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[-] lieuwestra@lemmy.world 86 points 10 months ago

Skilled labor is economists jargon, so the meaning of it does not match the dictionary definition.

No one is saying there is literally no skill involved in unskilled labor.

[-] Asafum@feddit.nl 61 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

Skilled labor = real human deserving of a fair wage.

Unskilled labor = meat machine that we need to pay by law, but we gladly wouldn't pay them a dime if we could get away with it because they aren't real people.

-Asshat Owners

[-] lieuwestra@lemmy.world 32 points 10 months ago

Technically skilled as in requiring education (financed by the state), unskilled can learn on the job within days.

But politics has a way with twisting those words into a us/them dichotomy.

[-] Lamb@lemmy.zip 18 points 10 months ago

Many jobs societally requiring a degree could be learned on the job very quickly.

[-] kautau@lemmy.world 15 points 10 months ago

I’m a software engineer. There’s people on my team that went to Yale for computer science. There’s also people on my team that took a six month coding boot camp. They’re both great at their jobs.

[-] uis@lemmy.world 4 points 10 months ago

Specifics of software engieneering. Doesn't work with civil engieneering, electrical engieneering and many other fields.

[-] kautau@lemmy.world 1 points 10 months ago

I agree, I was purely agreeing with

Many jobs societally requiring a degree could be learned on the job very quickly.

I still think the formality of some fields is still too “can you afford it,” but that’s for another topic

[-] gears@sh.itjust.works -1 points 10 months ago

You can't learn those things online or in books?

[-] uis@lemmy.world 2 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)
[-] mayoi@sh.itjust.works -4 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

It's bullshit and we both know it. Don't pretend that following an existing protocol for building bridges safely is so hard and requires education that I can't get in 6 months.

It's not like engineers are allowed to do whatever they want, they have rules to follow, none of which will be told to them in university because universities are worthless.

[-] uis@lemmy.world 1 points 10 months ago

It's bullshit and we both know it.

And this is why I said you can't learn civil engieneering in six months.

[-] mayoi@sh.itjust.works -4 points 10 months ago

I don't need 6 months.

[-] rambaroo@lemmy.world 2 points 10 months ago

Some people just can't be trained to write code. You still need the aptitude at the end of the day.

[-] synae 1 points 10 months ago

I know both kinds that are absolutely dogshit at their jobs. I don't say this to negate your point, but rather to strengthen it.

I'll also add that some of the very best I know have no formal training whatsoever. But they have years of hobbyist experience that eventually led to a career and the additional experience that comes from that.

And even though success can come without formal training, I wouldn't want to hire someone completely untrained or inexperienced in this field - you gotta have something to get your foot in the door

[-] Asafum@feddit.nl 8 points 10 months ago

For me it's not really an us/them opposition, my disgust is with how unskilled laborers are viewed/treated because of our lack of education. That somehow makes us subhuman and undeserving of a living wage. That we should be thankful for a minimum wage.

I have no issue with skilled laborers, I have an issue with owners/CEO/etc... us laborers of all skills are in the same boat. Best friend works for Intel, Intel makes tons of money, friend gets pay cut and added responsibility. ¿Que?

[-] lieuwestra@lemmy.world 2 points 10 months ago

The problem lies in the fact that we need to categorise these subjects to write more effective policy. And it doesn't matter what words you use, they always get these connotations as familiarity grows.

[-] Incandemon@lemmy.ca 1 points 10 months ago

To add to this, the whole education level dictates importance thing never made sense to me anyways. I may see a doctor once or twice a year, but I need garbage collected every week. On the level of social importance it strike me then that the garbage person is therefor more important than a doctor.

[-] Incandemon@lemmy.ca 1 points 10 months ago

I think its unintended but by that definition then carpentry or other trades which used to be learned by apprenticeship on the job aren't skilled?

[-] mayoi@sh.itjust.works -5 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

Education requires no skill, you just kiss professor's ass and do as you're told, your reward is a diploma. Here, is that reductionist enough for you?

By the way, cashier job can't be learned within days, you need to be literate and know at least basic math and average kid goes to school for at least 8 years so fuck you. I can't even think of a job that requires no education.

[-] Seasoned_Greetings@lemm.ee 2 points 10 months ago

Some more sarcasm and condescension

[-] helenslunch@feddit.nl 3 points 10 months ago

What constitutes skilled labor and who should be paid a living wage are two distinct conversations.

[-] unfreeradical@lemmy.world -1 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

Is it made less difficult to achieve a living wage for everyone by affirming, or by challenging, the practice of characterizing some labor as "unskilled"?

[-] helenslunch@feddit.nl 2 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

What it does it make you sound like a dunce for pretending like there aren't many many jobs that require special skills.

What you're doing is applying manipulative tactics and blatantly lying to further an agenda rather than just applying simple logic and reason. When you do that, you inhibit the cause you claim to support.

[-] unfreeradical@lemmy.world -4 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

Sure. To the economist the terms are jargon, but to the bootlicker they are sacred words. Your heresy is unwelcome.

this post was submitted on 08 Nov 2023
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