Back in the old days we used to run forums and mailing lists for people of various interests. People used to make their own little idiosyncratic places full of creativity. I miss it so much.

Then the big US social media companies came in and took everyone away and the old Internet became a ghost town. Lots of online communities died to be replaced by highly predatory foreign companies.

I don't know why we should listen to people defending predatory social media but everyone ignored us old people telling them that these walled gardens were going to kill the Internet with massive corporate influence. Everyone is so fucking stupid now. Technical people can't even do technical shit anymore. I hate it.

[–] eureka@aussie.zone 3 points 2 days ago

These places still exist, although admittedly they're further from the spotlight and many were sapped by mainstream general-purpose platforms. But there are thousands of them around for those who care to look. I don't even think it's a stretch to say we're on one, community hosted by Aussies for Aussies.

[–] schnurrito@discuss.tchncs.de 2 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Back in the old days we used to run forums and mailing lists for people of various interests. People used to make their own little idiosyncratic places full of creativity. I miss it so much.

Me too, friend. Me too.

The central reason why we can't have it anymore is that governments around the world have regulated it away. One example being what the article in the OP is about. 🙁

[–] BlueSquid0741 4 points 3 days ago (2 children)

Governments have regulated that we can’t have forums, mailing lists? What about special interest bulletin boards? I read the article but I didn’t pick up on that.

[–] shirro@aussie.zone 2 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago) (1 children)

Nah, they didn't. The legislation is bad but it was driven by research into mobile phone/social media addiction and harms to teenagers. There is more than a bit of a satanic panic angle but there is enough substance that I think we have to take the concerns seriously. The target is algorithmic addiction machines run by huge predatory companies. Any impact on sites like aussie.zone is unintended and nobody cares about a self hosted forum or list for neurodivergent kids.

All such laws create unintended opportunities for companies that want to capture identity data like Palantir which must be resisted to protect our democratic freedoms and national sovereignty but that shit has been happening with the massive concentration of power in big companies like Facebook anyway. We have to decentralise and get back to doing stuff locally.

The problem is people are fucking stupid and they all jumped to evil shit like Facebook and everything else died. I have to go out of my way to find out anything in my local community with sports, school etc because people are moronic sheep. Apparently I am the weird one for not giving all my family and communities data to evil foreign companies that are complicit in all sorts of shit up to and including genocide. The government is targeting the right bunch of unethical cunts even if they are not doing it well.

[–] BlueSquid0741 1 points 2 days ago

Of course. That’s my understanding too. Just wondering why this guy claims message boards and mailing lists have been regulated away and supported that by citing this article.

[–] schnurrito@discuss.tchncs.de 0 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Yes, if they pass laws creating liability for their operators, or regulating that they have to verify ages or identities, etc.

[–] dockedatthewrongworf@aussie.zone 2 points 2 days ago

Except that would mean forums like Steam or whirlpool would require people to verify their age is over 16 before posting but as far as I can tell they have no such requirements.

It seems to me that people can still quite easily set up forums for special interest topics and groups without issue from the government.

[–] shads@lemy.lol -1 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Agreed, completely. I used Facebook for all of 9 months before I did the self reflection and realised that it was like voluntarily poisoning myself and got out in, I think, 2012 or so. I was unemployed at the time and it became clear to me that it was doing bad things to me mentally and I was developing an addiction to the scroll.

Imagine if you would that instead of this garbage social media ban on kids we had some serious investigation into the corrosive nature of these social media orgs and they were held accountable for every bit of "experimentation" they conducted without informed consent. While we were at it we could have maybe whipped up some regulstion to curb the gambling industry.

The only people I have personally talked with who say the teen social media ban is unambiguously good just so happen to be the same people whose brains have been completely cooked by a combination of Facebook and Sky News. I kid you not when I say that the last person to loudly assert social media ban good also told me about the time he threatened bodily harm to a man who was wearing a mask immediately after Covid lockdowns were lifted and got upset when he unmasked got within 20cm of his face.

Oh and the absolute bullshit conspiracy theories he spouted about Daniel Andrews while telling me he wishes we had an Australian Trump to "get rid of all the corrupt pedos in Australian Politics".

Oh how I wish we had some IT savvy legislators who would make good law, since this won't happen I would settle for them doing nothing. This sort of ineffectual crap serves the sole purpose of creating opportunities for these corporations to further entrench their hold over the internet. I am watching on with dread to find out how much data is going directly to Palantir from this mess.

