this post was submitted on 23 Jun 2025
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Image is of the damage caused by an Iranian Kheibar Shekan ballistic missile in Israel, causing dozens of injuries.


Now in our second week of the conflict, we have seen continuing damage to both Israel and Iran, as well as direct US intervention which nonetheless seems to have caused limited damage to Fordow and little damage to Iran's nuclear program. Regime change seems more elusive than ever, as even Iranians previously critical of the government now rally around it as they are attacked by two rabid imperialists at once. And Iran's government is tentatively considering a withdrawal, or at minimum a reconsideration, of their membership to the IAEA and the NPT. And, of course, the Strait of Hormuz is still a tool in their arsenal.

A day or so on from the strike on Fordow, we have so far seen basically no change in strategy from the Iranian military as they continue to strike Israel with small barrages of missiles. Military analysts argue furiously - is this a deliberate strategy of steady attrition on Israel, or indicative of immense material constraints on Iran? Are the hits by Israel on real targets, or are they decoys? Does Iran wish to develop a nuke, or are they still hesitating? Will Iran and Yemen strike at US warships and bases in response to the attack, or will they merely continue striking only Israel?

And perhaps most importantly - will this conflict end diplomatically due to a lack of appetite for an extended war (to wit: not a peace but a 20 year armistice) or with Israel forced into major concessions including an end to their genocide? Or even with a total military/societal collapse of either side?


Last week's thread is here. The Imperialism Reading Group is here.

Please check out the RedAtlas!

The bulletins site is here. Currently not used.
The RSS feed is here. Also currently not used.

Israel-Palestine Conflict

If you have evidence of Israeli crimes and atrocities that you wish to preserve, there is a thread here in which to do so.

Sources on the fighting in Palestine against Israel. In general, CW for footage of battles, explosions, dead people, and so on:

UNRWA reports on Israel's destruction and siege of Gaza and the West Bank.

English-language Palestinian Marxist-Leninist twitter account. Alt here.
English-language twitter account that collates news.
Arab-language twitter account with videos and images of fighting.
English-language (with some Arab retweets) Twitter account based in Lebanon. - Telegram is @IbnRiad.
English-language Palestinian Twitter account which reports on news from the Resistance Axis. - Telegram is @EyesOnSouth.
English-language Twitter account in the same group as the previous two. - Telegram here.

English-language PalestineResist telegram channel.
More telegram channels here for those interested.

Russia-Ukraine Conflict

Examples of Ukrainian Nazis and fascists
Examples of racism/euro-centrism during the Russia-Ukraine conflict

Sources:

Defense Politics Asia's youtube channel and their map. Their youtube channel has substantially diminished in quality but the map is still useful.
Moon of Alabama, which tends to have interesting analysis. Avoid the comment section.
Understanding War and the Saker: reactionary sources that have occasional insights on the war.
Alexander Mercouris, who does daily videos on the conflict. While he is a reactionary and surrounds himself with likeminded people, his daily update videos are relatively brainworm-free and good if you don't want to follow Russian telegram channels to get news. He also co-hosts The Duran, which is more explicitly conservative, racist, sexist, transphobic, anti-communist, etc when guests are invited on, but is just about tolerable when it's just the two of them if you want a little more analysis.
Simplicius, who publishes on Substack. Like others, his political analysis should be soundly ignored, but his knowledge of weaponry and military strategy is generally quite good.
On the ground: Patrick Lancaster, an independent and very good journalist reporting in the warzone on the separatists' side.

Unedited videos of Russian/Ukrainian press conferences and speeches.

