Yep, PHP is turning 30 this year! Wondering if "PHP is still relevant?" Ever since we have been hearing that PHP is dead. It was “dead” 10 years ago, 5 years ago, and “is dead” today. But somehow - it isn’t. Anyway... happy birthday!

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[–] cupcakezealot@piefed.blahaj.zone 17 points 19 hours ago* (last edited 19 hours ago)

this is perl erasure

also php didn't cause the internet to suck; overreliance on javascript (and js based frameworks) did. there's a reason that modern internet is so slow and clunky and it's not php. at least php has the capabibility to improve over time not degrade.

[–] simonced@lemmy.ml 12 points 18 hours ago (1 children)

Array_filter and array_map having the arguments swapped pisses me of so much.!

[–] mad_lentil@lemmy.ca 4 points 17 hours ago

This person phps

[–] dreadbeef@lemmy.dbzer0.com 7 points 18 hours ago

Js is dead use php!

[–] jenesaisquoi@feddit.org 25 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (3 children)

Ah yes, the language that picked strlen as the hash function for its hashtables.

[–] Blackmist@feddit.uk 11 points 20 hours ago (1 children)

Javascript is living proof that your language doesn't need to be good to be used.

I tripped over this one in Delphi the other day.

function AnsiStartsText(const ASubText, AText: string): Boolean;
function AnsiEndsText(const ASubText, AText: string): Boolean;
function AnsiContainsText(const AText, ASubText: string): Boolean;

[–] mad_lentil@lemmy.ca 4 points 17 hours ago

Too late to change it now

[–] keepee@lemmy.world 9 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Can you elaborate on this?

[–] jenesaisquoi@feddit.org 6 points 22 hours ago

Source: https://news-web.php.net/php.internals/70691

[–] vivalapivo@lemmy.today 5 points 21 hours ago (1 children)

Waaaaaaat

[–] jenesaisquoi@feddit.org 5 points 21 hours ago

I also like T_PAAMAYIM_NEKUDOTAYIM

[–] ursakhiin@beehaw.org 25 points 1 day ago (1 children)

PHP will never die. As long as code is written there will be PHP developers there to claim it's good now.

[–] bufalo1973@europe.pub 1 points 7 hours ago

Just like COBOL

[–] darvit@lemmy.darvit.nl 38 points 1 day ago (4 children)

Everyone in this thread: PHP sucks because it was bad when I last used it 20 years ago.

[–] dreadbeef@lemmy.dbzer0.com 8 points 18 hours ago* (last edited 18 hours ago)

Backend devs: JS sucks because I never learned it actually

[–] ICastFist@programming.dev 16 points 1 day ago

It's still bad nowadays, and it's the main language used on pretty much every system of several state level secretaries in Brazil. My colleagues work with it daily (I don't program, thankfully) and they're not exactly fond of it. Legacy systems, man

[–] TheKingBee@lemmy.world 9 points 1 day ago (5 children)

I mean it does suck, but it sucks less than anything else we have.

[–] balsoft@lemmy.ml 8 points 18 hours ago* (last edited 18 hours ago)

PHP is far from "least bad language". Nowadays it is an ok language, one of many. You can also write ok code in it. The main issue is that it's really easy to write horrible shit that just barely works and will break when you look at it wrong. In fact without a lot of knowledge and experience that is the code you will probably write.

There are much better languages for any webdev niche you can think off, and some that are just better for webdev overall (e.g. Elixir). The reason PHP is still relevant is mostly huge legacy codebases that require a lot of engineering power to maintain (because PHP is not a good language for maintenance).

The way I look at it is that PHP is the C++ of webdev (but slightly worse).

[–] ICastFist@programming.dev 7 points 1 day ago (2 children)

Nah, i'd say java has been better than PHP overall

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[–] merc@sh.itjust.works 45 points 1 day ago (15 children)

Where I live, I still see people in a horse-drawn wagon. So, I guess horse-drawn wagons never died? It's only used for tourists and weddings, but that counts, right?

According to Tiobe, PHP was the programming language of the year in 2004. In 2010 it was number 3 in the top 10 programming languages. It's now out of the top 10 entirely. There really isn't a language that has completely disappeared. Mainframes are still programmed using COBOL, Scientists are still using FORTRAN, even Lisp, which has been around since the 1950s, is still going strong.

Maybe Actionscript counts as truly dead, since it was tied to Adobe Flash, and Flash is truly dead?

I have a lot of bad memories of PHP. It was, for a brief time, the main language I used, but it was so ugly and inconsistent. The only thing I loved about it, at the time, was that it wasn't Visual Basic. As bad as PHP was, at least I wasn't making web pages in that pile of hot garbage. But, I never felt joy writing something in PHP. At best it was a slog. At worst it was like pulling teeth.

Just about every other language has given me moments of fun. Original Javascript was a mess, but it already contained scheme-like features. It was sold as being an interpreted version of Java, but it had features that Java wouldn't have for at least a decade. C is a brutal and unforgiving language, but as long as you're not working with strings, it's great to have such low-level control over everything.

Maybe PHP has evolved like other languages, but I still am not interested in trying it out. Everything it was good at can be done better by other languages, and those are languages that give me joy, not pain. I hope it keeps dropping in the rankings so that people aren't exposed to it as one of their first languages.

[–] PumaStoleMyBluff@lemmy.world 9 points 1 day ago (1 children)

There are still Amish and Mennonite communities who use horse-drawn wagons and farm implements their whole lives.

Not really meant to be an argument to your point, just interesting to know.

[–] merc@sh.itjust.works 5 points 1 day ago

It's definitely cool to see when you get into Western Pennsylvania, for example.

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[–] BlameTheAntifa@lemmy.world 72 points 1 day ago (8 children)

In PHPs defense, it keeps evolving in positive, meaningful ways. If you are up to date with it, it’s quite sophisticated and enjoyable. Doubly so if you use a framework like Laravel.

[–] mad_lentil@lemmy.ca 2 points 17 hours ago

Yeah last time I used it was with a laravel monolith and actually it wasn't that bad.

[–] SavinDWhales@lemmy.world 3 points 19 hours ago

PHP 8.4 is pretty good, TBH. You absolutely CAN write great code with modern PHP. ... Shame that most PHP I touch is legacy code that's at MOST PHP 7.4 - which is EOL since November '22 and has to be upgraded or replaced. 😬

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[–] paulbg@programming.dev 16 points 1 day ago (13 children)

bro ive been doing fullstack js dev for severals years to then realize php is superior💀

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[–] magic_lobster_party@fedia.io 129 points 1 day ago (1 children)

PHP will remain alive as long Wordpress is still being used.

[–] Scrollone@feddit.it 19 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

But let's not forget that the WordPress codebase is absolute dogshit.

And not an example of how to write proper modern PHP.

[–] Decq@lemmy.world 96 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (9 children)

Let's be honest though. The early PHP versions were absolute dog shit. And the definition of how not to design a programming language. That said, that never stopped anyone in web development from using it apparently. No clue what modern PHP looks like, apparently it's better now.

[–] chunes@lemmy.world 8 points 22 hours ago (1 children)

I've never heard of a programming language that people don't consider shit

[–] Rozauhtuno@lemmy.blahaj.zone 3 points 21 hours ago

Holy C.

[–] kingofras@lemmy.world 57 points 1 day ago (3 children)

Was not intended as programming language. The name literally stands for Hypertext PreProcessor. It was meant to be a script injector for HTML back when the internet was still fun.

Then it got out of hand and PHP didn’t evolve fast enough to be a web technology leader, but never ceded the position of old trusty workhorse, and still powers a significant part of websites.

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