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Removal of piracy communities
(lemmy.world)
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this post was submitted on 15 Aug 2023
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Okay, I don't agree here. These Lemmy servers are hosted largely by people, not organizations or LLCs, and individuals being legally liable is a problem.
This isn't twenty years ago where the Internet was a wild West and most things actually ended up flying, the modern legal reality is so complicated and if you want it differently, you host a Lemmy instance and federate with as much illegal activity as you want.
Lemmy.world is aiming to be the mainstream and pallet able Lemmy instance for the masses, let it be that, it's their choice
There were huge legal battles against internet piracy 20 years ago, probably more than now, then it took a bit of a breather, maybe because of things like Steam, Netflix, iPod, Spotify.
The American nefarious laws remain though. Share an mp3 and get your whole life ruined, and that started already in the 90's.
They didn't defederate, they simply blocked that community from being hosted locally on lemmy.world. The admins of lemmy.world cannot moderate the content coming from a community hosted on another instance. They can only moderate content that originates here.
I seriously doubt after the Reddit fiasco last month that "pirating" is the reason the largest number of users are here. Considering the population went up by like a factor of 10 and about zero came because of pirating....
Lemme World doesn't want a fight and resources lost to that fight that they can't win. This is a smart logical decision.
Would you let some 1000 people stash their stolen goods in your house? Do you think the police would give you a break? Think about it. If lemmy.world is forced to shut down because it hosted illegal materials where will the plus side be?
Analogies are generally terrible at convincing people, and even more so when it's about legal situations.
The process would be that they get sent some notice that something they're hosting violates copyright law, and that it needs to be taken down or a lawsuit will happen. Unless they ignore it, and they should definitely not do that, then nothing else happens. If they get a lot of them from a certain community or instance, then they discuss why those mods/admin can't keep their community in order, and if it becomes enough of a hassle, defederation or blocking is prudent.
Copyright law can be pretty ridiculous, no argument there, but this is well trodden stuff here. lemmy.world is not the first social media website that has had this concern.
But it is alone in its unique capabilities as an all-volunteer free site. That's not to say other free+volunteer sites don't exist, but, rather, that we can't lump it with others since they'll have their own goals for providing their free instances. And it obviously can't be compared to "social media sites", as that carries implicit connotation of for-profit sites.
What specifically would you say makes copyright law apply differently to lemmy.world?
That it doesn't matter if they're right or wrong, they can't afford the lawyers to fight it? Seriously pirates, there's an easy solution, just host your own instance.
Like I said, this isn't new ground being traversed. There is a pretty straightforward method for dealing with this that doesn't involve lawsuits unless the LW admins intentionally ignore the process.
People here are acting as if LW is some unique thing and that copyright law is an unknown entity. We know how this works. The person I responded to seems to think that LW is somehow unique, and I would like to understand their thought process.
Or spend that time creating your instance maybe?
This rebuttal you keep falling back on makes no sense. What do you think it's refuting?
Poor reading comprehension. You've said the same thing three times and every reply has nothing to do with what you said.
You are indeed very wise, fuckfuckmyfuckingass.
I only commented so I could type out your username haha.
Thanks Joe,
You have great reading comprehension!
How does it not make sense for you guys to be unhappy with how this instance works so you leave and take all of the responsibility on yourselves by creating your own instance?
I might end up leaving-- more for the ban stuff than the blocking piracy stuff-- but that's wholly beside the point when it comes to whether copyright law works like people are suggesting. It doesn't. The LW admins aren't going to be unexpectedly served papers for a lawsuit. They're going to get a boilerplate email with information on a claim of copyright infringement and they're going to remove the content without question and that will be the end of it.
Like I said, "just leave if you don't like it" has nothing to do with the point I'm making.
Meh, it just sounds like whining at best.
How does "that's not how this works" sound like whining? I can't tell if you're just not reading anything, or if you are desperately trying to have a different conversation with me than the one I'm having.
Lemmy.world does not have the ability to moderate posts on other instances. If lemmy.world gets a notice about something federating from another instance, how would they be able to do anything about it?
The local instance admins actually can hide posts and comments from other instances. Of course it only affect what the users see on their local instance.
More like a surgical strike, compared to the nuclear option of blocking entire communities.
Is this true? I understood the lemmy moderation capabilities that any post, even non-local ones, could be removed from an instance, and any user, even non-local ones, could be banned from a community or the entire instance.
Is this not the case?
I think the best solution is for you to host your own instance and allow these pirate communities on your own server.
That would solve the problem and this is actually the strength of the fediverse. So go ahead , but be aware of the consequences of hosting it.
I am pro piracy but I 100 % understand that the admins here do not want to risk anything. They surely do not have the security set up for that. But as I wrote, anyone who wants and dares can do it. Just don’t accuse other people who do not want to take the risk.
For these communities on other instances, just get an account there. It takes a few minutes.
What makes this place so good is that you can make an account on another instance and go about your business. .world is the biggest instance and will be the first one targeted if anyone decides to crack down, legitimate reason or no.
The fediverse has no “top”. This is it the strength of the fediverse showing? You are completely free to join those subs through other servers, exactly because there is no “top”.
Or you can stay with an instance that tries to stay legal. If you want all the gray area / illegal stuff, you can even start your own server to facilitate that, and see how long it’s allowed to stay up, and how much it will cost you in legal bills.
Hahaha no decisions at the top u thought shit magically works no humans in charge HAHAHAHAH
It's unfortunate, but it was always coming. I was quite refreshed to see so much open piracy talk too, good indication it's an "anything goes" kind of place.
But I guarantee they've received a copyright order by somebody, probably the mpaa, and failure to act would result in legal action.