[–] Taleya@aussie.zone 3 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Calling everyone who disagrees with you a brainrotted cooker will not win you friends.

[–] shads@lemy.lol 0 points 3 days ago

I only apply that judgement where it fits. If you are an anti-vaxxer I don't need you as a friend. If you tell everyone who will listen that Daniel Andrews is a paedophile based on rumours that apparently started on cairnsnews.org, I don't need you as a friend. If you think Port Arthur was a false flag to take away your guns I don't need you as a friend. If you think the lazy botched mess that is this legislation has more to do with protecting kids than getting us used to handing over our ID or biometrics to whichever large company asks for it I don't need you as a friend.

I called my member and asked who will pay for the damage that this could cause in the event of massive data breaches and was told that the eSafety Commissioner was empowered to hand out fines of hundreds of thousands of dollars per person affected by breaches... Why is Discord not trying to figure out how to pay tens or hundreds of millions of dollars in fines? Because the government doesn't care and Comissioner Grant is too busy flying around the world doing a victory lap to bother with trivial details like protecting the people she is selling out for her pet project.

[–] Ilandar@lemmy.today 6 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Why do people keep posting Techdirt blog pieces in the Australia community? The guy who writes these pieces is an American who has been fully against regulation since the very beginning. He is just quoting a Guardian Australia article and interspersing his own high modality commentary which adds nothing of value. Why not link the actual article instead?

In any case, the Guardian article implies that teenagers with disabilities can no longer contact their friends (not true) and that alternative online spaces do not exist (also not true). Just a couple off the top of my head are My Circle and Livewire. Of course, like most fearmongering pieces on the social media ban's "impacts", the Guardian Australia article makes absolutely no attempt to suggest alternatives or even interview someone from one of these organisations. The reporting on this issue has been lacklustre and full of confirmation bias since the very beginning.

[–] schnurrito@discuss.tchncs.de 5 points 3 days ago

I post articles from many sources I come across that are somehow interesting or make good points in relevant communities, including ones for countries if the articles are about those countries. I have no intention to stop doing that.

[–] CannonFodder@lemmy.world -1 points 3 days ago (2 children)

There are likely benifits to social media for some kids in some cases. But the question is about overall health. Even their first example they talk about a person who has hard time making connections in real life so they need online contact. Yeah, it might seem that way but being forced to connect in real life is what makes it easier over time. Continually avoiding real life through social media is what makes it so unhealthy.

[–] shads@lemy.lol 5 points 3 days ago

So you are criticising this story for being to broad and generalised by using a broad and generalised example. You are right the thirty minutes my kids were blocked on social media was absolutely worth the upheaval and angst of this government imposed erosion of EVERYONES privacy. Oh and before you start waffling about how I should be policing their social media usage, I was doing that before this farce was implemented through the astounding application of a skill called parenting. Only thing is now the major control I had over my kids most prevalent online usage... Youtube... Is now gone as I no longer have the ability to view what they are using.

This law doesn't actually make anything better, it doesn't help and it just causes division and more angst. When the vast majority of the kids that go to school with mine have had uninterrupted usage of social media and its only 1 in 10 or 1 in 20 that get targeted it is just another means of ostracization, only this is government mandated.

But hey if you think this is a good and effective law I have a bridge you might be interested in, solidly made only one previous owner.

[–] Taleya@aussie.zone 2 points 3 days ago (2 children)

Uh no.

That's not why sm was banned for kids. It was because it's a highly addictive algorithmic machine.

"Go out and meet kids your own age" is a ridiculously boomer take.

[–] CannonFodder@lemmy.world 3 points 3 days ago

You don't think the issues are related?

[–] shads@lemy.lol -1 points 3 days ago

With all due respect that's the justification, not the "why". The why is politicians wanting to be seen as proactive and advertising company's wanting to protect the goose that lays the golden eggs by heading of regulation on advertising of the gambling industry. If addictive and algorithmic harms was the actual concerns we would be in the process of legislating the gambling industry out of existence. Add to the above a light sprinkling of oh so grudging compliance from social media companies who will be seeing a boost in the value of their data now they can tie it with even greater certainty to a real world ID.

I am ideologically opposed to the Liberal party, it's shit like this that makes me reconsider my support of the Labor party. I already vote independent most of the time, looks like Labor doesn't want to win me back.