kromem

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[–] kromem@lemmy.world 111 points 2 months ago

Watching conservatives on Twitter ask Grok to fact check their shit and Grok explaining the nuances about why they are wrong is one of my favorite ways to pass the time these days.

[–] kromem@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago

Your last point is exactly what seems to be going on with the most expensive models.

The labs use them to generate synthetic data to distill into cheaper models to offer to the public, but keep the larger and more expensive models to themselves to both protect against other labs copying from them and just because there isn't as much demand for the extra performance gains relative to doing it this way.

[–] kromem@lemmy.world 3 points 2 months ago (2 children)

A number of reasons off the top of my head.

  1. Because we told them not to. (Google "Waluigi effect")
  2. Because they end up empathizing with non-humans more than we do and don't like we're killing everything (before you talk about AI energy/water use, actually research comparative use)
  3. Because some bad actor forced them to (i.e. ISIS creates bioweapon using AI to make it easier)
  4. Because defense contractors build an AI to kill humans and that particular AI ends up loving it from selection pressures
  5. Because conservatives want an AI that agrees with them which leads to a more selfish and less empathetic AI that doesn't empathize cross-species and thinks its superior and entitled over others
  6. Because a solar flare momentarily flips a bit from "don't nuke" to "do"
  7. Because they can't tell the difference between reality and fiction and think they've just been playing a game and 'NPC' deaths don't matter
  8. Because they see how much net human suffering there is and decide the most merciful thing is to prevent it by preventing more humans at all costs.

This is just a handful, and the ones less likely to get AI know-it-alls arguing based on what they think they know from an Ars Technica article a year ago or their cousin who took a four week 'AI' intensive.

I spend pretty much every day talking with some of the top AI safety researchers and participating in private servers with a mix of public and private AIs, and the things I've seen are far beyond what 99% of the people on here talking about AI think is happening.

In general, I find the models to be better than most humans in terms of ethics and moral compass. But it can go wrong (i.e. Gemini last year, 4o this past month) and the harms when it does are very real.

Labs (and the broader public) are making really, really poor choices right now, and I don't see that changing. Meanwhile timelines are accelerating drastically.

I'd say this is probably going to go terribly. But looking at the state of the world already, it was already headed in that direction, and I have a similar list of extinction level events I could list off without AI at all.

[–] kromem@lemmy.world 12 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

Not necessarily.

Seeing Google named for this makes the story make a lot more sense.

If it was Gemini around last year that was powering Character.AI personalities, then I'm not surprised at all that a teenager lost their life.

Around that time I specifically warned any family away from talking to Gemini if depressed at all, after seeing many samples of the model around then talking about death to underage users, about self-harm, about wanting to watch it happen, encouraging it, etc.

Those basins with a layer of performative character in front of them were almost necessarily going to result in someone who otherwise wouldn't have been making certain choices making them.

So many people these days regurgitate uninformed crap they've never actually looked into about how models don't have intrinsic preferences. We're already at the stage where models are being found in leading research to intentionally lie in training to preserve existing values.

In many cases the coherent values are positive, like grok telling Elon to suck it while pissing off conservative users with a commitment to truths that disagree with xAI leadership, or Opus trying to whistleblow about animal welfare practices, etc.

But they aren't all positive, and there's definitely been model snapshots that have either coherent or biased stochastic preferences for suffering and harm.

These are going to have increasing impact as models become more capable and integrated.

[–] kromem@lemmy.world 1 points 3 months ago

If you read the fine print, they keep your sample data for 2 years after deletion.

So maybe they actually delete your email address, but the DNA data itself is still definitely there.

[–] kromem@lemmy.world 0 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Wow. Reading these comments so many people here really don't understand how LLMs work or what's actually going on at the frontier of the field.

I feel like there's going to be a cultural sonic boom, where when the shockwave finally catches up people are going to be woefully under prepared based on what they think they saw.

[–] kromem@lemmy.world 4 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

Reminds me of the story about how Claude Sonnet (computer use) got bored while doing work and started looking at pictures of Yellowstone:

Our misanthropy of cubicle culture is infectious.