Pro-Russian Telegram Channels:

Again, CW for anti-LGBT and racist, sexist, etc speech, as well as combat footage.

https://t.me/aleksandr_skif ~ DPR's former Defense Minister and Colonel in the DPR's forces. Russian language.
https://t.me/Slavyangrad ~ A few different pro-Russian people gather frequent content for this channel (~100 posts per day), some socialist, but all socially reactionary. If you can only tolerate using one Russian telegram channel, I would recommend this one.
https://t.me/s/levigodman ~ Does daily update posts.
https://t.me/patricklancasternewstoday ~ Patrick Lancaster's telegram channel.
https://t.me/gonzowarr ~ A big Russian commentator.
https://t.me/rybar ~ One of, if not the, biggest Russian telegram channels focussing on the war out there. Actually quite balanced, maybe even pessimistic about Russia. Produces interesting and useful maps.
https://t.me/epoddubny ~ Russian language.
https://t.me/boris_rozhin ~ Russian language.
https://t.me/mod_russia_en ~ Russian Ministry of Defense. Does daily, if rather bland updates on the number of Ukrainians killed, etc. The figures appear to be approximately accurate; if you want, reduce all numbers by 25% as a 'propaganda tax', if you don't believe them. Does not cover everything, for obvious reasons, and virtually never details Russian losses.
https://t.me/UkraineHumanRightsAbuses ~ Pro-Russian, documents abuses that Ukraine commits.

Pro-Ukraine Telegram Channels:

Almost every Western media outlet.
https://discord.gg/projectowl ~ Pro-Ukrainian OSINT Discord.
https://t.me/ice_inii ~ Alleged Ukrainian account with a rather cynical take on the entire thing.


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[–] MarmiteLover123@hexbear.net 58 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago) (5 children)

Looks like Iran fired off a bunch of old Qiam missiles (SCUD C derivatives) at the US military base Qatar. I honestly thought these missiles were out of service, which is why I didn't include them in my previous post . 14 missiles for the 14 GBU-57 bombs dropped on the nuclear facilities, a very symbolic attack/response/retaliation. The old missiles with no capability to maneuver, fired at a single target in a country with over a dozen Patriot batteries (11 Qatari batteries and multiple US military batteries) explain the high interception rate. Again, a very lobsided exchange in favour of the USA, like 2020. Honestly it's an even weaker response than Iran's 2020 response to the assassination of Qassem Soleimani, which at least made use of the more modern missiles alongside the Qiam, and did some serious damage, assuming that there are no more US or Iranian responses.

[–] sewer_rat_420@hexbear.net 27 points 3 days ago (1 children)

They have provided the easiest offramp for the USA. Hopefully they will take it, hopefully Trump takes this as a win, and Iran can continue to pummel the entity unfettered.

Unfortunately I don't see this being the end though. To many bloodthirsty fiends in Washington

I don't think isntreal can handle getting a rocket barrage every day. The entire settler project hinges on the myth of invincibility. The zionist entity is very important to the amerikan entity.

[–] DornerStan@lemmygrad.ml 23 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Using old, otherwise useless stock to send a message as cheaply as possible?

[–] LoveWitch@hexbear.net 13 points 3 days ago

Being easy to intercept is a message within the message

[–] companero@hexbear.net 13 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago) (2 children)

It seems like the vast majority of Iran's modern missiles are trapped inside the underground missile bases. Israel is going to keep up their air campaign for the foreseeable future to maintain that status quo.

I don't really see a good solution for Iran unless there are some secret cards they have yet to play. What they need is to be flooded with modern air defenses like Ukraine was. With no ground invasion component, Israel would be forced to stop. But neither Russia nor China seem willing or able to do that.

[–] geikei@hexbear.net 7 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Ukraine was doing everything they could to become a western client state and get into every western alliance and militray program they could. It was and is on its knees constantly begging for air defenses and alliences and a billion US troops on its ground. It had a hundreds of soviet Air defense systems already and it was training and intergrating with western systems for a decade. What has Iran actualy done regarding its relations and approachment with China.

There have been a bunch of comments showing how it was dragging its feet in closer military and economic ties with China, due to the reformists looking with one eye west yes but also because they didnt want to be under Russian or Chinese influence and a junior partner to such a relation. Its a big boy country that made its own choices and other powers will act also based on Iranian willingness, actions and what it asks for, what it accepts and has to offer. I made a longer comment here https://hexbear.net/comment/6248893 .

