A Textbook Case of Genocide : worldnews

[-] Ooops@kbin.social 65 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

The world is listening. But the world is not allowed to say anything because the moment they criticise Israel's government they are obviously evil anti-semites that should be shot on the spot.

Right now every single article criticising Israel's government is drowned out by two dozen articles about all those despicable anti-semites everywhere excusing Hamas terrorism. Doesn't matter that it's a lie, that noone actually excused those terrorist acts. It's just a rediculous over the top strawman.

But this ist our new post-factual reality. Those who scream their lie the loudest are right.

[-] Melkath@kbin.social 34 points 10 months ago

Hamas Rebels carried out an effective terrorist attack in retaliation to years of GLOBALLY SANCTIONED terrorism at the hands if Israel.

Now what was are observing is Israel quadrupling down on their terrorist activities whilst simultaneously waging an infowar.

Who do you think is more equipped to wage an infowar? A first world, heavily subsidized, safe government with all of the state of the art technology a little terrorist state can ask for? Or a poor destitute region whose infrastructure has been absolutely devastated over the decades, is again getting pummeled at full force, where hundreds if not thousands are getting ruthlessly slaughtered daily?

And Israel is STILL losing the infowar.

Why? Because the people of the world know exactly what is occurring but the governments of the world are so overwhelmingly corrupt that they maintain status quo so they also continue to get their shares of the subsidies.

Earth is fucked.

[-] Floufym@lemmy.world 1 points 10 months ago

Hamas didn’t do a terrorist attack. A war crime, sure. A terrorist attacked, no.

[-] Melkath@kbin.social 0 points 10 months ago

I'm genuinely intrigued by how you separate those terms in reference to the Hamas attack on the music festival.

Not being confrontational. I'm struggling with a mean does or does not equal average does or does not descriptive statistic conversation on another thread.

Off the cuff, my take has been "Hamas is a terrorist organization. The Israeli Military is a much bigger and more agregious terrorist organization. Let them have eachother and let Israili and Palestinian civilians make music together".

So here I am genuinely interested in your (and anyone elses) answer to "what is a terrorist attack, and how does it differ from a war crime? Bonus points: In current events, explain how Hamas has committed war crimes, but not terrorist attacks?"

[+] PoTayToes@sh.itjust.works -9 points 10 months ago

You know you can support the Palestinan cause without having to lie egregiously right. In terms of support, this is not "A first world, heavily subsidized, safe government" [...] versus "a poor destitute region" alone.

Like Israel has the US as an ally, there is massive financial support from different oil-rich, Middle Eastern countries in the infowar in favor of Palestine. From one side Iran, which is sworn enemies with Israel, and is financing Hezbollah in Lebanon. From another Qatar, where Hamas leaders are (were? I've seen reports of them moving so I may be out of date) living in luxury. Hell, even Russia is probably using their troll farms because making Israel look bad makes the US look bad and there is no way they would miss that chance.

[-] Melkath@kbin.social 7 points 10 months ago

I am really sorry but I don't speak apocalypse.

Are you saying because I understand why Hamas did what they did that I somehow support Iran?

No.

I've heard that Israel funded Hamas at some point and I believe it.

Israel is a problem. Time for the world to check in on Palestine as the place America is also shooting with brown people.

[-] doctorcherry@lemmy.ml 3 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

I keep seeing this Israel funded Hamas rhetoric. But, I can find almost no information about it from reputable sources. The only information I can find that is not obviously biased is a freaking Quora post.

If you, or anyone else, has anything more solid then I would be very interested to read about it.

[-] masquenox@lemmy.ml 12 points 10 months ago

But, I can find almost no information about it from reputable sources

What? You think this is some kind of secret? Israeli officials themselves have been admitting to this for years now.

[-] doctorcherry@lemmy.ml 6 points 10 months ago

What? You think this is some kind of secret?

No, I think that we should be critical of what we read online. Especially on topics where information is being actively manipulated. Thanks for the link.

[-] Melkath@kbin.social 6 points 10 months ago

I was also quick to believe it because the US basically made Al Queda, so it make perfect sense to me that Israel, which has been extensively groomed by America, would use the same playbook in Palestine.

But I get your desire for a bibliography.

[-] muad_dibber@lemmygrad.ml 15 points 10 months ago

Western media are experts at lying to manufacture consent for wars and xenophobia against all their enemies too. As we've seen over the last week, they're all to ready to accept it without questioning.

