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this post was submitted on 19 Oct 2023
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Honestly, I understand why he shot. The cop came in a bit hot at first but he didn't immediately use a gun. It only came to that after Lenny started winning the brawl and after attempting to use a Taser instead.
He even started to apply first aid afterwards. So I think the cop did okay here.
Nah fuck that. It was verbal until the cop tased him, then its not exactly shocking that it causes him to react. The cop was screaming the whole time, no de-escalation at all. Just get him to the side of the road, safe and talk while waiting for backup. It's just more evidence of undertrained US cops. There was no reason for this man to die.
Absolutely!! Backup took 4 minutes. Leonard just wanted to know why he was getting arrested instead of just getting a ticket. He obviously hated cops, but he was perfectly willing to talk before he was tazed.
The CNN video is very deceptively edited. The full clip shows way more combativeness and non-compliance from Cure.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tGNIAozOIok
I didn't watch the CNN video, I watched the one you linked. Yes, he was being an asshole, but he wasn't threatening. His hands were still on the truck. The officer tazered him because he wouldn't put his hands behind his back, right? He had already called for backup, though, right? All he had to do was continue to let Leonard argue with him until cover arrived. Backup didn't arrive "too late," the officer escalated the situation "too early." It was literally only a couple of minutes into the stop. Some de-escalation on the officers part and the story would have been different.
I think that's a reasonable take. It still could have been prevented by Cure simply complying with the orders- the court is the proper place to fight that- and I think the officer was well justified in attempting to arrest, but he should have only used the taser and escalated once backup arrived or he was forced to. I agree that was probably a mistake, but at the same time, with a person that combative and non-compliant, it's difficult to say for certain.
The previous time he complied with orders from cops, he wrongfully lost 16 years of his life behind bars, ruining all future prospects. I 1000% understand why he would be asking a lot of questions with his first interaction with cops after years of abuse in a completrly for-profit system that rewards abusers.
~~We have no idea if he complied before. Given the fact that his sentence was only so long due to a previous record, it seems more likely that not complying was his usual stance. I don't know this for sure, obviously, but it does seem more likely.~~ The previous statement is misinformation, I believe. One of the attorneys in the exoneration said that he complied with the original arrest and thought he'd be able to simply explain that he wasn't the robber, which obviously did not go in his favor. While it definitely helps explain his actions, I still do not believe assaulting an officer is the right path to take, though I do understand it better now.
But there's such a vast gulf between "complying" and "attempting to kill (or at least cause serious bodily harm to) an officer" that I have a hard time finding the officer at fault here. Why did he flee? Why did he refuse lawful commands? Why did he give his name as "Yahweh" as far as I can hear? Why did he attempt to assault the officer after being tased? What was he planning to do to the officer had he not fired, as the repeated "Yeah bitch" suggested very violent intent to me. These are all valid questions that I hope we get answers to, but it's unlikely that we will. All any of us can do is watch the video- which is the most direct evidence of the truth- and form our opinions based on that.
"Why did he flee?" Because he had been wrongfully accused and sent to prison for 16 years before, obviously! "Why did he refuse lawful commands?" Because those enforcing it are lawless and wrongfully sent him to prison for 16 years. "Why did he attempt to assault the officer after being tazed?" Are you being serious right now? Have you ever been tazed before? It's an awful experience and does awful things to your heart, especially in the moment and especially to someone who is older. He obviously must have held a grudge after 16 years in prison and might even have promised himself to not go down without a fight next time, or maybe loose the rest of his lofe in prison. Guess he "just" ended up losing the rest of his life period.
Maybe try to live a little more empathetically and learn to try and put yourself in others' situation, given what they've been through. This is an obvious egregious case and awful that it had ended like this. Not sure if you're aware of how corrupt the federal government are in the US and about their internal gangs and racism towards non-caucasians.
I am well, well aware of how shitty the system is, I assure you. But given how you patronized me ("Maybe try to live a little more empathetically"- sincerely, go fuck yourself, you self-righteous prick), I don't feel like arguing. All I'll say is this- Leonard Cure's death is a sad situation that was avoidable with different choices from either party. The officer made mistakes, but given Cure's erratic behavior (my bet is that toxicology will show that he was high on some sort of stimulant given the strange "Yahweh" answer, the disjointed head and arm movement, aggression, and lack of pain response to the taser, baton, or bullet), combativeness, and noncompliance, I completely understand why the officer defended himself. If this was an "obvious egregious case", then why is it being discussed here and throughout the internet?
Yes, my singular patronizing statement definitely warrants your over the top response.
It's so sad to see how you've already convinced yourself of how he was guilty of SOMETHING before even knowing this, which is why I made the suggestion towards an empathetic approach. You're clearly defending the cop and trying to show how the victim (the one who died in this exchange) was wrong after all. You said this knowing full-well that he has wrongfully spent a signifficant portion of his life behind bars, being berated by guards (which is how the system works), growing jaded and distrustful towards the broken system that ruined his life. You hammer on his non-compliance, where his compliance in the past did not grant him ANY justice.
I'm sure both sides made mistakes, HOWEVER, the weight of making better choices and acting appropriately rests on the shoulders of the officer enacting the law. That's his job FFS. I've seen enough footage of officers escalating situations, switching off body cams before committing crimes, etc. and not being punished in any way. The cop is not the victim here. And you're blaming the only victim in this scenario. His life is a tale of victimhood, and you cannot seem to fathom that his actions have been molded by a corrupt and broken legal system.
Even on that video, the cop sucked the entire time (due to the lack of good training). You are alone on a busy highway, the last thing you want to do is start a fight, you don't even want to be on the shoulder like that, it's far too dangerous. No matter how you wanna show this, the guy should never have been put in a position to be shot.
People like you are responsible for the "thin blue line" types and for the perpetuation of no accountability.