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I was recently reminded how much I fucking hate Plato's Republic (media.piefed.social)

submitted 5 days ago by PugJesus@piefed.social to c/historymemes@piefed.social

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[–] Ougie@lemmy.world 0 points 4 days ago (1 children)

Ok this may be what is written on paper but the major difference - if I may state the obvious here - is that NK is a dictatorship. You have the fat guy on top of everything being worshipped as a god. His dad was before him and someone else from the family will be after, if the people don't wake up in the meantime. If you're learning about Plato from chatgpt or something you will see terms like philosopher kings etc which sound weird and may give off the wrong impression. To understand the concept you need to keep in mind what the world looked like back then. Also I understand that we now live in an era where philosophy is not appreciated as much as it was back then, the very term has been corroded by the capitalist ideas that prevail today. The main issue that Plato identified was that people in power are becoming corrupt and seek personal gain. His idea to have philosophers at the top is that people who have the capacity to think deeper understand the meaninglessness of such behaviours and can see the world from a selfless perspective, overcoming the greed for personal power and wealth. Now I'm not saying that Plato's vision is the perfect solution, but at the very least you should be able to see the benevolent nature of the proposal. You hating on it so much tells me you have not grasped the intention.

[–] PugJesus@piefed.social 1 points 4 days ago

If you’re learning about Plato from chatgpt or something

Christ.

No, I'm literally paraphrasing the Republic, with occasional glances at specific passages when I'm uncertain if I'm remembering correctly.

To understand the concept you need to keep in mind what the world looked like back then. Also I understand that we now live in an era where philosophy is not appreciated as much as it was back then, the very term has been corroded by the capitalist ideas that prevail today.

... one of the core complaints of the Republic, and the reason for the in-narrative dialogue, is the perception that contemporary people don't value philosophy

The main issue that Plato identified was that people in power are becoming corrupt and seek personal gain. His idea to have philosophers at the top is that people who have the capacity to think deeper understand the meaninglessness of such behaviours and can see the world from a selfless perspective, overcoming the greed for personal power and wealth. Now I’m not saying that Plato’s vision is the perfect solution, but at the very least you should be able to see the benevolent nature of the proposal.

On the contrary, the argument remains based on a selfish premise - one of the very first things established as a prerequisite for the whole discussion is the idea that just behavior leads to happiness for the just person. The point of making the ruling class philosophers is that philosophers will be able to understand what is and is not just (and, according to Plato's arguments there, no one chooses injustice except out of ignorance).

You hating on it so much tells me you have not grasped the intention.

Oh, I'm sorry, the system of oligarchic hereditary oppression has good intent, so I shouldn't hate it. Of course. Silly me. I'll start glazing the Chinese Confucian bureaucracy, medieval theocratic feudalism, and the Stalinist regime next.