this post was submitted on 06 Nov 2024
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On the bright side the democrats lost
Average ml user
As long as I'm not confused for the subhuman filth that calls themselves progressive but spit on burning children because their skin is brown.
If you live in the US, and are left leaning (by international, no US standards) then I'm really not sure how this logic tracks.
You're happy the racist got elected? The one who said Israel must “finish the problem”.
Yeah, what a win for Palestine đź‘Ť
And what a win for the world on climate. Woooowee
You just lived through a presidency that opened more land to private drilling than ever before in history.
From the man more responsible than anyone else alive for the modern mechanisms of white supremacy in effect today. (IT WAS A DEBATE! HAHAHA!)
Who have without restraint, limit or condition, allowed the genocide in Gaza to proceed with an intensity determined fully by the nazis doing the killing on the ground. Reserving no expense or material when they run low.
To invoke these things in service of your case is the rank cynicism of a fascist. Do you know the Sartre quote? How fascists can just bullshit with what they say because they feel no need to tether it to real life or anything they previously said? This election turned you into that fascist. Good job.
Firstly, I'm not in the US. Secondly, while I think the democrats are right-wing dipshits who's climate action is way too little, it is at least barely something.
Trump is actively against any climate action whatsoever.
The democrats (the people in control, not lovely people like Bernie Sanders), have enabled Israel. But they can be somewhat, barely, reasoned with.
Trump is actively wants Palestinians dead.
This choice was 100% a case of lesser of two evils, and the US chose the greater.
You calling me a fascist is bizarre when you are happy Trump won over Kamala. (Again, not from the US, and I think everything there is super, duper right wing from my point of view)
I feel justified in commenting, because the US holds so much power over the rest of the world.
You must live on a different planet than I do because everything you said can be observed to be completely wrong in just the last four years.
They gave Elon Musk subsidies in exchange for opening more oil fields to exploitation than ever before in the country. Why am I finding myself repeating this? Is this fact in dispute or something? Can I sway you with citation?
https://www.vox.com/climate/24098983/biden-oil-production-climate-fossil-fuel-renewables
You can't say that you're moving 'at least a little' in a positive direction when the reality is that we're further in the wrong direction than we ever have been!
They fucking threw away one of their two 'must win' swing states because they COULDN'T be reasoned with!! Why can't you see what the democrats are when they shove it in your face over and over again?? Again and again I see you liberals coming back with the most mind melting argument ever: "we can sway them when they don't need us." Is that how it went when a group of children begged for their fucking lives in front of Nanci Pelosi on the topic of climate change and she laughed them out of her office??
The electoral system is a calculated dead end for social progress. It is designed to defeat you. I don't know how many more times you need it demonstrated before you finally look for actual solutions.
Who the fuck said that? Do you need me to add the caveat that I'd be calling you a fascist if you supported Trump? Why? Am I being fucking obtuse with the fact that I'm criticizing you from the left or are you just deliberately trying to antagonize me? I'm calling you a nazi because you support the perpetrators of a fucking genocide. There's no more valid reason to use the name. Why are you acting like I'm happy Trump won? Because you're fucking petty and need a comeback? Fucking childish.
I will edit this comment later because I'm about to hop on my bike. Please recall you called me a fascist first, and in my opinion, very unreasonably.
This is why I'm saying you're happy Trump won. This is functionally the same, because of first past the post voting system.
So, I will get back to your strange comments calling me a fascist because I dare be sad the democrats lost over Trump (if you're not, yeah, as a leftist, that's weird. When the choice is pretty right, and far right. There's only one logical choice).
I live in Australia, where at least I have preferential voting (unfortunately single member electorates, which trends towards two parties), but if you live in the US, there was only one rational choice as a leftist, and it was the bloody democrats.
Just have to get home from work, so hang tight.
copied and pasted from my last comment because I have zero remorse or sympathy so don't fucking complain to me about it. You're a fucking nazi and I'll continue saying it until you fucking recant.
End of fucking story. I don't want to hear you fucking raise this as a complaint again. You ARE a fucking nazi. Stop it.
Again and again you fucking fascists keep fucking lying about the democratic party being any different from the republicans. "pretty right" is committing a genocide. You're fucking delusional. Don't you see that? Don't you have any dissonance from advocating for real life fucking nazis in the peak of their crazed bloodthirst and turning around with a cynical fucking smirk and calling them anything but monsters? Of course not. You're a fucking nazi and words are just there for you to play with. You have no connection to the truth or to morality at all.
Yikes, I hope the weather is good there up on your moral high horse, where everyone who is a realist is a Nazi, where you prefer to do nothing over voting against a clearly worse candidate.
Calling Republican and Democratic policies the exact same is delusion.
I do not like or support the Democrats. They are supporting genocide in the middle east. No doubt about that.
