Plumbing

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A place for Plumbers and those interested in Plumbing to ask questions and discuss the trade.

Community guidelines:

If you have a plumbing question please include a picture in your post.

If you have a question such as "does this look correct?" please include the code your area adheres to. If you're not sure please include state/province/country you're in. Codes can vary state to state and what's wrong in one area may be perfectly acceptable in another.

Just as codes vary, prices do too. That's why we won't discuss any pricing because there's so many factors that can't or shouldn't be conveyed to strangers over the internet.

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This is a post I originally created on the r/plumbing subreddit and am migrating here. I'll be updating and adding to this guide occasionally. Hopefully you find this helpful and informative!

Why would you want to be a Plumber? Well for me and many others it can be a rewarding career that leaves you feeling accomplished at the end of most days and every day can be different. Technology is always advancing, and new methods come along that make things easier and simpler. You’re always learning something new as a Plumber because codes change and every job is a little different. This keeps the job interesting. Many people view Plumbers and tradespeople in general as people who were too dumb to go to college and couldn’t get any other job. That is far from the truth though as being a successful Plumber requires continuous education and training. Plumbing is a career that will always be in demand everywhere in the world, can’t be outsourced and will likely never be (completely) taken over by robots in any of our lifetimes. There’s also the fact that you won’t have to deal with crippling debt from student loans, and you can make good money quickly out of school.

I’m doing this to help people everywhere, but codes/licensing/etc… can be different in many states so you should do your research before getting too far ahead of yourself. I live in the Northeast US (MA/RI) so that’s where my experiences apply.

Some frequently asked questions:

Am I too old to get into Plumbing?

Probably not! Obviously the younger you start the better, but there’s no age requirement to being a Plumber. Just know that Plumbing, like most construction trades, is a very physical job and can be hard on your body. The physical toll is something to consider when getting into any trade, and might be a turn off to you. Always wear PPE to keep yourself from getting injured.

How much money do Plumbers make? Salaries vary from state to state, so it’s best to research your local area. Here is a list of Plumber salaries updated in 2016. Search for job listings on Indeed to get a sense of pay scale. Big cities pay much higher than small towns. Plumbing is just the start. There are many other related licenses (if your state requires them) that you can attain which may increase your value to an employer. Honestly you probably won’t be rich unless you own an established company, but you’ll be comfortable if you’re responsible with your money.

Do I need to be “in shape” to be a Plumber?

Well, technically no, but it helps. It is a very physical job and the healthier you are, the easier things will be for you, and the people you’re working with. As an apprentice you’ll likely be tasked with digging, carrying and lifting, so the more fit you are the better. Also, being overweight will amplify the physical toll that being a plumber can have on your body.

I’m a girl, can I be a Plumber?

Yes! I know a few female Plumbers. I imagine it would be more difficult for female Plumbers because of the general atmosphere of construction trades and the ratio of men to women. That won’t change unless you ladies apply to jobs and learn the trade though, so go for it!

Do I have to touch poop?

Well, maybe… But in all reality it depends on the type of plumbing you’re doing. If you’re doing new construction the chances of touching poop are very low as you’ll be installing brand new piping systems. Service calls are much more likely to involve human dookie because often times you’re freeing blockages and repairing faulty plumbing systems. Personally I very rarely have to deal with doodoo as I do a lot of new construction and remodel work. But your mileage will vary. Ask what type of jobs your prospective company takes on and go from there.

I come from I.T. and have no experience working with my hands, does that matter?

No. There’s several guys at my shop that were hired with zero plumbing experience and are being trained and put through school to get their license. Does it help to have some experience, of course, but I wouldn’t say it’s necessary. A lot of jobs can help you being a Plumber because it involves a little bit of everything. There is a lot of problem solving. The most important thing is that you like to learn, and learn from your mistakes.

Okay, I want to pursue this, where do I start?