The nariyah testimony, gulf of tonkin, colin powell holding up the fake proof of iraq's "wmds", and so many more that pro-US ppl are not yet ready to come to terms with, or question their own biases.

[-] davel@lemmy.ml 8 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

People & governments of the Global South have plenty to say right now, though few of us in the Global North will hear them unless we go out of our way.

[-] tillimarleen@feddit.de 2 points 10 months ago

Ja, ne. Du bedienst hier doch auch ne Strohpuppe. Die Welt darf nichts sagen? Komm, du weisst das stimmt nicht. Sonst würde doch auch keiner wissen, wie beschissen es in Gaza aussieht. Dass Israel dort noch nicht einmarschiert ist, zeigt wie sehr auch die westliche Gemeinschaft das israelische Militär vom Schlimmsten abhalten will. Ich weiss nicht, was du liest, aber schau dir mal den Guardian gerade an. Hier gibt es eine Vielfalt an Stimmen zum Konflikt. Vertreter Israel‘s, Gründer des BSD, geben hier sehr konträre Ansichten. Aber auch in deutschen Medien wird doch nicht wenig auf das Leid der Palästinenser hingewiesen. Dass Leute, die Hamas und ihre verabscheuungswürdigen Taten zum Befreiungskampf stilisieren, zurechtgewiesen werden, gerade halt auch in unserem Land, sollte dich nicht so radikalisieren.

[-] randomredditor12345@lemmy.ml -3 points 10 months ago

noone actually excused those terrorist acts.

In Professor Joseph Massad’s newest article on The Electronic Intifada, he wrote that the attack that occurred in Israel on October 7th was a “stunning victory” and that Hamas' actions were “astounding,” “awesome,” and “incredible.”

And he doesn't teach at some no name place either. Dude teaches at Columbia

[-] agressivelyPassive@feddit.de 6 points 10 months ago

....and not one of those evil words is an ethical judgement, yet, you choose to interpret them this way, because in a black and white narrative, every speck of dust on your white narrative, must mean the other person is completely in camp black.

This is exactly what was criticized above. There's no room for any thought. It's just Israel, fuck yeah! or antisemite; Palestine, fuck yeah! or genocide supporter.

[-] randomredditor12345@lemmy.ml -1 points 10 months ago

your white narrative

Tell the Nazis my narrative is white. Tell the country clubs that banned dogs, blacks, and jews as recently as 60 years ago that my narrative is white. Tell the guy who shot up a synagogue in Pittsburgh and thought Trump was bad because he wasn't tough on Jews that my narrative isn't white. It's amazing how we are somehow both nonwhite outsiders looking to destroy the fabric of society or European imperialists looking to uphold it and it's whichever one the person viewing us thinks is bad.

[-] agressivelyPassive@feddit.de 2 points 10 months ago

And literally nothing of that has anything to do with waht you wrote before. Nothing. You jumped from "Gaza had succeses" to "this guy is antisemitic" to "if you think, this is not antisemitic, you are literally enabling violence". That is just wrong.

Again, you are unable or unwilling to accept, that "your side" can also be bad. Both sides can be bad at the same time. The Holocaust doesn't justify violence today, just as the Naqba doens't justifiy violence today.

People like you would thrive under McCarthy, Stalin or the Stasi.

[-] masquenox@lemmy.ml 4 points 10 months ago

just as the Naqba doens’t justifiy violence today.

Sooo... Palestinians should just accept their genocide quietly?

[-] randomredditor12345@lemmy.ml 0 points 10 months ago

And literally nothing of that has anything to do with waht you wrote before.

Correct. It has to do with the thing that I quoted from your comment just before writing it

Again, you are unable or unwilling to accept, that "your side" can also be bad.

Not at all. I'm not a fan of the idf or Israeli government at all. The problem is that despite the fact that they do a lot of bad stuff they're at least wouldn't exterminate the other side of they (the other side) laid their weapons down tomorrow. If the idf laid their weapons down we would see more slaughter like October 7th followed by the forces and complete dissolution of the state of Israel. It doesn't excuse some of the things the idf does but it's what makes the idf the better of the two for whatever that's worth.

The Holocaust doesn't justify violence today, just as the Naqba doens't justifiy violence today.

The correct. What justifies violence is a valid argument that it's being done in self defense. And right now Israel definitely has that.

