this post was submitted on 14 Jan 2024
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I'm pretty sure countries without histories of imperialism can also purchase bananas..
Benefiting doesn't require you or your country's past participation.
Yeah just like I didn't personally terrorise indigenous people into moving away, I am in fact benefiting from terror against indigenous people by living on Turtle Island as the offspring of settlers.
My main point was this isn't imperialism. Words mean things, man.
Of course it is. How do these foreign companies own such large amounts of land in these countries? (Hint: US-sponsored coups). Why are these countries producing large amounts of a single crop via monoculture practices instead of solving for the nutritional needs of their own population?
Because the autonomous countries are unable to make those choices for themselves? What about places that produce bananas that didn't have banana republics?
If you live anywhere where a banana cannot grow and get them cheaply, you're benefitting from imperialism regardless of where the banana you actually eat is grown because it's the cheap bananas from those banana republics that determined the market value.
Or you're benefiting from trade agreements and/or cutthroat capitalism.
Mix in a bit of slavery, I too think it's a form of imperialism
Nope, not what that word means.
What's cutthroat capitalism then?
Can you name some examples of banana-growing exporters that weren't undermined by the US to the point of banana republic
Côte d`Ivoire
What a wonderful "technically correct" answer.
Then what is it?
...trade agreements?
At the barrel of a gun? I think that is considered to be under duress.
And again, ONE country set up banana republics, which were then overthrown. Anyone who isn't them and can also buy cheap bananas separately. There are also places that were not ever banana republics who export bananas.
This post takes a very complicated issue and distills it down to a neat little thing by misusing words and then everyone else can be like "oh I feel smart too cause that seems clever". It's bullshit and makes everything worse.
Or maybe it is a reminder that these complicated legacies are still with us? Would you prefer only essays written on imperialism?
And I have no idea how just one county setting up banana Republics has anything to do with it. Would other countries still not benefit from being able to buy artificially low cost products. At the expense of the county being exploited?
See, I'm on board with your point there, and I would love to see how much truth there is to it. Those countries have renegotiated many agreements and some now have socialist governments which are doing quite well, despite the fuckery the US put them through.
The post doesn't leave room for ambiguity or nuance. It says "x is true". That's why it's dumb and arguably a net bad. Quick little feel good statements for such a complicated issue just help people on the Internet feel better by liking or up voting while harming any actual progress. So fuck the person who wrote the original thing and fuck OP for spreading it.
Sure, ONE country did it, while about 100 cheered., And queued up for deliveries.
Everyone loves to shit on America, without acknowledging their home country's very happy entanglement with them
Got any proof for them claims?
Yeah, all the shit on your shelves, defense contracts, trade regulation, financial markets, so fucking much...even gps (which came to be via cold war weapons research into ballistic missiles and location and targeting needs of the US military
I live in Canada and we absolutely benefit from American hegemony. Same goes for anyone in the global North who benefit from the same
Your source seems dubious to me, I don't think you have anything to add here
Ok sorry "literal reality, everything you can see in the global north" isn't good enough for you.
Here's one for your book report:
https://ustr.gov/countries-regions/europe-middle-east/europe/european-union#:~:text=Exports%20were%20%24592.0%20billion%3B%20imports,up%2066%20percent%20from%202012.
The point isn't just the literal trade though, it's the global system that the United States has developed (through often imperial means) that many smaller countries benefit from, happily.
I also responded to you before you did a few edits.
Your first response was something like "all the shit on your shelves"
And my main point here is that the original meme obviously doesn't know what "imperialism" means.
Just look up United Fruit Company and start reading:
It's not just land grabs by people wearing crowns
It's a modifier on the word imperialism on purpose. You don't hear military imperialism or diplomatic imperialism because that's that the work means. The actual word for all of this and what happened is corporatocracy.
Sure, modifier, or a type of imperialism, or one of several meanings. It's how the word is used, including by people in this thread and elsewhere. Therefore the phenomenon is both corporatocracy and imperialism and more.
...so then an inaccurate but emotionally charged phrase misusing big words to sound smart.
This is all super good for general discourse, and it's great that you endorse this behavior.
What county had zero history of that?
“Maybe one of the smaller countries… like the Vatican! … Wait.”
Is this meme aimed at everyone? Doesn't feel like it lmao.
I think you can buy bananas in Luxembourg or Bhutan
Lol
https://www.luxtimes.lu/culture/how-luxembourg-took-part-in-the-evils-of-colonialism/1338583.html
I think Bhutan is good
Fair enough, 1 for 2 isn't bad odds. Point still stands
For sure. I'd say Bhutan doesn't fit the meme though, as Bhutan is part of the global south, and might even grow bananas themselves? I dunno about that
Either way, the meme doesn't know what imperialism means. The US govt over threw quite a few governments and handed it over to corporations. Thats not imperialism.
Can you elaborate? I'm curious to know why a country overthrowing another government in order to secure it's own economic interests in the region doesn't meet your definition of imperialism.
All bananas are the result of imperialism. Look up the banana wars. So many workers dead, all in the name of Dole, cheap bananas, and extracting every last cent of profit.
Some countries with imperialist histories grow bananas too
What if a non imperialist buys a reasonably priced banana from a former imperialist?