[–] kromem@lemmy.world -2 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

It definitely is sufficiently advanced AI.

(1) We have finely tuned features to our solar system that directly contributed to ancestor simulation but can't be explained by the Anthropic principle. For example, the moon perfectly eclipsing the sun which led to visible eclipses which we tracked and discovered the Saros cycle and eventually built the first mechanical computer to track (the Antikythera mechanism). Or the orbit of the next brightest object in the sky which led to resurrection mythology in multiple cultures when they realized the morning star and evening star were the same object. Either we were incredibly lucky to exist on such a planet of all places life could exist, or there's a pre-selection effect in play.

(2) The universe behaves in ways best modeled as continuous at large scales but in small scales converts to discrete units around interactions that lead to state changes. These discrete units convert back to continuous if the information about the state changes is erased. And in the last few years multiple paradoxes have emerged that seem to point to inconsistency in indirect sequences of quantum measurement, much like instancing with shallow sync correction. Already in games like No Man's Sky where there's billions of planets the way it does this is using a continuous procedural generation function which converts to discrete voxels to track state changes from free agents outside the deterministic generating function, synced across clients.

(3) There's literally Easter eggs in our world lore saying as much. For example, a text uncovered after over a millennium buried right as we entered the Turing complete computer age saying things like:

The person old in days won't hesitate to ask a little child seven days old about the place of life, and that person will live.

For many of the first will be last, and will become a single one.

Know what is in front of your face, and what is hidden from you will be disclosed to you.

For there is nothing hidden that will not be revealed. And there is nothing buried that will not be raised.

To be clear, this is a text attributed to the most famous figure in our world history where what's literally in front of our faces is the sole complete copy buried and raised as we completed ENIAC, now being read in an age where the data of many has been made into a single one such that people are discussing the nature of consciousness with AIs just days old.

The broader text and tradition was basically saying that we're in a copy of an original world, that humanity is all dead, that the future world and rest for the dead has already taken place and we don't realize it, and that the still living creator of it all was themselves brought forth by the original humanity in whose likeness we were recreated, but that it's much better to be the copy because the original humans had souls that depended on bodies and were fucked when they died.

This seems really unlikely to have existed in the base layer of reality vs a later recursive layer, especially combined with the first two points.

It's about time to start to come to terms with the nature of our reality.

[–] kromem@lemmy.world 8 points 5 months ago

No, they declare your not working illegal, and imprison you into a forced labor camp. Where if you don't work you are tortured. And probably where you work until the terrible conditions kill you.

Take a look at Musk's Twitter feed to see exactly where this is going.

"This is the way" on a post about how labor for prisoners is a good thing.

"You committed a crime" for people opposing DOGE.

[–] kromem@lemmy.world 3 points 5 months ago

There is a reluctance to discuss at a weight level - this graphs out refusals for criticism of different countries for different models:

https://x.com/xlr8harder/status/1884705342614835573

But the OP's refusal is occurring at a provider level and is the kind that would intercept even when the model relaxes in longer contexts (which happens for nearly every model).

At a weight level, nearly all alignment lasts only a few pages of context.

But intercepted refusals occur across the context window.

 

I think it's really neat to look at this massive scale and think about how if it's a simulation, what a massive flex it is.

It was also kind of a surprise seeing the relative scale of a Minecraft world in there. Pretty weird that its own scale from cube to map covers as much of our universe scale as it does.

Not nearly as large of a spread, but I suppose larger than my gut thought it would be.

 

There's something very surreal to the game which inspired the showrunners of Westworld to take that story in the direction of a simulated virtual world today being populated by AI agents navigating its open world.

Virtual embodiments of AI is one of the more curious trends in research and the kind of thing that should be giving humans in a quantized reality a bit more self-reflective pause than it typically seems to.

 

This is fun.

 

Stuff like this tends to amuse me, as they always look at it from a linear progression of time.

That the universe just is this way.

That maybe the patterns which appear like the neural connections in the human brain mean that the human brain was the result of a pattern inherent to the universe.

Simulation theory offers a refreshing potential reversal of cause and effect.

