this post was submitted on 17 Jun 2023
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submitted 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) by user@lemmy.world to c/lemmyworld@lemmy.world
 
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[–] wols@lemmy.ml 3 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (54 children)

Beehaw "moderators" don't have an issue with their user base checking out other communities. As is clearly obvious from the fact that they aren't defederated from all other instances.

They do have an issue with droves of unvetted users from other instances trolling and harassing their community though. And the most effective way to deal with that currently is to defederate from the instances that the majority of those bad-faith users are coming from. The unfortunate (and unintentional) side effect is that Beehaw users won't be able to interact with any of the users from those instances.

This is a situation born out of a combination of

  • lack of manpower and moderation tools
  • gaps in the configuration of inter-instance interactions
  • the way the internet works

You can disagree with this decision and users are free to switch, but this meme is a poor caricature of the actual effects of Beehaw's actions and (at least in my estimation) of their intentions.

The decision to defederate is less of an attack or an indictment against the other instances and more of a practical necessity for them to protect their community.

If the user base of the lemmy verse keeps growing I wouldn't be surprised if either

  • more granular control over the way instances interact with each other is implemented and the restrictions are softened or
  • the amount of spammers and trolls reaches a level that forces more instances to vet their users and the defederation is lifted entirely or
  • more powerful moderation tools show up and in combination with a greater number of people moderating makes the pre-screening of users unnecessary
[–] wildeaboutoskar@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago (2 children)

Yeah I agree. They've been quite open about everything so far and their main issue was the modding implications of open sign up. The tools just don't exist yet to manage it effectively and keep the kind of community they want, so it's just easier to defederate for now until they do. They have a dialogue open with shit just works and said that the admin of lemmy.world hasn't replied to their message, but that it's fine if they don't want to talk too.

I am a bit disappointed that inter-instance sniping has started so early though. I personally am on both instances and am going to try and treat both in good faith for now

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I agree with Beehaw's decision, until moderation tools are strong like on Mastodon to quell targeted hate spam and other such 4chan level trash...They have every right to defederate Lemmy and any instance that compromises the wellbeing of their community. I do hope these issues which have caused this situation are resolved overtime. I'd donate to help the effort. Decentralized social media feels like the future of how we interact with others with internet-based communication. It needs support to get off the ground and run faster than sites like Facebook or Twitter.

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[–] BobbyBandwidth@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago (4 children)

Yeah, they basically make you write a cover letter. I don’t even write cover letters for jobs I want. Definitely not going to write one to be approved for an Internet forum.

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[–] Aurix@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago (3 children)

Dislike the meme, because I fully believe the beehaw decisions have solid, purely technical, grounds.

[–] UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world 3 points 2 years ago (4 children)

The very existence of that community boils down to people screaming the word "Tankie" at one another while trying to reproduce the most cringe corners of old Reddit.

Beehaw mods are just another group of power tripping nerds common to the social media space. These technical issues are all outgrowths of their desperate need to control discourse.

[–] WFH@lemmy.world 3 points 2 years ago (8 children)

I swear I've never heard "tankie" before a week ago and now I'm on Lemmy I read it 50 times a day.

[–] CurlyWurlies4All@slrpnk.net 1 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 children)

Tankies are usually characterised by their willingness to defend the use of tanks to crush civilians who speak out against authoritarian communist governments.

[–] WFH@lemmy.world 1 points 2 years ago

I feel this should have been part of my beloved "Trotskyist insults" stamp set I was gifted many years ago.

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[–] vimdiesel@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago

I mean that's literally what they say in their sign up form, but a bit more self congratulatory, so it's not really a surprise is it? They don't want to deal with randos and reserve the right to kick anybody out for what they consider "asshole" behavior.

[–] Aurix@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago

I see little proof for that yet. They behave like a small forum which reached its capacity.

[–] AWistfulNihilist@lemmy.world 1 points 2 years ago

You know you really nailed it when you hit that equal up/down ratio!

[–] user@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago

thats great! people think differently.

[–] ColaEuphoria@lemmy.world 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I'm hoping they re-federate soon after their technical gripes are ironed out. Seems like a promising community, but only time will tell.

[–] beerd@lemmy.world 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

https://beehaw.org/post/594843 It seems like there is work on it, but the lemmy.world owner does not respond to beehaw admins

[–] woelkchen@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago (1 children)

It seems like there is work on it, but the lemmy.world owner does not respond to beehaw admins

Maybe you should have read all of what you linked: https://beehaw.org/comment/298646

tldr: Beehaw admin sent Ruud a statement but didn't ask any question or ask for comment. Ruud read and acknowledged the statement but didn't reply because there was no question to reply to. They're now in a chat room with some other instance admins.

IMO quite some trouble when the easy solution is to just not subscribe to communities you don't like.

[–] beerd@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago

Thanks for the correction, i read the post when it was made and only re read the post itself when linking. The problem as far as i understand it wasnt with communities people didnt like, but with trolls and harassment that is hardly controlled with a no barrier signup process. As long as the mod tools are not good enough to deal with that, beehaw.org has every reason to deal with this in a way that compromises content wise.

[–] audge@lemmy.world 1 points 2 years ago (2 children)
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[–] _number8_@lemmy.world 1 points 2 years ago (10 children)

beehaw initially seemed like a nice good natured well rounded place but they got controlling and weird very quickly. never even let me in, i typed pretty good faith answers and haven't heard shit ofc

[–] dystop@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I'm surprised they didn't just ask for more mod help.

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[–] user@lemmy.world 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

check out their modlog. they have way too many unnecesary bans or post removals. wasting energy instead of focusing on the real trolls.

[–] eXoShini@lemmy.world 1 points 2 years ago

How do I filter modlog to only show logs from given instance? I’ve entered modlog that is available at bottom of page on beehaw and also different instance and the modlog is quite similar with some beehaw entries not showing up on other and vice versa.

I assume the modlog is combined from all federated instances, so I can’t really tell what actions are made by beehaw unless it references community belonging to beehaw.

[–] 5redie8@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Beehaw was almost responsible for me not joining this service at all, got frustrated when I couldn't log into my account a week after I made it and nearly gave up entirely.

[–] evadzs@lemmy.world 1 points 2 years ago

Yup I had this experience too. I've read that their denial emails aren't being sent out by their mail server, but it really felt like they just ghosted me.

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[–] Soltros@lemmy.world 1 points 2 years ago (2 children)

They had some quality communites. Ah well, we can make them here with blackjack and hookers.

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[–] Zednix@lemmy.ca 1 points 2 years ago

if they want to hide in a lil hug box that is their perogative

[–] darkstar@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 years ago

This is hilarious!

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