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'We are all Gisèle': French women rise up against 'rape culture' during Gisèle Pelicot trial (www.usatoday.com)

submitted 2 months ago by MicroWave@lemmy.world to c/world@lemmy.world

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They line up in front of a courthouse in southeastern France, from morning to evening, and have gathered in the thousands in cities across the country. They hold signs reading, "one rape every six minutes," "not all men but always a man," and "giving in is not consenting."

They chant: "Rapist we see you, victim we believe you."

Women across France are rallying in support of Gisèle Pelicot, a 72-year-old reluctant icon whose husband is on trial in the city of Avignon for systematically drugging her and inviting dozens of men, 50 of whom are now his co-defendants, into their home to rape her over nearly a decade.

The shocking case has sparked what many women in France call a long-overdue reckoning over "rape culture" and systemic sexism in the way the judicial system handles sexual violence.

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[-] moon@lemmy.ml 55 points 2 months ago

Came here to see discussions about the truly insane case mentioned in the article. Actually found an entire comment section full of 'not all men' vs 'basically all men' threads

[-] barsoap@lemm.ee 24 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

Do I want to scroll down? Nah, not really.

I'll just leave this here: No, not all men are rapists. Yes, all men should stand up to them. It's that simple and if you deviate from that formula you dive into rape culture or misandry, depending, are part of the problem, actively, passively, in one way or the other.

As a man, have this attitude (there's subtitles).

As a woman... "Dudes it's only an embellishment" "noone thinks 'all men' is meant seriously" STFU you're being catty you know exactly how often women use covert aggression, use plausible deniability to get away with the vilest shit, even if you don't mean it like that right now, in this instance, it's still how it's perceived, and no, not all men deserve to be treated like that. So cut it out.

[-] scarabic@lemmy.world 4 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

The internet loves to argue with a generalization that is only true 9,999 times out of ten thousand.

[-] ArcaneSlime@lemmy.dbzer0.com -1 points 2 months ago

Help me with the math on this, if "it's always men" 9,999 out of 10,000 times, and I've personally been raped by two women, what're my odds on that? I must be getting all the rape the women of the world can dish out then, huh?

Couldn't possibly be that men seldom report, seldom are taken seriously when they do, and even when they are taken seriously in many places women can't legally "rape" so the best they can get a slap on the wrist for is "Sexual Assault" for forcing men to have sex with them? Could it? No waaaaayyyyy.

[-] scarabic@lemmy.world 0 points 2 months ago

Instead of letting my numbers make you feel small, perhaps think for a second how enormous the problem of male sexual assault is. That’s the math help you need here.

[-] ArcaneSlime@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 2 months ago

I agree, male sexual assault is a problem and nobody is talking about it. In fact when we (males who have been sexually assaulted) try and, not even "be included," just "not be excluded," we're told to sit down and shut up, we're only 4% so we don't matter, we must've liked it if our body responded naturally to stimulus, she was hot anyway so we're lucky, and quit being a pussy." In fact legally in my area and many more the worst the women who forced me to have sex with them even could be charged with is sexual assault becausr technically "rape" requires penetration. Isn't that fucked up?

How 'bout instead of trying to silence male victims of sexual assault when they're rightfully indignant about being excluded you do a little soul searching and try and realize why we "always have to make the conversation about us" when people write signs like "not all men but always a man," m'kay? Maybe that introspection will lead you to opinions like "rape is possible for women to commit, and it's bad when they do it too, AND we should speak for all victims of all genders or lack thereof, and against all abusers of all genders or lack thereof, rather than 'men bad women good nonbinary irrelevant.'"

[-] scarabic@lemmy.world 0 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

How 'bout instead of trying to silence male victims of sexual assault when they're rightfully indignant about being excluded you do a little soul searching

Dude you’re desperately trying to make this about you and aiming all your complaints about society at me when I have done exactly nothing you describe.

Here we are, in a thread about a woman being raped, with you lecturing me about how much male rape matters. That just says everything right there.

If you think no one online talks about or cares about male rape then you just aren’t listening. It’s one of Reddit’s favorite topics. They never miss a chance to highlight male rape, and threads about it get 100x the love of those discussing the problem of rape by males. Your issue is, in a word, overrepresented if anything.

You matter. Your trauma matters. You really seem to need to hear that. But yeah your assault is not in fact interchangeable with that of women. Theirs is the result of systematic devaluing and oppression of women across our culture that makes assault almost inevitable. Yours is a deplorable act of violence but not continuous with the entire fabric of our society.

In other words, we’re set up to rape females. And so we’d better talk about that. What do we do to prevent much more rare and isolated incidents of violence? I’m really not sure how much we have to say about that.

Anyway I won’t reply again or read replies. It’s been said.

[-] ArcaneSlime@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 2 months ago

"Overrepresented"

"Always a man."

Yeah, I guess it has been said. Fuck me for calling out bullshit when I see it, I should just sit down and shut up again, huh?

Good, don't reply.

[+] rekabis@lemmy.ca -6 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

Then maybe you should understand that women rape men as frequently as men rape women:

And now the real surprise: when asked about experiences in the last 12 months, men reported being “made to penetrate”—either by physical force or due to intoxication—at virtually the same rates as women reported rape (both 1.1 percent in 2010, and 1.7 and 1.6 respectively in 2011).

In other words, if being made to penetrate someone was counted as rape—and why shouldn’t it be?—then the headlines could have focused on a truly sensational CDC finding: that women rape men as often as men rape women.

Now consider: how many women do you see convicted and jailed for rape?

crickets

That’s the sound of massive gender bigotry in play, right there - 50% of all cross-gender rapists getting away Scott-free, purely by virtue of their gender.

[-] Akasazh@feddit.nl 15 points 2 months ago

His point is that is not what the article is about. It's off-topic.

I get that you're passionate about getting your point across but it's swamping the discussion a bit.

[-] Mango@lemmy.world 4 points 2 months ago

It's not off topic. If you link me to a YouTube video with a sponsor that really sucks, I'm gonna talk about how that sponsor sucks. You can't just tack on some garbage and be all "just ignore that part, it's not up for debate."

[-] Akasazh@feddit.nl 1 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

I understand that it merits discussion but every thread on this post is about that aspect, and that's frankly a bit much.

[-] Mango@lemmy.world 4 points 2 months ago

Show me a sign that's demonizing me, and I'm gonna focus on that rather than whatever they're pretending the sign is about. You teach your boys that their feelings don't matter and that they're bad out the gate and that's how they're gonna treat you when they're older.

[-] rekabis@lemmy.ca 4 points 2 months ago

You teach your boys that their feelings don't matter and that they're bad out the gate

Cue mandatory anti-rape training at higher ed, but only for men, ramming home the myth that men are the source of all of society’s ills and the villain in all possible crimes.

[-] Akasazh@feddit.nl 2 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

Whoa that escalated quickly, and is entirely not about what I was saying.

[-] Mango@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago

Well if you wanna be on topic, address the problem instead of making it worse. We're in here criticizing those people making it worse. Quit defending their bullshit.

[-] Akasazh@feddit.nl 3 points 2 months ago

I didn't defend anybody. You don't get to put words in my mouth like that.

this post was submitted on 06 Oct 2024

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