Objection

joined 2 years ago
[–] Objection@lemmy.ml 1 points 10 minutes ago

Tell that to Libya.

[–] Objection@lemmy.ml 2 points 15 hours ago

I wish it was possible to get lesser evilists to think rationally and critically examine their ideology, but they've so internalized their ideology as "rational" that they can't even recognize it as an ideology at all. They are exactly the sort of irrational, blind dogmatists they accuse everyone else of being.

[–] Objection@lemmy.ml 12 points 1 day ago

Consider also that there were people in the Red Army that were previously in the White Army.

Being in the Red Army is not equivalent to being a Senator. You don't fuck up and then go into politics and seek out a leadership position as a "second chance." That's not forgiveness, that's just failing to hold politicians accountable and letting powerful people get away with shit.

Humility is a requirement of forgiveness and seeking public office is in complete contradiction to that. You want forgiveness, go volunteer at a soup kitchen or some shit. Don't fuck up and then immediately go, "I think I deserve to be invested with power."

[–] Objection@lemmy.ml 1 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)

They absolutely are not.

I understand that you're not familiar with the symbol and that this is your first time encountering it. I can easily believe that a drunk soldier in the same boat wouldn't know the difference either. But the design of the Nazi version is distinct and recognizable, if you've seen it. The tattoo was indisputably a totenkopf and not a pirate flag. Nobody who knows what a totenkopf is would get the two confused.

The part that I take issue with is when you go around saying that nobody knew what a totenkopf was before this and therefore all criticism about it must be in bad faith. You're just projecting your own knowledge and experiences onto every other person on the planet. I knew what a totenkopf was years before this and my impression of the symbol has nothing to do with Platner, or like, Maine in general. Platner could be the greatest or the worst person in the world and it wouldn't change what I think about the symbol at all. My knowledge about and impression of the totenkopf is based on it being plastered on Nazi uniforms, and used by Neo-Nazis, not a controversy over some random Senate candidate.

It's just ridiculous that you won't even accept the possibility that people you disagree with are just wrong, that's not enough, they have to be actively malevolent and dishonest. Even in the most generous possible read of Platner, there are still red flags that would cause some people to have genuine concerns and doubts about him.

[–] Objection@lemmy.ml 2 points 2 days ago (4 children)

Because, no matter how many times you repeat "it's just a pirate symbol!!!" (how many times in this thread?) that's doesn't make it true:

It's not just a "skull and crossbones," it's the specific design that was used by the Nazis and is known as a hate symbol.

[–] Objection@lemmy.ml 4 points 2 days ago

I don't even think getting the tattoo is disqualifying, but the way he handled it was sus. Even if it was a stupid, drunk decision, it's likely he figured it out at some point afterwards, and only got it covered up when it started hurting the campaign.

The part about being a Blackwater merc though, that's pretty hard to look past. "Killer for hire turned politician." One way or another, it's a sad state of affairs that this is where we're at.

[–] Objection@lemmy.ml 7 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)

The claim that WoodScientist is trying to argue is not just that he didn't know what it meant when he got it (and that it's fine he left it after learning about it), but also that anyone criticizing the tattoo must be disingenuous, because nobody knew what the symbol was before this controversy. In fact, lots of people knew what it was, some from that sketch, some from movies and stuff, some from keeping an eye on far-right groups, etc. If anything, the only thing I'm learning about from this controversy is just how many people don't recognize it.

[–] Objection@lemmy.ml 15 points 2 days ago (2 children)

I 100% accept that people can change, but that doesn't mean I trust them in positions of power. I don't know what this weird parasocial thing is where I'm expected to never hold politicians accountable for anything.

[–] Objection@lemmy.ml -1 points 2 days ago (6 children)

The only people with obsessive knowledge of SS iconography are WW2 buffs, neonazis, and neonazi WW2 buffs.

And those of us who are high enough on their lists to spend five minutes learning to identify common symbols that indicate danger.

I think you may be the actual Nazi here.

Seriously? This is the worst thing about y'all. You simply won't allow for the possibility that criticism is even genuine, let alone legitimate. Every single time someone raises a potential concern, it's always, "You're the real Nazi!" or "You're a DNC bot!" or whatnot. As if there isn't a single person on the planet who gets worried when a guy with a Nazi tattoo and a history as a mercenary is running for office.

You can argue that Platner is a lesser evil or whatever, but this, "If you have a problem with a totenkopf tattoo, you're the real Nazi" shit is just straight up cult behavior.

[–] Objection@lemmy.ml 7 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago) (1 children)

You're right, I misremembered it. However there have been calls for France to repay the reparations which it still has not done, and Aristide was overthrown in a foreign-backed coup after calling for that.

 
 

The political compass is an attempt to reduce incredibly complicated political questions into two simple lines, and people accept it because it aligns with oversimplified narratives and cultural preconceptions.

"Liberty" and "authority" have little meaning beyond "good" and "bad." If authority is defined more rigorously, or if we use more neutral terms like "centralization" or public vs private, then it becomes a lot less clear that what we're talking about is contrary to "liberty." The private sector, and private individuals, can be just as restrictive of liberty.

Perhaps the clearest example of this is the American Civil War. The southerners were the champions of decentralization, they spoke constantly about how they were fighting for "liberty" against the supposed tyranny of the northerners - and the reason they wanted "states' rights" and decentralization is that they would be able to keep people enslaved. It was big, centralized government, that evil "authoritarian" force imposing it's authority that resulted in a greater degree of liberty. But that is not just some freak exception.

