I really can't take people serious that think sysv-init was the superior system. I mean for real, have you ever worked with it and all it's shortcomings? It wasnt even a system, it was a bunch of bad init scripts

[–] terabyterex@lemmy.world 3 points 4 days ago

i started my professional software development career in 1999. the amount of older guys who called the web stupid and a fad or "gopher is the future of the internet" was crazy. people hate change

[–] Tja@programming.dev 4 points 4 days ago

It was a bunch of bad init scripts, but it was our bunch of bad init scripts.

[–] sage@lemmy.blahaj.zone 1 points 4 days ago (1 children)

Nobody argued that sysv was better.

Just that there are other options, apart from systemd.

[–] Mountainaire@lemmy.world 2 points 22 hours ago

And yet you refuse to give examples...

[–] ZombieCyborgFromOuterSpace@piefed.ca 0 points 3 days ago (1 children)

I've been using it since I started using Linux 26 years ago until Ubuntu switched to upstart and then systemD.

It did the job and was very easy to work with. I knew what the scripts did and I could write my own. And it didn't ask for a date of birth either.

[–] shrugs@piefed.social 1 points 1 day ago (1 children)

funny, I also started around 2000 with Linux, so we have the same time under our belt. I remember doing manually dependency resolving downloading packages from freshmeat.net

Let's be honest, I hated that "/etc/init.d/apache2 start" went obsolete, muscle memory and habit are a bitch, but you have to move on sometimes. Otherwise, are you really arguing that some obscure start-stop-daemon wrapper that sometimes worked and sometimes didn't, because they were created for suse not redhat were superior?

systemd monitors the daemons, can show you used cpu time, can start daemons depending of if the system is connected to ac or uses battery or if a port got a magic package, it know which resources a service needs and much more, all without needing to manually write scripts. Do we really compare that to some scripts with bullshittery like:

case $1 in
  start):
    start-stop-daemon $service_name
    ;;
  *)
   echo fuck off
   exit 1
   ;;

sorry to be so blunt, and im pretty drunk saying this: sherly you can't be serious, and don't call me sherly.

[–] neighborhoodnerd21@mastodon.social 0 points 21 hours ago (1 children)

@shrugs @ZombieCyborgFromOuterSpace people don't like change. I almost had a nervous breakdown when gnome switched to gnome shell, still hate using it. better or worse I personally like systemd. You can use it or don't but change means progress. systems are more complex than they were 20 years ago and systemd gives me one place to manage everything

[–] ZombieCyborgFromOuterSpace@piefed.ca 0 points 21 hours ago (1 children)

funny, I also started around 2000 with Linux, so we have the same time under our belt. I remember doing manually dependency resolving downloading packages from freshmeat.net

Good times lol!

Let’s be honest, I hated that “/etc/init.d/apache2 start” went obsolete, muscle memory and habit are a bitch, but you have to move on sometimes. Otherwise, are you really arguing that some obscure start-stop-daemon wrapper that sometimes worked and sometimes didn’t, because they were created for suse not redhat were superior?

systemd monitors the daemons, can show you used cpu time, can start daemons depending of if the system is connected to ac or uses battery or if a port got a magic package, it know which resources a service needs and much more, all without needing to manually write scripts. Do we really compare that to some scripts with bullshittery like:

Oh no doubt that SystemD has its uses and it has great features. It's great for a corporate Linux used in business servers and the like. But in a time where every OS is spying on people with so called telemetry and are being controlled by policies enacted by politicians bought by lobbies of large corporations who just want to know every fine detail of our lives to sell us shit and open our data to governments for surveillance, you can bet your ass that I want an open box with scripts that I can read so I know what they do.

And the sheer fact that SystemD was undemocratically pushed down everyone's throat against the will of the people on the committees that steer the decisions for the distros in question is huge fucking red flag. It sticks of political overreach.

Pardon my French.

[–] neighborhoodnerd21@mastodon.social 0 points 21 hours ago (1 children)

@ZombieCyborgFromOuterSpace i guess i haven’t heard anything about any of that happening with linux as far as i know the whole age verification stuff didn’t affect linux and i haven’t bought any linux its freely available you can choose to use it or dont and its he source code is still available so its not like you cant look at it too so im really not sure where any of that applies here

[–] ZombieCyborgFromOuterSpace@piefed.ca 1 points 21 hours ago* (last edited 21 hours ago) (1 children)

Doesn't affect Linux... yet.

EDIT: I should add, this opens the door to many other government intrusions where they might require other personal information to be inputted to use your computer and access the internet eventually.

[–] neighborhoodnerd21@mastodon.social 0 points 21 hours ago (1 children)

@ZombieCyborgFromOuterSpace i cant tell the future. eating a burrito opens the door to needing to take a shit but i still do it. using anything you didn’t completely produce or engineer yourself opens you up to having to accept some level of things. idk i guess at that point you build your own thing choose your own tool’s but the #EFF works hard to keep an eye on things but buddy there is only so much we can do before you just have to turn it off and live jn the woods on squirrel meat

[–] ZombieCyborgFromOuterSpace@piefed.ca 1 points 20 hours ago (1 children)

I know I'm not the only one who feels this way. That's why there's Devuan, for example.

[–] neighborhoodnerd21@mastodon.social 0 points 20 hours ago (1 children)

@ZombieCyborgFromOuterSpace you’re correct a lot of people agree thats what opensource promises me. not that i will like everything some distribution does but that if i dont like something I have a choice if its a big enough concern I will switch but i also don’t know everything and make dumb choices sometimes and break stuff like my OS install and my life lol I thought meth was a good idea once for 6 years it was not I pick my fights that matter and sleep with one eye open on the rest

[–] ZombieCyborgFromOuterSpace@piefed.ca 1 points 20 hours ago (2 children)

Amen.

I'm just pissed Debian went the SystemD route. Ubuntu and Fedora I can understand. One's a corporate distro and the other is RedHat's child. But Debian? At least give the option to use an alternative.

Anyway, I understand what you mean and I'm sure you understand how I feel.

[–] neighborhoodnerd21@mastodon.social 1 points 20 hours ago (1 children)

@ZombieCyborgFromOuterSpace i do. I love Debian. I’m from Indiana it’s a requirement lol. Ian Murdock grew up an hour from me. But I guess I try to understand with the big guys they are working towards desktop linux. normal people arent like us. honestly until theres a comprehensive set of GUI tools for managing systemd and people never have to touch a terminal GNU Linux wont have a place in home desktop market. Its getting there though. I hope people keep the choice alive though.

[–] ZombieCyborgFromOuterSpace@piefed.ca 1 points 4 hours ago

Oh that's really cool! Did you ever meet the guy?

Also, I agree with the GUI part. Especially nowadays with people being so used to tablets, even the kids, that using a PC is becoming confusing.

Maybe when Linux becomes a serious contender on tablets and smartphones, that will all change. Who knows.

[–] neighborhoodnerd21@mastodon.social 0 points 20 hours ago (1 children)

@ZombieCyborgFromOuterSpace ill start another argument lol i like timers and haven’t used cron since i learned to create systemd timers

[–] ZombieCyborgFromOuterSpace@piefed.ca 1 points 4 hours ago

😭😭😭