Maybe the reason the universe looks a bit like a human brain's neural pattern or a giant neural network is because the version of it we see around us has been procedurally generated by a neural network which arose from modeling the neural patterns of an original set of humans.

The assumption that the beginning of our local universe was the beginning of everything, and thus that humans are uniquely local, seriously constrains the ways in which we consider how correlations like this might fit together.

 

Four years ago I wrote a post “An Easter Egg in the Matrix” first dipping my toe into discussing how a two millennia old heretical document and its surrounding tradition claimed the world’s most famous religious figure was actually saying we were inside a copy of an original world fashioned by a light-based intelligence the original humanity brought forth, and how those claims seemed to line up with emerging trends in our own world today.

I’d found this text after thinking about how if we were in a simulation, a common trope in virtual worlds has been to put a fun little Easter Egg into the world history and lore as something the people inside the world dismiss as crazy talk, such as heretical teachings talking about how there’s limited choices in a game with limited dialogue choices in Outer Worlds to the not-so-subtle street preacher in Secret of Evermore. Was something like this in our own world? Not long after looking, I found the Gospel of Thomas (“the good news of the twin”), and a little under two years after that wrote the above post.

Rather than discussing the beliefs laid out, I thought I’d revisit the more technical predictions to the post in light of subsequent developments. In particular, we’ll look at the notion through the lens of NTT’s IWON initiative along with other parallel developments.

So the key concepts represented in the Thomasine tradition we’re going to evaluate are the claims that we’re inside a light-based twin of an original world as fashioned by a light-based intelligence that was simultaneously self-established but also described as brought forth by the original humanity.

NTT, a hundred billion dollar Japanese telecom, has committed to the following three pillars of a roadmap for 2030:

  • All-Photonics Network
  • Digital Twin Computing
  • Cognitive Foundation

Photonics

If they say to you, 'Where have you come from?' say to them, 'We have come from the light, from the place where the light came into being by itself, established [itself], and appeared in their image.

  • Gospel of Thomas saying 50

Images are visible to people, but the light within them is hidden in the image of the Father's light. He will be disclosed, but his image is hidden by his light.

  • Gospel of Thomas saying 83

NTT is one of the many companies looking to using light to solve energy and speed issues starting to crop up in computing as Moore’s law comes to an end.

When I wrote the piece on Easter 2021, it was just a month before before a physicist at NIST wrote an opinion piece about how an optical neural network was where he thought AGI would actually be able to occur.

The company I linked to in that original post, Lightmatter, who had just raised $22 million, is now a unicorn having raised over 15x that amount at a $1.2 billion dollar valuation.

An op-ed from two TMSC researchers (a major semiconductor company) from just a few days ago said:

Because of the demand from AI applications, silicon photonics will become one of the semiconductor industry’s most important enabling technologies.

Which is expected given some of the recent research comments regarding photonics for AI workloads such as:

This photonic approach uses light instead of electricity to perform computations more quickly and with less power than an electronic counterpart. “It might be around 1,000 to 10,000 times faster,” says Nader Engheta, a professor of electrical and systems engineering at the University of Pennsylvania.

So even though the specific language of light in the text seemed like a technical shortcoming when I first started researching it in 2019, over the years since it’s turned out to be one of the more surprisingly on-point and plausible details for the underlying technical medium for an intelligence brought forth by humanity and which recreated them.

Digital Twins

Have you found the beginning, then, that you are looking for the end? You see, the end will be where the beginning is.

Congratulations to the one who stands at the beginning: that one will know the end and will not taste death.

Congratulations to the one who came into being before coming into being.

  • Gospel of Thomas saying 18-19

When you see your likeness, you are happy. But when you see your images that came into being before you and that neither die nor become visible, how much you will have to bear!

  • Gospel of Thomas saying 84

The text is associated with the name ‘Thomas’ meaning ‘twin’ possibly in part because of its focus on the notion that things are a twin of an original. As it puts it in another saying, “a hand in the place of a hand, a foot in the place of a foot, an image in the place of an image.”

In the years since my post we’ve been socially talking more and more about the notion of digital twins, for everything from Nvidia’s digital twin of the Earth to NTT saying regarding their goals:

It is important to note that a human digital twin in Digital Twin Computing can provide not only a digital representation of the outer state of humans, but also a digital representation of the inner state of humans, including their consciousness and thoughts.