Beyond that and as far as military supplies go, its a question of what systems and how and if they can even be used. China running in to now give modern air defenses and aircrafts is unrealistic for multiple reasons. They would be useless to iranians without extensive months long training and a complicated intergrated ecosystem they operate under. Also with the degree of mossad penetration and Israel depth of opperations and the US joining in the chances these would fall into their hands are pretty high and at this stage of the game its something China wouldnt want. Giving Iran long range rockets and missiles (also launchers cause other wise its useless) isnt impossible but China's rocket force is one of its greatest focuses given their needs and Taiwan and US placement in the pacific. Giving them in any large scale to Iran would have an impact in their magazine. Also they dont wanna speed up a Taiwan crisis by making sure US goes unhinged in the equipment and military stuff they send to Taiwan, where the US is still afraid to do any big moves. Drones, drone parts, electronics and material to build weapons are already sourced from China by iran in a large degree and we have no idea if they are picking up and it wouldnt be surprising if they are. Normal Ground war millitary stuff Iran doesnt even need as of now and if they do we will see if and what they source from China.

[–] SevenSkalls@hexbear.net 2 points 3 days ago

If China sent personnel over to operate them it would negate the need for training. It would also be an even ezchnage considering the US is helping Israel in the same way, so I don't think anyone could even be mad (although they would be anyway because no one else is allowed to play by the US and Israel's rules). It would also give their people some in the field training with their new tech, like the North Koreans were getting in Ukraine. I think it's still a good idea, although I doubt China will do it.

[–] darkcalling@hexbear.net 5 points 3 days ago

Yeah there seems a good chance they just keep up this air war forever. Start an insurgency (reports of weapons flowing over their borders already), do the Syria thing but faster and harder with ethnic minorities, ISIS recruits from abroad, Ukrainian SBU, etc and start going around tearing apart the country. The zionists using their air power to support the proxy forces and take out and hamper Iranian counter-attacks and eventually maybe it takes a year, maybe it takes 5, maybe 8 but Iran is in disarray and no longer capable of projecting power, being relevant to BRICS+ or the belt and road (no control of its own infrastructure, they'll definitely blow up that Chinese rail link) and at that point it's total control of the region by the US and total encirclement of China and another dagger at Russia's belly. Likely they slate pushing their own extremists through the region up through the Iran/Caspian sea region (Azerbaijan is a NATO/zionist puppet) to start doing terrorism and destabilizing Russia sometime in the 2030s, they then kick off war with China, sanctions, embargo, decoupling all in one as they occupy Russia with a distraction internally giving them primacy to make their move against China alone and buying them a few months of time in which to operate. They may kick off the Russia thing later than that though but it too is slated for a pressure campaign and break-up so that the US may rule the world. PNAC is so obviously telegraphed in many ways.

Yet China seems to believe the trap is being drawn into conflict with the west now before they've set up all the pieces. I hope they see a lot more than I do because from where I sit it does seem like they are humming a song while the west builds its forces and sets up the chessboard in a perfect condition for their victory or at least maximum pain for China to win.

[–] Torenico@hexbear.net 10 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Scuds being fired against US targets? What is this, 1991?

[–] MarmiteLover123@hexbear.net 9 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago)

The Patriots managed to intercept the SCUDs this time, so that's a change of pace. Only took what, 20+ years to figure out (PAC 3 MSE entered service in 2014).

[–] Evilphd666@hexbear.net 7 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Probably doing a probing to see hoe they would respond / what kind of counter measures.

[–] PorkrollPosadist@hexbear.net 10 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago)

It makes little sense to do a probing attack on a base that they just emptied out and rolled the red carpet out for you to bomb. If they're deliberately allowing you to attack it, they are not going to reveal much about their defenses, they are going to just let the missile hit, or use it as an opportunity for target practice. It does not reflect routine conditions. Also, if you aren't planning a much bigger move in the near future, the intel gathered will be stale by the time it is needed. Resources get moved around, some get replenished while others become scarce, weapon systems get moved around, readiness and rules of engagement change.