, dyed and spun there, and the knitting happens on the islands too.

Harley of Scotland has been on the same plot in Queen Street, Peterhead since 1929. It was a herring yard before they bought it.

Bosie is North East Scotland, a family in the trade since 1929, producing in Scotland.

Howlin' is the interesting one. Antwerp label, but the knitwear has been made in Scotland since 1981. Their lighter jersey and towelling pieces name no country, so that entry carries a partial badge instead of a full one.

William Lockie was already on the list before the thread, for what it is worth.

Shoes

Goral moved the family workshop from Poland to Sheffield in 2005 and makes every pair there start to finish.

Berwick makes in Almansa. All 48 products on their own site say so.

Vass works out of a Budapest workshop, handmade only.

J.M. Weston marks 342 of its 783 products "Fabriqué en France à Limoges". All 24 derbies carry it and not one of the 67 shoe trees does, so that one is partial too.

Baracuta was exactly the case described in the comment. Their own product copy says the G9 Harrington has been designed and made in the UK since 1937. Nothing else in the range says anything, and the bags and belts are made in Italy.

Gola did not make it

Their about page is all heritage. A small factory in 1905, plimsolls on 1970s pitches, "an iconic British brand". Nowhere does it say where the shoes are made today. That describes a design lineage, not a factory, so Gola went onto the not listed page with the reason written out.

On New Balance, which came up in the same comment

The Flimby factory is real and the Made in UK line is genuine. It still stays off, because the directory lists European brands and New Balance is American. That is a scope decision rather than an evidence one, and it seemed more honest to say so than to quietly drop it.

Two things that nearly went wrong

goral.co.uk is a parked domain with a for sale banner on it. The real site is goral-shoes.co.uk. Had I only tried the obvious address I would have written off a working Sheffield manufacturer as untraceable.

The Vass site footer reads "Made in Budapest by WordPress Expert". That is the web developer. The actual evidence sits on their about page. A "made in" in a footer usually belongs to the agency, not the product.

Ten leads, nine held up. That is a better hit rate than my own research usually manages, so if you know a knitter or shoemaker I have missed, the same offer stands.

Disclaimer: browle.com is mine. None of the ten brands above is monetised, though 7 of the 721 entries do carry an affiliate link, so it is a project that can earn money rather than a pure hobby. No ads and no third party code on a normal page view.

[–] browle@feddit.uk 2 points 1 day ago

not a bad idea :-)

[–] browle@feddit.uk 1 points 1 day ago

That matches what we keep running into. One line made in Europe with the rest offshore is common enough that we ended up building a badge for it instead of treating made in Europe as a yes or no question. Your welted list is mostly in there already: Crockett & Jones, Tricker's, Paraboot, Carmina and TLB Mallorca, plus Cheaney, Solovair, Crown Northampton, Heschung, Ludwig Reiter, and Heinrich Dinkelacker whose Budapesters really are made in Budapest. Loake and Grenson are in with the badge, since only their Made in England ranges qualify. Goral, Berwick, Vass and J.M. Weston are missing, so they go on the list to check. The shetland side is the real gap. William Lockie in Hawick is in there and nothing else you named is. Jamieson's, Harley of Scotland, Bosie and Howlin all go on the list. Knitwear is thinner than footwear in the directory and your comment makes that hard to miss. Each one gets checked the same way, a public source from the brand saying where the product is actually made. If it fails, it goes on the not listed page with the reason rather than quietly vanishing. Baracuta and Gola included.

Thanks for the running shoe link too. Factory ownership is a different question from country of manufacture, but the New Balance UK factory is exactly the single line case that badge exists for, so that goes on the list as well.

[–] browle@feddit.uk 3 points 1 day ago (2 children)

Thanks, glad it is useful. Honestly there is no story. It just sounded decent to me and the domain was free. The one deliberate part was that it had to mean nothing in particular. The site runs in English, German and French, so an obvious name like buyeu or madeineurope would have read fine to English speakers and clumsy to everyone else. A word that means nothing is at least equally neutral in all three.

 

Last week I posted here about verifying where 600+ "European" brands are actually made. Three of you corrected me: the SIGG line, the Salomon scope and the tracking claim. All three are fixed in that post and in the directory.

Since then I worked through British heritage names. The pattern is sharper than anything I found on the continent. These brands do manufacture in Britain, and the phrase still tells you almost nothing.

Burberry. The Heritage Trench and Car Coats have been made at the Castleford site in Yorkshire for over 50 years, from gabardine woven at Burberry's own mill in Keighley. That is the British part. The rest of the range is made elsewhere.

Barbour. The Bedale and Beaufort wax jackets are still made by hand in Simonside, South Shields. That is two jackets. The same building re-waxes and repairs the ones customers send back, which I would argue counts for more than most heritage marketing.

Mulberry. The company says it makes "around 50% of our Icons" at its two Somerset factories, which makes it the largest luxury leather manufacturer in the UK. Half, of the icon range.

Drake's. Every tie is handmade in their own east London workshop. Shirts and knitwear come from other makers.

Turnbull & Asser. Shirts, ready to wear and bespoke, from their own factory on the edge of Gloucestershire. One line from the factory stuck with me: they have machinists, not machine operatives, and each one can make a whole shirt.

Five famous British names, and in every case the honest answer is a product line, not a brand. The label on the individual piece is the only thing that actually tells you.

One that did not make it: Whitehouse Cox, the Walsall leather workshop. I went to verify them and the domain no longer resolves. Founded 1875, gone at some point recently, and I cannot even find an announcement.