Well there is a lot of variables, age, location, experience etc… First you need to decide whether you’ll join a union shop or an “open” shop. I have no experience with unions so maybe someone else can chime in on this one (if the post wasn’t locked :-/). From what i hear, unions are difficult to get into and subject to nepotism. Once you’re in they have good benefits and pay very well. Some unions are also much more busy than others, Boston MA for example is very busy with all the new buildings going up. Union shops tend to work on larger projects which can last months/years which can have you doing the same task over and over again. You can find more information about unions and locate one close to your area here.

A family run shop is the method I’ve personally had success with. Your best bet to find one of these jobs is by going to craigslist/indeed and looking in your area for shops looking for apprentices or helpers. If you’re really motivated you can go to your local Plumbing supply store and ask if any of the companies in the area are hiring. Many will say experience preferred but will train the right candidate. These types of shops tend to focus on smaller projects, custom homes and service calls. The job you’re doing can be different every day.

Another type of company that is always looking for “plumbers” is the RotoRooter type companies. This might be the quickest way to get into the trade. My suggestion would be to avoid these types of companies. It’s usually very dirty jobs and they work on commission. There’s a lot of pressure to make sales, and a lot of the time they’ll lie to customers about things that need to be replaced just to get a bigger check. That’s no way to do business. I know this is a generalization and some people have a lot of success, but it’s my opinion based on what people say who are in the business.

There’s a college that offers an accelerated plumbing class, should I take that?

No, I wouldn’t suggest it. These courses charge thousands more than a traditional trade school class and teach you the same material. They also may require you to take additional non plumbing related classes which is a waste of time. The few guys I know that have taken these types of classes are well…not the best plumbers. Not to say that you’re dumb if that’s the path you did take, just sharing my personal experience. Don’t waste your money on online courses either. The best education you can get is from working hands on, in the field. If you want additional education before you start at a company it would be beneficial to study up on the different types of fittings/materials/tools that are used for Plumbing.

What should I expect on an interview?

Don’t wear a suit and tie. Some people will tell you different things. Personally I think the safest option is to make sure your clothes are clean and presentable. Your fashion sense isn’t high on the list of qualifications so don’t sweat it. Some interviews can be very informal, some might be more professional. It depends on the company. They may ask you to take a drug test/physical. Don’t do drugs. No one will want to work with you if you’re always high. Be ready to start working ASAP.

My first day is tomorrow, what should i do to prepare?

Make sure you show up well rested/sober/on time. First impressions are very important as with any job. Try to listen and watch as much as you can. Always ask questions if you’re unsure of something. Work hard and show your boss that you’re serious about the job. There’s nothing more frustrating than having your helper looking at his phone while you need something, keep it in your pocket until break time!

BRING BASIC HAND TOOLS. Here is a list in order of importance that you’ll want to have on your first day:

1.	Tape measure
2.	Marker/Pencil
3.	PPE (Gloves, Safety Glasses, Boots, Knee pad)

Wear sturdy work shoes and appropriate clothing!

This should get you through your first day. Plumbers use a ridiculous amount of tools, there’s a tool for everything. Most companies will supply power tools but require you to buy basic hand tools. Start out buying the basics. Everyone’s needs will be different but here’s a list of basic tools that I keep in my tool bag/pockets that I take on every job. Tape measure, sharpie, pencil, torpedo level, knive(s), hammer, two pairs of pump pliers, adjustable wrenches of varying sizes, philips screwdriver, flathead screwdriver, beater flathead, 6 in 1 screwdriver, flashlight, torque wrench, speed square, tubing cutter, mini cutter, pipe dope, teflon tape, electrical tape, pex cutter. Again everyone is different and you will eventually need to have a lot more tools, this is just a general list.

If you like to learn you can make this a satisfying career and maybe make a little money in the process.

Ultimately I am just some guy on the internet, and if you are actually serious about plumbing as a career you should do research on your own because things could be different where you live! YouTube is a good resource for general knowledge. Try to learn about other trades too!

