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(lemmy.world)
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this post was submitted on 24 May 2024
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If the race is neck and neck, and you vote for Micky mouse because you wanna feel superior to everyone around you, all you've done is make things worse.
Depending on your location, you may have directly helped trump.
a vote for mickey mouse doesn't help trump. only a vote for trump helps trump.
Wrong. In some cases, if your district is competitive, and you've decided to vote for not-trump, if you vote for anyone but the other competitive candidate (in this case Biden), you allow trump to pull ahead due to first past the post voting.
Edit: hypothetically if only 4 people vote,
2 for trump 1 for Biden 1 for mickey
Trump wins.
Edit edit or more compelling...
5 total voters.
2 for trump 1 for Biden 1 for Mickey and one abstains
Trump wins. If the mickey and the abstain voters don't want trump, their best action was to vote for Biden, as that would have achieved:
2 for trump 3 for Biden 0 for mickey.
Biden wins.
You're already moving the goalposts.
Bullshit. All conditions I just laid out, were declared in my above comment. Including location dependence.
Edit because you seem to need help... The location dependence I'm referring to is that you need to be in a sufficiently competitive location for that clause to be relevant.
you said a vote for anyone but Biden is a vote for trump. you're backing away from that now, softening the claim to say it "allows him to pull ahead". I'm just trying to keep the rhetoric honest.
Quote me punk or delete your comment
anyone can read this thread.
Except you. Scurry off in your lying shame
Edit to be clear
I was always clear that the act of voting for 3rd party/ spoiler candidates can result in a situation where trump pulls ahead by your vote's absence. I never said it was a literal vote for trump.
This is basic decision making and it's very concerning you can't grasp it.
you said it helps trump, but only a vote for trump helps trump. you're spreading election misinformation. if it takes this much nuance to try (and still fail) to make your claims true, try just being intellectually honest.
I understand the story you're telling about fptp, and I am telling you it's a myth. the fact that you are passing along this received wisdom with so little scrutiny speaks volumes about your own critical thinking skills. to land on an appeal to ridicule as your coup de grace is just the finishing touch one might expect.
You're obviously just baiting, but for readers on, I'll post this hyper simplified situation I commented already.
5 total voters.
2 for trump 1 for Biden 1 for Mickey and 1 abstains
Trump wins.
If the mickey and the abstain voters don't want trump, their best action was to vote for Biden, as that would have achieved:
2 for trump 3 for Biden 0 for mickey.
Biden wins.
In competitive locations, votes are a scarce resource.
By not voting for Biden, you have helped trump, and not achieved your own voting goal all the while. You never voted for trump, but your actions aided his victory.
only a vote for trump helps trump, no matter how long you make your favorite bedtime story
Just repeating it and sticking your head in the sand doesn't make it so.
If you feel capable of refuting the point, lay out any example you can provide, that meets my original premise. Edit I provided a clear simple case to discuss the situation, which you haven't been able to refute.
(Edit: For clarity), I acknowledge many places in the US are NOT competitive, thus the scarce vote concept is much less relevant. Location was always in my comments, so that is not a goalpost move.
how can I refuted a fiction, except by saying "you made that up"?
If you can't meet a toy case, you aren't ready to discuss the real world.
no more dismissal is needed: your stories are fictions.
Obviously. It's obviously a toy case to illustrate a point. You think I'm actually stating there are only 5 people voting?
I think you haven't told a true story yet.
Ok Dr strange.
There are 2 competitive candidates for president. One of them WILL be president.
How you get there is a mix of direct and indirect actions. You do not seem able to grasp or refute that indirect actions can have an influence on the frontrunners.
That's on you.
you're inability to tell the truth plainly and without hyperbole or fallacy has resulted in you spreading election misinformation. all I've done here is try to keep the rhetoric honest
So not yet. No worries
this seems like pretty obvious trolling at this point
I stated my case, defended it, and provided conversational example of the position.
You deployed the "le redditor" debate club starter kit and now cry going foul. You even tried to directly misquote me and got called out.
Oopsie, sorry you bungled this.
this mischaracterization of the facts serves only to protect your ego. anyone who reads this thread will know exactly what happened.
We are reading it, we agree with the other guy. You're wrong and also appear arguing in bad faith or with the least possible effort.
If by inaction or dumb action you get the candidate elected that you least support, you have helped said candidate into office. You had the power to choose, and from their perspective you helped them. You can argue that by not supporting a candidate that's all you did, but the pyrrhic "victory" here is just moving the reference frame. Voting is teleological yo: why you did what you did doesn't matter, only the outcome does.
Lol and they are already voting accordingly.
Not sure what was deleted here cause mod notes don't include the referenced comment.
Anyway, you haven't done that, you've simply tried to make up lies by misquoting me, then intentionally not addressing the content of my comment.
That does not say "a vote for anyone but Biden is a vote for trump".... There are explicit conditionals that you're ignoring lol
Calm down. I'm in California. My vote doesn't count.
Go cry to the 65 million that don't vote at all.
This is a thread with you in it, not a broadcast to all possible non voters.
Are you the politics police?
No but I'll happily call out people manipulating context to maliciously try to deflect and derail.
Your anti Biden campaign is what counts here because a) we are all here and b) every voter who reads it is not in California. You want to hate Biden that's totally fine and cool, but leave this hypocritical shit at home. You are an anti Biden loudspeaker around here, not an anti trump voice who likes Biden less.
Most of us see your posts and roll our eyes, but if you sour 10 minds to Biden and your vote doesn't count, who are you helping? Not the non voters, not the voters who feel like you just posted (of which I am one), just the red hat brigade.
If you want to be for trump then do it, if you want to hate Biden do it, but you're yanking our dicks around here and I for one don't like it. Do what you want, but expect this kind of response from the community to keep worsening; not that a downvote ever hurt anybody.
Continue to downvoted but also fight back for Biden. Start posting some positive articles and listing his policies and accomplishments. Better yet, sign up to volunteer for the Biden campaign. Phone calls, texts, canvassing, etc. I tried to find the volunteer sign up on Biden's website but I don't see one though so maybe he doesn't care about volunteers.
As I rule I don't post because I get too sucked into it instead of, you know, being a good dad lol. Yes I also have not found a Biden volunteer option besides cold calling, so I walk for my state rep in my down time instead.