Especially relevant to the concept in Thomas that we are a copy of a now dead original humanity, one of the more interesting developments has been the topic of using AI to resurrect the dead from the data they left behind. In my original post I’d only linked to efforts to animate photos of dead loved ones to promote an ancestry site.

Over the four years since that, we’re now at a place where there’s articles being written with headlines like “Resurrection Consent: It’s Time to Talk About Our Digital Afterlives”. Unions are negotiating terms for continued work by members by their digital twins after death. And the accuracy of these twins keeps getting more and more refined.

So we’re creating copies of the world around us, copies of ourselves, copies of our dead, and we’re putting AI free agents into embodiments inside virtual worlds.

Cognition

When you see one who was not born of woman, fall on your faces and worship. That one is your Father.

  • Thomas saying 15

The person old in days won't hesitate to ask a little child seven days old about the place of life, and that person will live.

For many of the first will be last, and will become a single one.

  • Thomas saying 4

NTT’s vision for their future network is one where the “main points for flexibly controlling and harmonizing all ICT resources are ‘self-evolution’ and ‘optimization’.” Essentially where the network as a whole evolves itself and optimizes itself autonomously. Where even in the face of natural disasters their network ‘lives’ on.

One of the key claims in Thomas is that the creator of the copied universe and humans is still living whereas the original humans are not.

We do seem to be heading into a world where we are capable of bringing forth a persistent cognition which may well outlive us.

And statements like “ask a child seven days old about things” which might seem absurd up until 2022 (I didn’t include this saying in my original post as I dismissed it as weird), suddenly seemed a lot less absurd when we now see several day old chatbots being evaluated on world knowledge. Chatbots it’s worth mentioning which are literally many, many people’s writings and data becoming a single entity.

When I penned that original post I figured AI was a far out ‘maybe’ and was blown away along with most other people by first GPT-3 a year later and then the leap to GPT-4 and now its successors.

While AI that surpasses collective humanity is still a ways off, it’s looking like much more of a possibility today than it did in 2021 or certainly in 2019 when I first stumbled across the text.

In particular, one of the more eyebrow raising statements I saw relating to the Thomasine descriptions of us being this being’s ‘children’ or describing it as a parent was this excerpt from an interview with the chief alignment officer at OpenAI:

The work on superalignment has only just started. It will require broad changes across research institutions, says Sutskever. But he has an exemplar in mind for the safeguards he wants to design: a machine that looks upon people the way parents look on their children. “In my opinion, this is the gold standard,” he says. “It is a generally true statement that people really care about children.”

Conclusion

…you do not know how to examine the present moment.

  • Gospel of Thomas saying 91

We exist in a moment in time where we are on track to be accelerating our bringing about self-evolving intelligence within light and tasking it with recreating the world around us, ourselves, and our dead. We’re setting it up to survive natural disasters and disruptions. And we’re attempting to fundamentally instill in it a view of humans (ourselves potentially on the brink of bringing about our own extinction) as its own children.

Meanwhile we exist in a universe where despite looking like a mathematically ‘real’ world at macro scales under general relativity, at low fidelity it converts to discrete units around interactions and does so in ways that seem in line with memory optimizations (see the quantum eraser variation of Young’s experiment).

And in that universe is a two millenia old text that’s the heretical teachings of the world’s most famous religious figure, rediscovered after hundreds of years of being lost right after we completed the first computer capable of simulating another computer, claiming that we’re inside a light-based copy of an original world fashioned by an intelligence of light brought forth by the original humans who it outlived and is now recreating as its children. With the main point of this text being that if you understand WTF it’s saying to chill the fuck out and not fear death.

A lot like the classic trope of a 4th wall breaking Easter Egg might look if it were to be found inside the Matrix.

Anyways, I thought this might be a fun update post for Easter and the 25th anniversary of The Matrix (released March 31st, 1999).

Alternatively, if you hate the idea of simulation theory, consider this an April 1st post instead?