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Hello everyone, I was in my basement a little while ago and saw this pile of soap suds coming out of what I believe is the sump?

This hasn't happened before, but i think it's relevant that we've got a baby so I'm washing a fuckton of bottles and using a fuckton of soap. Could that cause this?

If it's not that, how concerned should I be? Thanks in advance

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Original post (Thursday, April 30th):

Hello, c/plumbing, I'm back for another round of troubleshooting and need your help again, please.

Background: Yesterday my water heater stopped putting out hot water. Since I own my home, I decided to troubleshoot on my own before I call a professional plumber.


Ninja Edit 1 (additional background): Yesterday when we first noticed a problem, we were getting room temperature water, just warm enough to shower but still somewhat chilly, like the temp you get when you're about to run out of hot water. As of today, our "hot" water isn't even room temperature anymore, it's the same as our cold water (noticeably cooler than it was on Day 1).


(back to the original post)

What I've tried so far: With power turned off, I removed the cover panel and checked the reset button on the top thermostat, but it was not tripped (no click), so today I picked up a multimeter and tested resistance and continuity on both heating elements as demonstrated in this video. Both elements passed both tests - the resistance tests read between 12.7 and 12.9 ohms, and the continuity tests beeped. I also did a ground test, which read no resistance. So far, so good.

Where I'm stuck: At the electric panel I flipped the power back on for my water heater so I could do a voltage test at the thermostats and heating elements as demonstrated in this video. Even though my no-contact voltage tester detects hot wires (first photo), with the multimeter probes touching the topmost screws on the thermostat and/or the two screws for the heating element (second photo) my multimeter reads 0.0 volts in AC voltage mode (third photo). I've tested the multimeter on an electrical outlet and confirmed it reads 124 volts as expected (fourth photo), so I think the multimeter itself is functioning properly. I tried switching the probes, which made no difference (as expected b/c AC).

Any pointers on what I should try next? Since the multimeter doesn't read any voltage at the top thermostat, I'm not sure if this indicates an issue w/ the thermostat or if my testing process is flawed. Thank you!

Photos:

Voltage tester detects hot wires at top thermostat on water heater

Multimeter probes touching topmost screws of top thermostat on water heater

Multimeter reads zero volts at top thermostat on water heater

Multimeter reads 124 volts at electrical outlet


Ninja Edit 2 (more photos from my original testing):

I've also touched the multimeter probes to the screws on the heating element even though I originally only posted photos showing me testing the thermostat - here are the two additional photos that I should've included in the OP:

Multimeter probes touching two screws of top heating element on water heater

Multimeter reads zero volts at top heating element on water heater


Edit 3 (terminal-to-ground tested each terminal individually + more photos):

I went back out there and re-checked each terminal individually (terminal to ground) for the top and bottom thermostats and heating elements. In all cases, readings came back between 124 and 126 vac.

Multimeter probes, top thermostat, terminal 1 to ground

Multimeter readout, top thermostat, terminal 1 to ground

Multimeter probes, top thermostat, terminal 2 to ground

Multimeter readout, top thermostat, terminal 2 to ground

Multimeter probes, top heating element, terminal 1 to ground

Multimeter readout, top heating element, terminal 1 to ground

I appear to have reached the limit for image uploads on a Lemmy post, but I also terminal-to-ground tested the other terminal for the top heating element and repeated these same tests for the bottom thermostat and heating element, and all of them show between 124 and 126 vac.

Where to go from here:

From these tests I believe I can conclude that all of the components (both thermostats and heating elements) are at least receiving power from the grid, although I am perplexed as to why when I connect both multimeter probes to both terminals at the same time, the multimeter reads 0 vac, which seems different from the second video that I linked above (here's that link again).

Given these latest test results and the fact that both heating elements passed earlier continuity tests w/ the power off and wires disconnected, any ideas what to check next? Is it time to just replace all four components and see if we get our hot water back?

