this post was submitted on 28 Dec 2025
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3/4ths of these are just punk subgenres lol
YOU'RE a punk subgenre >:(
YO MOMMA is a punk subgenre!
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She's awesome!
I concur, their momma is mighty fine.
No Patrick, Goth and Emo are not ~~an instrument~~ punk.
Emo literally stands for "Emotive Hardcore", i.e "Hardcore Punk"
Goth music is rooted in Post-Punk.
The three that are not punk itself. Emo and goth both came out of punk, and ska was fused with punk by the time of two-tone.
I'm genuinely curious how Goth came out of Punk.
Basically, some people started incorporating gloomy aspects to punk aesthetics and music. Gloomy aspects from literature, film, tropes. Some were looking to express similar political sentiments but in a more metaphorical way, I suppose; that's my impression, that there was an added element of artistry/artsy there. Some were looking to add also subjective themes (madness, unlove, etc.). Example (Bauhaus - In the Flat Field).
This gave us post-punk and similar sounds in the very late 70s and mostly early 80s. You probably know some bands that were influential. Example. (The Cure - The Hanging Garden).
Anyway, the mohawk grew longer, blacker. Still teased, often shaved, but creepier. The leyering in clothing also became blacker or creepier (transparent layers, protagonism of the net layers). Theatrical and extravagant outfits emerged, inspired by the decade's fashion too. Example in music video A. (Alien Sex Fiend - R.I.P.).
Example in music video B. (Specimen - Kiss Kiss Bang Bang)
Famously, the night club called "The Batcave" started reuniting bands and listeners, and in the 80s many countries had similar venues. A little more aggressive or punkier sound persisted with a genre called deathrock. There was now post-punk, deathrock, goth rock, darkwave (inspired by the synth-driven genres of the 80s), etc. Example A. (The Sisters of Mercy - Lucretia my Reflection)
Example B. (The Frozen Autumn - Is Everything Real?).
The subculture was consolidated around these genres, and then the name "Goth" stayed, and then more communication and inspiration... And nowadays social media keeps many things alive through teachings in video and, I guess, text, like this one. Why? In part, because [context] a person that is new to all this world is called a "baby bat" and [/context] most Goths are protective and integrating of baby bats.
And that's it. There was a good deathrock revival in the late 00s and early 10s. Example. (Cinema Strange - I Remember Tendon Water). And today there's an obsession to bring back the original elements but it's all still very different (and often cliched, which I don't like, personally).
Here's some Goth music from 'recent' years. (Lebanon Hanover - Gallowdance).
Another one. (Boy Harsher - Fate).
And another one. (The Cemetery Girlz - Broken Teeth)
More knowledgeable Goths, correct or add as needed...
Thank you too, love this kind of random enlightening comments!
Holy moses, thanks for all that effort! Good read!
Yeah, after commenting that I considered that what some people consider goth is actually post-punk (the punk connection should be obvious), but then remembered goth rock exists obviously does not come from punk. Ska and emo though for sure, emo by ways of post-hardcore, by ways of hardcore, by ways of protopunk and you've already covered the ska lineage
My understanding is punk came about at least in part of the first wave of ska, not the other way around.
Though I could be mistaken.
I can't claim deep familiarity with that era, but I've never heard of punk being derived from ska. Garage rock, Velvet Underground, The Stooges were the progenitors of punk, and in neither those nor Ramones, New York Dolls, Suicide, or Sex Pistols can I hear any traces of ska. It's rather that these bands, Ramones in particular, were returning to raw energy of rock-n-roll and garage rock, against the fancy glam-rock.
Ska, reggae and dub certainly influenced post-punk, and in turn punk influenced the second wave of ska, both emerging almost simultaneously around '78-79.
Anyone feel to correct me if k get any of this wrong, but punk as a genre evolved primarily in a cosmopolitan London ( unsure how much other English cities contributed - someone else can comment) where working class locals and immigrants from countries from across the British empire that had immigrated to London brought their local music with them - first wave aka, reggae, rock and roll, dub(?) all influenced young working class londoners and influenced the development of punk which was firmly rooted in class consciousness, a diy ethos, and rebellion against the rigid classist system of post war England.
Everything you're talking about came later.
You might not necessarily hear the musical influence of some of these genres in the first punk bands that became well known, but the cultural impact of fans of these genres of music was integral to the development of a punk rock ethos that embraced working class solidarity, rebellion against authority, and diy.
The New York CBGB scene preceded the London scene, from what I can tell, and there was also the Cleveland scene. Punk seems to have been imported to London from NY by Malcolm McLaren, band manager and store owner, rather than working-class folks. Dunno who played punk in the UK before Sex Pistols.
UK punk was of course influenced by the rude boy and skinhead subcultures, but I don't think that manifested musically. Pure punk-rock doesn't quite have any of ska's danceable quality that can't be traced to rock'n'roll and garage rock instead.
Goth-rock started from post-punk, with Bauhaus and Siouxsie and the Banshees following the lead of Joy Division. Not sure what kind of goth-rock you mean that didn't start there.
Post punk. And dub, glam, reggae, Krautrock.
“Mozart came from Gregorian chants.“