[-] audiomodder@lemmy.blahaj.zone 25 points 10 months ago

Because conservatives in the US are using it as a playbook for the next 10 years.

[-] Akasazh@feddit.nl 25 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

I've been reading up on the Warsaw uprising. Of there anything that a people that went through that should have learned that if you corner people with no way out they will fight to the bitter end, because their life is forfeit.

But with all wars, history is the one thing by the wayside, overflown by modern day political rhetoric and fear mongering, just like back then.

Different people being likened to animals. An insult to animals and humans alike...

[-] masquenox@lemmy.ml 9 points 10 months ago

The comparisons to the Warsaw Uprising is apt.

Some would even say that it's ironic... but that's only if you don't understand what Israel has really always been about. It truly is a kapo state.

[-] TheJims@lemmy.world 24 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

We’re listening… the message is loud and clear, but the far right extremists in this country will never stop supporting Israel. They’re okay with atrocities committed against Muslims. Hell even the antisemites of the far right are cheerleaders for Israel. Meanwhile the rest of us are horrified by the actions of both sides and are fully aware that both sides are far right religious extremists.

[-] queermunist@lemmy.ml 20 points 10 months ago

far right extremists in this country will never stop supporting Israel.

Please. This is bipartisan. Biden has unlimited support for Israel.

[-] Omega_Haxors@lemmy.ml 1 points 10 months ago

Yes, Biden is in fact a far right extremist. They don't call him Jim Crow Joe for nothing.

[-] queermunist@lemmy.ml 0 points 10 months ago

You can't just lump both parties together like that!

He's a regular rightwinger. Extremism, by definition, has to be unusual. Biden is normal in American politics.

[-] Omega_Haxors@lemmy.ml 3 points 10 months ago

Yeah and normal in american politics is extremist in the civilized world.

[-] queermunist@lemmy.ml -1 points 10 months ago

😞

[-] zerfuffle@lemmy.ml 15 points 10 months ago

The Biden administration is deciding US policy in this matter.

[-] masquenox@lemmy.ml 4 points 10 months ago

So just bog-standard right-wingers, then?

[-] Omega_Haxors@lemmy.ml 3 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

It's not just the far right extremists, the average liberal is for it as well. But then again the average liberal is one villain arc from going full nazi germany, so...

[-] yogthos@lemmy.ml 0 points 10 months ago

That's right, the far right extremists who are currently in charge of US government are supporting a genocide.

[-] masquenox@lemmy.ml 14 points 10 months ago

Well, let's face it... the "western world" is listening - and it likes what it is hearing. Just like the "western world" liked what it was hearing when Hitler and the Nazis explicitly stated what they were planning to do in the run-up to WW2.

[+] rjs001@lemmygrad.ml 3 points 10 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

[deleted]

[-] Gadg8eer@lemmy.dbzer0.com -2 points 10 months ago

That's it. Launch the fucking nukes, ALL OF THEM, EVERYWHERE, at the whole goddamn region. If neither side is going to spare each other's kids, I want that whole area fucking gone.

I know that won't happen so I'm going to fucking kill myself. I hate every last one of you, humanity is nothing more than spiteful monsters and I refuse to live in a world where my choices are comfortable misery and uncomfortable misery. Moving to the middle of nowhere is not my idea of "freedom".

[-] ivanafterall@kbin.social -5 points 10 months ago

Classic.

[+] Airazz@lemmy.world -17 points 10 months ago

[removed by mod]

[-] masquenox@lemmy.ml 15 points 10 months ago

Riiiight... that's why the medieval Islamic world was a safe-haven for Jewish communities for hundreds of years - because "their holy book" told them to do genocide. You know... like Christendom was doing?

[-] Airazz@lemmy.world 0 points 10 months ago

It was never a safe haven, they either had to change religion or pay a hefty tax if they wanted to live there.

[-] masquenox@lemmy.ml 2 points 10 months ago

It was never a safe haven

You are absolutely correct... I just read about the horrible massacres Muslim carried out against Jewish people in Jerusalem in 1099. Here's an eyewitness speaking of it...

"...[our men] were killing and slaying even to the Temple of Solomon, where the slaughter was so great that our men waded in blood up to their ankles..."

Oh. Sorry. My bad. That wasn't Muslims. That was (supposedly) "Christian" Crusaders.

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