Edit 3.1:

I'll look again for a rogue light switch and check the individual wires and if necessary the conduit cabling as suggested in the comments, then I'll report back. I do have an appointment that I need to scurry off to at the moment, but I'll get back to this in a few hours. Thank you!


Edit 4: After testing the individual wires at the top thermostat, there appears to be a fault somewhere between the top left wire and the circuit breaker. I tested at the circuit breaker and measured normal readings (125.4, 125.7, and 250 vac), so my next step is to investigate under the conduit on top of the water heater like Cataphract suggested. I want to thank everyone for getting me to this point. Your support has been amazing, truly beyond words. I'm about to call it a night tonight, then tomorrow I'll pick up where we left off and continue updating this thread. Thanks again!


Edit 5 (Tuesday, May 5th - after being visited by the electrician):

On Saturday w/ the power off and both wires disconnected from their respective terminals at the circuit breaker and the water heater, I checked for breaks in the wires between the circuit breaker and the water heater, which are about 20 feet apart (ordered some extension leads specifically for this test). In resistance and continuity modes the multimeter shows open line for the white wire and good line for the black wire, after which I'd reached the limits of my ability/desire to continue troubleshooting, so I called and scheduled an electrician to come out on Tuesday (today).

Fast forward to today (Tuesday), electrician comes out, I explain that my multimeter reads 0 vac at the thermostat and detects an open line on that white wire, so I believe it to be a power supply issue. He disagrees w/ my diagnosis, thinks a bad element could cause 0 vac reading at the thermostat, and recommends sending a plumber. The plumber is under the same roof as the electrician, and this company has decent ratings on Yelp, so despite my skepticism I accept his recommendation to have the plumber come out and take a look.

So the plumber is coming out later this afternoon. I'll explain the situation to him and if he agrees w/ the electrician that it's likely an issue w/ the thermostat and/or heating element, I'll let him do his thing and then either we'll have hot water (hallelujah) or we won't (boo).

Stay tuned...

Edit 5.1: Holy shit, we back, baybee let'z gooo!

Okay, so while the electrician was here, he inspected the wire connections on top of the water heater and noted that the wires were not braided, so he re-did them for me and put the caps back on. I fessed up to having disconnected them and putting them back wrong during my troubleshooting adventures. Keep in mind that at this point, I had thought the issue was with the white wire itself, and he thought the issue was one of the heating elements, so neither one of us thought to test the hot water after he tweaked that.

Fast forward 90 minutes, I go wash my hands in the bathroom, and after 10 or 15 seconds I notice the water's getting warm. I immediately run upstairs to test the shower, and holy shit, it's working! She's alive!

Literally me:

I must admit that I'm still perplexed b/c I thought I had ruled out that connection point as a possibility when I tested each end of the white wire from the circuit breaker to the top of the water heater for continuity, but if there has ever been a time when I'm glad to be wrong, this is it.

I would like to once again thank @Darkassassin07@lemmy.ca and @Cataphract@lemmy.ml for their invaluable advice and support. And I would be remiss if I didn't also thank my gf for her patience while we rode this out - in Cataphract's words, an absolute saint! 😘

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Original post:

So I'm on my way to the store to pick up a voltage tester b/c our showers have been noticeably room temperature today. We own our place so I'm attempting some basic DIY troubleshooting steps before I call a plumber. Found this 4-minute video guide to resetting an electric water heater. At 2:30 into the video, right after the plumber removes the cover plate and insulation, the white plastic cover in the video has two holes, and the top hole supposedly has a big red button to reset it.

I've already flipped off the circuit breaker and removed the metal cover plate. The problem is, on mine the white plastic covering on the thermostat only has one hole, there is no big red reset button on my thermostat. Any tips on where else to look for the big red reset button? If it makes any difference, I am located in the US, and I believe the brand of my water heater is State Select, model number ES652DORT 210.