If someone can't go out at night without fear of being attacked, that person is no more "free" to go out than if they feared legal repercussions. Governments are, at their worst, no different from a criminal organization, and yet there is this tendency to assign special status to restrictions imposed by the law, rather than being on the same level as restrictions imposed by private individuals or organizations.

And again, we can see how "big government" or "authoritarianism" can increase liberty in the context of regulations, of pollution, of food safety, and of untested drugs. If I can trust regulators to stop a restaurant from serving anything unsafe, then I'm free to order anything off the menu, whereas if not, then everything's a gamble and I might feel restricted to foods I expect to be "safe," if I don't avoid the restaurant entirely.

There once was a time when states viewed things like murder as a personal dispute between families, and didn't generally get involved. This led to all kinds of generational feuds, with people killing each other over a long forgotten dispute between their great-grandfathers. Was that "liberty?" Is that something we should idealize and try to return to?

I'm sure there are people who will read this as me being "pro-authoritarian" and ignoring all the bad things done by states. But that's missing the point. The point is not that centralization or state power are always good, the point is that it's not automatically bad. Having a knee-jerk reaction against it is just oversimplifying complicated issues, and doing so in a way that lots of powerful people want you to do. Because the ruling class understands that they can wield private institutions and privatization just as they can wield public institutions.

You can't just blindly apply an idealist ideological framework of "anti-authoritarianism" to every problem and expect that to produce good results. You have to look at things on a case-by-case basis, applying class analysis.

 
 

This remains relevant as Ukraine has never apologized for these atrocities, continues to reject that these attacks constituted "genocide," and has criticized Poland for establishing July 11 as a day for commemorating the victims. And of course, it still uses the same slogans ("Slava Ukraini"), the same symbols (such as the red and black flag), and reveres Stepan Bandera (who was the head of the OUN, which in turn founded the UPA which carried out these attacks).

 

cross-posted from: https://hexbear.net/post/5524375

Context 1 2

Many abolitionists have complained to me that, as a traveling performer, I have not spoken to my audiences on the issue of slavery. I have received many angry letters attacking me based on assumptions about what my silence means.

Allow me to make my position clear: I oppose the institution of slavery. In the words of Thomas Jefferson, I believe it is a "moral depravity." I feel that way about other things as well.

After the raid on Harper's Ferry, the mood among Southern leaders was an existential panic and unstoppable lust for revenge. It reminded me of the Alamo. There was no reasoning with those leaders, nor could action be taken by congress. It would have required replacing most of congress and overturning decades of bipartisan negotiation and compromises. Even in the best case, it would have taken years.

But even worse, the abolitionist, pro-Negro movement quickly decided that their primary goal was not merely opposition to the reprisals or specifically cruel owners, but opposition to the entire institution of slavery, that is, opposition to the entire way of life of Southern plantation owners. And here they decided to draw the line between decent people and oppressive tyrants, which had the following consequences:

It shrunk the coalition. Most southerners support slavery. Anyone who supports the solution of having slave states and free states supports slavery.

It was politically infeasible. What is the pathway that takes us from the present situation to the abolition of slavery as an institution? I do not see how it could happen without a total collapse of the union. As usual, these Jacobins have championed a doomed cause.

The abolitionists have been distributing hundreds of pamphlets about the horrid conditions of slaves. The main effect of this has been to create a population of people in a constant state of bloodboiling rage with no consequential political outlet.

I fear this may be worse than useless. Yes, there are disingenuous proponents of slavery dismissing and censoring all criticism of slavery on the pretext of "states' rights." But there's also valid fear of historical government overreach and that fear gives power to pro-slavery leaders who say that only they can protect Southern culture.

Does this mean slavery should not be criticized? Absolutely not. But it's something I do not wish to contribute to unless if not outweighed by tangible benefits.

Many abolitionists have been single-mindedly focused on slavery, and the willingness of the Republicans to compromise on the issue, and that focus has had the following effects:

Not a single slave was freed by their efforts. Not one fewer lash was delivered by the owners.

It may have slightly contributed to the election of James Buchanan, ensuring that nothing can be done to stop the expansion of slavery into new states. Buchanan also does not support giving women like me the right to vote. A perfectly enlightened being would feel no bitterness about this, but I do.

None of this is the fault of slaves, of course, who are overwhelmingly the victims here.

But if women like me are ever going to get anywhere in this country, we need a broad movement that stands up for the rights of ALL women, REGARDLESS of their views on slavery.

 

"By your logic, you could justify a foreign armed insurgency against the US government" smuglord

link

 

Wait shit, I gotta come up with a different bit. Germans are already a thing.

 
 
 

Post criticizes Trump for lifting sanctions on Syria and calls Julani "a known terrorist" linked to "the deaths and injuries of dozens of American troops."

If this isn’t enough to flex your second amendment rights, kiss your fucking country good bye. We’ll be building a wall on the 49th

Yeah, you know, I was fine with all this other stuff, but "lifting sanctions on Syria" is my red line, that's the thing I'm really gonna fight and die for.

Doing Business with LITERAL TERRORISTS is a BIG BRAIN BUSINESS MOVE that will HELP the US!

Kill all the Americans you want as long as you bribe the toddler-in-chief…

It's so easy to get these people to hate foreigners. Literally just a random post from a random guy, they know nothing about the situation or the history and don't care to look into it before just agreeing with whatever.

How can any US friendly leader feel safe when Americans are insane chauvinists who are so fickle and uninformed, so ready to turn on them at the drop of a hat? Bribing/appeasing the ruling class is their only shot.

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