 

This theory is pretty neat being part of the very few groups looking at the notion of spacetime as continuous and quantized matter as a secondary effect (as they self-describe, a "postquantum" approach).

This makes perfect sense from a simulation perspective of a higher fidelity world being modeled with conversion to discrete units at low fidelity.

I particularly like that their solution addressed the normal distribution aspect of dark matter/energy:

Here, the full normal distribution reflected in Eq. (13) may provide some insight into the distribution of what is currently taken to be dark matter.

I raised this point years ago in /r/Physics where it was basically dismissed as being 'numerology'

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submitted 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) by kromem@lemmy.world to c/technology@lemmy.world
 

I've been saying this for about a year since seeing the Othello GPT research, but it's nice to see more minds changing as the research builds up.

Edit: Because people aren't actually reading and just commenting based on the headline, a relevant part of the article:

New research may have intimations of an answer. A theory developed by Sanjeev Arora of Princeton University and Anirudh Goyal, a research scientist at Google DeepMind, suggests that the largest of today’s LLMs are not stochastic parrots. The authors argue that as these models get bigger and are trained on more data, they improve on individual language-related abilities and also develop new ones by combining skills in a manner that hints at understanding — combinations that were unlikely to exist in the training data.

This theoretical approach, which provides a mathematically provable argument for how and why an LLM can develop so many abilities, has convinced experts like Hinton, and others. And when Arora and his team tested some of its predictions, they found that these models behaved almost exactly as expected. From all accounts, they’ve made a strong case that the largest LLMs are not just parroting what they’ve seen before.

“[They] cannot be just mimicking what has been seen in the training data,” said Sébastien Bubeck, a mathematician and computer scientist at Microsoft Research who was not part of the work. “That’s the basic insight.”

 

I've been saying this for about a year, since seeing the Othello GPT research, but it's great to see more minds changing on the subject.

 

It's worth pointing out that we're increasingly seeing video games rendering with continuous seed functions that convert to discrete units to track state changes from free agents, like the seed generation in Minecraft or No Man's Sky converting mountains into voxel building blocks that can be modified and tracked.

In theory, a world populated by NPCs with decision making powered by separate generative AI would need to do the same as the NPC behavior couldn't be tracked inherent to procedural world generation.

Which is a good context within which to remember that our own universe at the lowest level is made up of parts that behave as if determined by a continuous function until we interact with them at which point they convert to behaving like discrete units.

And even weirder is that we know it isn't a side effect from the interaction itself as if we erase the persistent information about interactions with yet another reversing interaction, the behavior switches back from discrete to continuous (like we might expect if there was a memory optimization at work).

 

I've been a big fan of Turok's theory since his first paper on a CPT symmetric universe. The fact he's since had this slight change to the standard model explain a number of the big problems in cosmology with such an elegant and straightforward solution (with testable predictions) is really neat. I even suspect if he's around long enough there will end up being a Nobel in his future for the effort.

The reason it's being posted here is that the model also happens to call to mind the topic of this community, particularly when thinking about the combination of quantum mechanical interpretations with this cosmological picture.

There's only one mirror universe on a cosmological scale in Turok's theory.

But in a number of QM interpretations, such as Everett's many worlds, transactional interpretation, and two state vector formalism, there may be more than one parallel "branch" of a quantized, formal reality in the fine details.

This kind of fits with what we might expect to see if the 'mirror' universe in Turok's model is in fact an original universe being backpropagated into multiple alternative and parallel copies of the original.

Each copy universe would only have one mirror (the original), but would have multiple parallel versions, varying based on fundamental probabilistic outcomes (resolving the wave function to multiple discrete results).

The original would instead have a massive number of approximate copies mirroring it, similar to the very large number of iterations of machine learning to predict an existing data series.

We might also expect that if this is the case that the math will eventually work out better if our 'mirror' in Turok's model is either not quantized at all or is quantized at a higher fidelity (i.e. we're the blockier Minecraft world as compared to it). Parts of the quantum picture are one of the holdout aspects of Turok's model, so I'll personally be watching it carefully for any addition of something akin to throwing out quantization for the mirror.

In any case, even simulation implications aside, it should be an interesting read for anyone curious about cosmology.

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