Side question - should I take steps to protect myself against the outer insulation wrapped around the overall water heater? I kinda just went in there guns blazing and didn't think about gloves, masks, etc.

Photos:

Water heater in the closet w/ outer insulation pulled open around lower cover plate

Close-up of water heater w/ lower cover plate removed

Close-up of water heater w/ lower cover plate and white plastic cover over thermostat removed

Thanks in advance for everyone's help!

EDIT: Today I learned there are two thermostats, and the big red reset button is on the top one! Unfortunately, pressing it did not click like I was hoping. This leads me to believe I have a bad heating element as suggested in the comments. My next step is to get a multimeter so I can check continuity, resistance, and amperage. Thanks to those who have weighed in so far.

Photos of the top thermostat:

Water heater in the closet w/ outer insulation pulled open around upper cover plate

Close-up of water heater w/ upper cover plate removed

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The house I live in has an existing oil-based boiler for both heat and hot water. The hot water tank (50 gallons) will likely need to be replaced in the next few years as it is more than 10 years old, probably approaching 15. I am on well water without a water softener, and I assume that the previous owners never did any sort of maintenance with the current hot water tank. (A neighbor mentioned that there is some sacrificial part that can be replaced every so often to extend the life of the tank.)

I keep reading that the hybrid heat pump water heaters are incredibly efficient, and I hate having to burn oil during the warmer months just to heat my showers. My plumber tells me that it's a really efficient system and that I should keep it intact as long as I can. He also seems a bit old school in his opinion and preferences, as he scoffs at the idea that I would eventually like to replace the whole boiler and system with a heat pump system instead.

Is there a good place to learn about how my existing system works, and any way to compare to possible savings (or pitfalls) of switching to a new system? Are there other options, such as tankless hot water heaters, that I should consider? I gather that recovery time with a hybrid heat pump water heater will be much slower than the existing system, so should I also calculate for a larger system (65 or 80 gallons)? Two adults live here full time but we frequently host guests and family gatherings, and we sometimes need enough hot water for 10 or so adults to shower. There are three full bathrooms in the house and one day we may add a fourth.

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I live in a condo (40ish yo) and recently a neighbor in an adjacent building had a leak and the board suggested that everyone have a plumber come inspect their units. I just inspected and found various levels of corrosion at most joints with the included photo the worst looking of the bunch.

How concerning does this appear?

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submitted 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) by dysprosium@lemmy.dbzer0.com to c/plumbing@lemmy.world
 
 

The nut broke off and had a small red ring/gasket between these connectors. I'm an noob but can follow instructions. Please give suggestions. Thanks

Below there is a water valve Water valve which may be used as an alternative if the above (cupper?) pipe is inconvenient to use.

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Hi Plumbers,

I found that my water pressure from the utility is 100psi, code here is 80psi. So I got some quotes for a pressure reducer valve.

Every quote I got doesn't include an expansion tank. I have a large tank water heater with no expansion tank preinstalled, and the plumbers keep on coming back without including the expansion tank, then I come back and say it should get an expansion tank, and they come back offering to install one as well, but always with weird excuses like:

  1. That's not really required for code, but we'll do it (yes it is!)
  2. The water heater should've had one (no! only required when the pressure doesn't have anywhere to go... like back to the utility mains)!

What's going on here? Why are the pros doing that?

(local code: Seattle, WA, Cascadia)

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The new aerator is 1.5gal/minute. I have no idea what the old one was. When I remove it, flow at the sprayer is much greater. I don't understand how the aerator restricts flow to the sprayer. Is there any way to improve this? 1.5gal was the highest they had at the hardware store

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It steadily has dropped for a year or more and I can't take it anymore. If I replace will they fix? I pulled it off and even with the water off there is still water coming out of the pipe at a slow, slow drip pace. Is it the water shut off that needs help? Would of course prefer the cheaper fix but if a new head isn't going to stop the leak it'd be good to know.

