this post was submitted on 07 Mar 2024
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    485
    Systemd controversy be like (sh.itjust.works)
    submitted 1 year ago by loaExMachina@sh.itjust.works to c/linuxmemes@lemmy.world
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    [–] GreatDong3000@lemm.ee 17 points 1 year ago (6 children)

    Hi am noob why systemd bad? I use Debian, is fucked?

    Honestly I've been hearing about this for a while now but never bothered to check, I'm too lazy for that.

    [–] queue@lemmy.blahaj.zone 53 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    It's not inherently bad, it "fails" the Unix Philosophy of "Do one thing and do it well" but since Linux's kernel is:

    • Unix-like, not Unix
    • Fails this philosophy, as it does more than one thing but does all of it pretty well
    • systemd is just a bundle of tools that do one thing and do it well under one package, like Linux's kernel

    It used to be a mess, but that's solved. The biggest reason to avoid systemd is mainly user preference, not anything malicious. 90% of current distros use systemd as its easier for the maintainers and package programmers to build for the general than each package and each distro having their own methods of how to do an init system and other tasks.

    How Debian and Arch and Gentoo and Slackware and other big distros worked was different, and the maintainers of those packages had to know "Debian's way" and not a general way that most places accept. Systemd actually solved the Too Many Standards! issue.

    I've never really seen a big argument against systemd, but maybe I've just not heard it.

    [–] bus_factor@lemmy.world 15 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    It also didn't help that Poettering isn't particularly popular on a personal level. I think there would have been a lot less drama if he had better people skills.

    [–] TxzK@lemmy.zip 30 points 1 year ago (1 children)

    Yeah, but to be honest, I would have terrible "people skills" too if people sent me death threats over writing a free software.

    [–] bus_factor@lemmy.world 10 points 1 year ago

    Doesn't take much to get death threats on the Internet, unfortunately. He probably would have received less of them with a better attitude, though. He wasn't full-on Ulrich Drepper, but still pretty divisive.

    [–] queue@lemmy.blahaj.zone 4 points 1 year ago

    Yeah he seems kind of like a weirdo jerk.

    [–] thisbenzingring 11 points 1 year ago (1 children)

    back when you had an init system and you got it just the way you wanted it, you would be pissed that you had to move to systemd

    now its there when you install and it is stable so it isn't a big deal. But old beards hate change.

    [–] dukatos@lemm.ee 5 points 1 year ago

    Old beards built linux and everything around, have some respect.

    [–] _cnt0@sh.itjust.works -3 points 1 year ago (1 children)

    It used to be a mess, but that's solved.

    Do you mean the past tense of the verb solve or the systemd service that solves mathematical equations? Because solveds code is still a mess. It used to too, but it still is.

    [–] possiblylinux127@lemmy.zip 23 points 1 year ago

    No one knows to this day

    [–] TxzK@lemmy.zip 20 points 1 year ago (1 children)

    I highly recommend you check out this video

    SystemD is not really bad. Like 90% distros use it, and for good reasons. Some people just pointlessly hate it on it, same way some people like to hate on Wayland too.

    [–] PipedLinkBot@feddit.rocks 2 points 1 year ago

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    [–] dariusj18@lemmy.world 13 points 1 year ago (1 children)

    I believe partly because it takes over so many responsibilities that it becomes a requirement for things that don't need to require it. Plus it diverged from the Linux principle of do only one thing.

    Also, afair, it was buggy for a while.

    [–] starman@programming.dev 10 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

    FYI: It's called Unix principle, not Linux

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unix_philosophy

    [–] dariusj18@lemmy.world 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

    Oh yeah, thank you

    [–] MNByChoice@midwest.social 6 points 1 year ago

    There is a fork of Debian without SystemD. https://www.devuan.org/