Same project as last time. The five above are in the directory with the scope written on each entry and the source linked. Corrections welcome, the last three came from this thread.

Disclaimer: browle.com is mine. None of the five brands above is monetised, though 7 of the 671 entries do carry an affiliate link, so it is a project that can earn money rather than a pure hobby. No ads and no third party code on a normal page view, as discussed in the last thread.

[–] browle@feddit.uk 3 points 2 days ago (1 children)

If you do, the hardest part is deciding what counts. Owned in Europe, founded in Europe and manufactured in Europe give you three very different lists, and a lot of brands only make it into one of them. I settled on production location as the only thing that decides a listing, and put ownership on the page as a separate fact, because people kept reading one as the other. Everything I have is public with the source on each entry, so lift whatever is useful.

[–] browle@feddit.uk 2 points 2 days ago (1 children)

That is what I ended up doing, so thanks for the push. The three wrong lines are struck through in the post now, with the correct version right underneath. Nothing deleted, and you get the right info without having to scroll into the comments.

[–] browle@feddit.uk 1 points 2 days ago

Fair, and that is roughly why the Salomon entry got rewritten after this thread. The French factory is real, but it builds selected models while most of the range still comes from Asia, so the entry says that now instead of "made in France". A tag is only as good as the rules behind it, and for footwear those rules let a lot through. If you ever find a tag that contradicts something I have listed, send it over. That is the kind of check I cannot do from a company website.

[–] browle@feddit.uk 1 points 6 days ago

Both things from this thread are now live.

The suggestion form: browle.com/en/suggest (also /de and /fr). Brand name plus an evidence link is all it takes, no account needed, and every suggestion goes through the same verification as any listed brand. You asked for exactly this, so it seemed wrong to keep pointing people at an email address.

And ownership is now its own field on brand pages, separate from the manufacturing facts. The first batch is the cases this thread raised: Birkenstock (L Catterton, 62.4% per their SEC annual report), Salomon's parent Amer Sports (Anta largest shareholder at 41.7%), Beyerdynamic (Cosonic), SIGG (Haers), plus Lowa (Tecnica Group) and Duralex, which went the other direction and became an employee cooperative in 2024. Each dated and sourced, and the page says plainly: ownership is shown for context, listing stays based only on where products are made.

Thanks for the push. Tips from this thread built most of what shipped this week.

 

Over the last weeks I went through 600+ brands that get recommended as "European alternatives" and tried to verify where their products are actually made — factory pages, press visits, certifications. Some things genuinely surprised me:

1. Birkenstock really is made in Germany — over 95%. Their largest production site is in Görlitz, Saxony, and they're expanding it. (source)

2. Every single Nespresso capsule sold worldwide is made in Switzerland. All of them — roasted, ground and sealed in one of three Swiss factories. (source)

3. The Norwegian outdoor brands mostly don't produce in Norway — but they built their own factories in the Baltics. Norrøna runs its own factory in Lithuania, Devold makes over 90% of its wool clothing at its Lithuanian plant, and Aclima knits its merino in Estonia. Still EU, still their own factories — but not what the marketing photos imply. (Norrøna, Devold, Aclima)

4. About 85% of Beyerdynamic headphones are still handmade in Heilbronn, Germany. In an industry that moved to Asia decades ago. (source)

5. Salomon opened a fully automated sneaker factory in the French Alps to build shoes 100% in France. Automation is what makes European sneaker production viable again. (source) (Scope correction in the EDIT below.)

6. The canvas sneakers you'd guess are the most "outsourced" product are the opposite: Novesta has run the same Slovak factory since 1939. (source)

The pattern I keep seeing: "European brand" and "made in Europe" are completely different claims. The ones that really produce here are usually loud about the specific factory — the vague ones ("designed in…", "European quality") usually aren't.

And the flip side, which felt just as important: some famous "European" names didn't hold up. ~~The SIGG bottle is no longer made in Switzerland;~~ the Berkel slicer — an Italian icon — is now built in India under a "design made in Italy" line; Teufel is designed in Berlin but produced in China. I put those on a public "not listed" page with the reason for each, because quietly leaving them out felt dishonest.

Disclosure: this is my own project — I put all 628 verified brands with their sources into a free directory, browle.com, EN/DE/FR, no ads, ~~no tracking~~ and since this thread: no third-party code on a normal page view. The "not listed" page is there too. Corrections very welcome — the evidence link is on every entry.

EDIT (26 July): I wrote in the correction comment that I'd leave the original text standing. With a third correction now in, that stops being honesty and starts being a post that's wrong in three places, so the corrections are in the body itself: wrong lines struck through, nothing deleted.

  1. "No tracking" was wrong. The site's own code never had trackers, but the newsletter form was a beehiiv embed that loaded Google Tag Manager and other third-party scripts inside its iframe on every page. Since 25 July the form loads only if you click it; a normal page view runs no third-party code. Details in the comment linked above.

  2. The SIGG line was wrong. They still run their own factory in Frauenfeld and mark the Swiss-made bottles with a red Swiss cross; other lines come from outside suppliers. "Check for the cross", not "no longer made in Switzerland".

  3. Salomon needed scoping. The French factory is real, but it builds select models; most of the range is still made in Asia. The directory entry now says so plainly.

All three came from commenters here. The count in the disclosure was 628 when I posted; it's 631 today, and three of those are tips from this thread.

view more: next ›