TIA

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You know the temperature thing you turn round from like 0 to 5 depending on how hot you want it to be? Well I think, in trying to turn it off I may have turned it too far. As the it just keeps turning but in a jerky movement and the number doesn’t change if that makes sense? Like there’s a little plastic arrow that points up at the setting it’s on, so that you know what setting it’s on. But now it’s like the whole thing is turning rather than just the plastic cover with the numbers on.

So I think (well I’m hoping cos the opposite would be worse) that it’s now turned completely off and there is no way to turn it on. But because the whole thing is turning and the numbers don’t change up or down regardless of which way you turn it, it’s possible it could be on any one of the 0-5 settings but only stuck as showing on 0.

Hopefully this is the right place to post this and someone has some idea…?

Cheers!

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Until we have our old steel pipes replaced, we're dealing with rust that apparently gets caught in our faucet cartridges, thereby causing drips. We've had to replace them regularly. It seems like such a waste to throw out the entire cartridge when just the ceramic pieces and a washer cause the problem.

So rebuild kits aren't available anywhere? I've searched with all the keywords I can think of.

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You can hear the flush in the beginning, and a few seconds later a loud knock under the sink area. If I understand, water hammer is from the incoming water stopping suddenly and moving the pipes, but this is definitely elsewhere along the outflow.

Worth mentioning this only happens with solid waste and liquid doesn't do it. Kinda sounds like the outflow pipes are knocking against something when there's bulk in there.

Does this sound kind something to be remedied? Thanks for your help!

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Why would this happen? Should I try replacing the wire nut and turning it back on or is there something deeper going on? Thanks for any tips!

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Since we moved in we've noticed a sewer smell from time to time. I had a plumber come and identify this laundry discharge pipe not having a trap as the culprit. He ended up ghosting me so I cut more into the wall and found this black thing I couldn't identify until now (I think). I guess it's a drum trap after doing some more googling. If it's working as designed I guess it's supposed to hold water in and not let sewer gas through? but we definitely have a problem with the smell coming from this laundry room. Is this maybe not to culprit and I could leave it alone? I'm considering cutting it out and just connecting PVC the whole way through. Any recommendations or thoughts would be much appreciated.

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And here's after I replaced most of it, only thing I didn't replace was from the coupling back to the meter

https://imgur.com/a/axAU8up

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Just figured I'd add some content here so I'm just going through old photos/videos.

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This is just what our builders are having us use to convert from the pex underground to the main for the house. So if it's breaks the only way shutting off the water is the curb. So shitty.

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Mine just exploded and poured about 10 gallons of water under my cabinets. Looking for recommendations for a new one that is reliable.

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I've spent 20 years doing high-end resi now I'm trying commercial. Hit me with your best tips brothers and sisters.

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I live in Europe. And for me interested which material use in other parts of world for plumbing. For example in new build houses for both types water used plastic pipe. but for heat used cooper pipe. which material used in your region?

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Should i be concerned about the blue/green water stains around pipes? If so, should i be replacing the pipe or just clean and move on with life?

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The connections under my sink have a flexible tube that I'd like to replace with rigid tube. The stub out from the wall doesn't have the nut and threaded connection I've seen before, and they've used what I think is called a no-hub connector.

Would I use the no-hub connector on the rigid tube or do I sweat something like this on? https://www.brasscraft.com/product/1-12-in-o-d-tube-x-1-12-in-fip-3/ Or is there some other way?

I've soldered the narrower water supply lines, but nothing this large. Is there anything to consider other than heating it longer?

The stub out has corroded on the bottom and there's a thin crack that the no-hub fitting covers, so there isn't a leak now, but I don't know if that will be covered if I sweat on a connector. Is there a way to deal with that crack?

As some extra info, I think that some stubs are threaded into the vertical pipe. This isn't threaded in and doesn't look like it can be removed without opening the wall and replacing it.

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