I just think people, such as yourself, are deluded if you think not voting against Trump is somehow a logical decision, and makes you smart or morally superior. I hold those who had the chance to act to prevent Trump getting into power responsible for whatever more fucked up shit he does compared to the Democrats.
Again, luckily in my country, I don't need to tactically vote, but the people in the US do.
If they don't, they get Trump.
The actual Nazis are the ones who scapegoat groups of people as the cause of economic woes, crack down on "different" people, punish their political enemies, and make it even harder to vote them out. You can bet you ass that's going to become more now under this next administration.
You made the hard decisions that had to be made, huh? You did what needed to be done, right? You didn't have the luxury of morality, did ya?
I didn't make any decision at all, since I don't vote in US elections. But yeah, this is the trolley problem, and most people agree doing nothing to switch the track to the fewer people being affected is the worse option.
If you can point to an area where Kamala and the Democrats could be viewed as overall worse than Trump in a leftist's point of view, by all means, do tell.
If not, you're saying standing there and not switching the lever makes you righteous.
Which, in my opinion, is a stupid take.
Calling someon a Nazi for advocating pulling the lever, is an even more stupid take. You're high on your own righteousness.
Every time you confront someone on the right for the morality of their decisions they turn around and attack you for morality, casting it as a vice.
I don't think that's germane to the argument but I'll bite because there are plenty of examples. They deported as many migrants and asylum seekers as Trump did in their first two years in office. They were more aggressive building the wall than Trump was. They did more austerity than him. They did more carbon extraction.
You gave material support to someone committing a genocide. I care that words mean things.
So, along with continuing the genocide, hell, even advocating for it to be done quicker with Trump's beach resort comments, the US is literally overtly more fascist now (instead of just an unjust capitalist hellscape).
https://lemmy.world/post/31482689
This is what pisses me off about high horse moralising. The righteous are so concerned with being righteous, they would prefer do nothing to mitigate the worst, if it means getting their hands dirty and voting for people they also despise, even if they're the better option to the worst option.
How exactly is having an despot in power going to help the leftist cause? They (not the democrats in large part, the people) are scrambling to react to Trump and the Republicans rapid fire undermining rule of law.
Sure, under the democrats it's business as usual of capitalist exploitation, but at least you wouldn't have the president literally directing federal officers to target cities with kidnappings as political reprisal.
I'm not advocating for voting for the democrats forever, but until you stand a reasonable chance of electing someone who will implement voting reform.
Am I advocating for voting against Bernie Sanders, even though he's technically an independent, and not a Democrat? No. Am I advocating for voting for the democrats in a very safe seat? No.
But Christ on a bike, if you live in an electorate that's on the knife's edge and can't dirty yourself with accepting the awful voting system for what it is, and voting against the worst outcome, then there is no reasoning with you because you don't understand the spoiler effect.
Voting reform is the first thing leftists in the US need to get implemented. Above everything else, literally. You have some states even outlawing ranked choice voting, because they correctly identify it as a threat to their stranglehold on power.
While the US is going to hell in a hand basket, our voting system (in Australia) means the socialist party can expand outside just Victoria. It's still a small party, that's what decades of eroding unionism, the Labor party losing it's way, and living under capitalism has done, but there are little electoral barriers against them making gains (beyond obscurity and incumbent's advantage). Our Overton window is shifting left. Our conservative and country parties (the Liberal and National parties) are further left than your Democrats.
Your Overton window is ratcheting further and further to the right, and at accelerating speeds partially BECAUSE Trump and the Republicans get back in power.
Do you really think the US electoral system is going to be left in a better position to be reformed after all this?
I reckon the US has pushed electoral reform at least a decade down the line, if not more. Everyone will be so concerned with "righting the ship" they won't meaningfully change the system. Not unless it gets so bad you have some sort of revolution and seizure of power, and that's not exactly a recipe for stability and actual democracy.
Anyway, I just came back to gloat (morbidly), but hopefully get through to you that bring righteous isn't helping anyone.
I am still sad that Trump won over Kamala. We in the provinces need to live with it too, since the US is the preeminent imperialist power.
So, if you live in a competitive electorate, as a leftist you had better bloody vote for the most likely candidate to unseat Republicans at the mid-terms, and in the meantime organise like hell to have a chance of unseating both the Republicans and democrats WHEN ELECTORALLY POSSIBLE.
You can put your fingers in your ears, but it won't change what your voting system is.
Christ.
Hey idiot. You're replying to a post from 7 months ago and you're too stupid to edit yourself to a length that won't just be skimmed.
Pick two things you want me to reply to and have no more than three sentences each.
If spit is the only water we have, we'll put out the fire with spit.
Average liberal
Completely unconcerned with the fact that you're the one murdering children by the hundreds of thousands
I just came up with a clever retort