I hope after a year i will forget what reddit was.
this post was submitted on 18 Jun 2023
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Technology
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A nice place to discuss rumors, happenings, innovations, and challenges in the technology sphere. We also welcome discussions on the intersections of technology and society. If it’s technological news or discussion of technology, it probably belongs here.
Remember the overriding ethos on Beehaw: Be(e) Nice. Each user you encounter here is a person, and should be treated with kindness (even if they’re wrong, or use a Linux distro you don’t like). Personal attacks will not be tolerated.
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You’ll forget what what was?
Same tbh
I'm really enjoying Lemmy to be honest. A decentralized platform rekindles the feeling of internet forums and the excitement of finding something new in each community. Seeing such a candid report from the developers is nice as well and reaffirms my decision to stay, regardless of reddit's decisions or direction as a platform.
Keep up the great work everyone involved!
Agreed, it feels a lot more intimate and the growing pains are honestly not that bad
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Update: So I dug around a little deeper, and found that
- @dessalines@lemmy.ml is /u/parentis_shotgun on Reddit. Source: https://archive.is/Ky9vd
- /u/parentis_shotgun moderates some subreddits, including r/InformedTankie, r/asktankies, r/GunZedong. Source: https://www.reddit.com/user/parentis_shotgun
- /u/parentis_shotgun got banned from r/socialism for "refuting the 'China is genociding Uyghurs'". Source: https://archive.is/CwFZC
- /u/parentis_shotgun then launched lemmy. Source: https://archive.is/132fW
On another topic, there are rumors circulating that we are fascists or supported genocide. These claims are completely false, and like most viral twitter threads, are coming from a single Mastodon user on a personal vendetta who didn’t provide any sources. Such slander doesn’t deserve any response and is best left ignored.
- Previous discussion on the moderation policy on lemmy.ml including response from @dessalines@lemmy.ml : Expressing concerns about moderation policy on lemmy.ml
- Accusation of a Mastodon user (probably the one they are referring to): https://mstdn.social/@feditips/106835057054633379
- Essays from @dessalines@lemmy.ml: https://github.com/dessalines/essays/blob/master/socialism_faq.md
Update: More info about @dessalines@lemmy.ml
I don't agree with these views at all, but I don't agree with the view that no one should use lemmy because of the opinions of the developers. Its an open-source project, just don't use anything hosted by them. Like I don't support the US military, but that doesn't stop me from using the internet.
One sore point there is that the code comes by default with a donation link (the heart at the top) to join-lemmy.org. Even without the tankie issue it should rather go to a page local to the instance explaining donation options, and the default should be "The admin didn't set this up, if you urgently need to get rid of money here's a link to Doctors without Borders".
OTOH there's now a huge influx of people including tons of developers so I expect tankie influence to be drowned out sooner than later.
Yeah, developers of new instances should probably edit that out.
I don't think its a huge issue though, looking at that page the number of people who have donated more than $10 is like... a dozen.
A bunch of developers isn't going to do anything though if they retain control over everything. I think after learning about this background, and their weird claims surrounding it yesterday, the path forward I would prefer is for a strong fork to emerge of the original code that instances deploy instead.
Forking the project would beyond stupid, and to so blithely suggest it leads me to believe to you don't actually know much about that which you are discussing.
I prophesied that to happen back on reddit but with FLOSS development culture being as it is pre-emptive forking is kinda considered the same as a pre-emptive nuclear strike. It's just not done in polite company.
I'm about 100% that there's going to come a make-or break situation where, if the developers don't concede, there will be a fork, but it could also be that the devs are conscious enough of what's happening that they'll cave under the pressure and thus manage to retain some influence over the project.
This is just it. Software is software. You can spin your own instance and moderate it as you wish. It's open source, so you can change and modify it.
But right now they're asking for donations to run their instance and help with their code.
So before you donate money and your time/expertise/code - it's probably a good idea to know who is asking for it. It's not entirely clear, to be honest.
Exactly. I probably don't agree on everything with 100% of developers of the tool out there. I don't want creators of technological tools (or anyone for that matter) to be subject to purity of ideology and opinion tests. I didn't want Brendan Eich gone from Mozilla nor anyone else gone from the tools they develop.
aa
His response to that issue is really solid.
aa
People have a tendency to call anti-trans hate "politics" even when they would never call racism and sexism that. But it's just hate speech.
Giving hate speech free rein does not help anybody, and I'd argue it especially doesn't lead to more actual free speech, because that just leads to the most hateful people taking over a platform while most people, not willing to put up with that, just leave. And voila, you get shit like Voat. It doesn't solve everybody's differences when hate speech is allowed to thrive, it just boosts the hate speech over and above everything else, and creates a hateful echo chamber. This has happened so many times now.
Even choosing to do nothing and not ban the instance would have been a choice based on ideology/politics/whatever you want to call it, imo. "Software should allow any and all speech, including hate speech" is not a neutral or apolitical stance either.
For all I know, he could be trans, or have trans friends or family, and in the current world state, where trans people are being subjected to escalating real world suffering .. If it were me, I wouldn't just step aside and allow my personal project to be used to hurt me or my loved ones, either. I'd be upset if a friend created software, allowed it to become a powerful tool for people who'd wish me dead, and then just handwaved all responsibility and refused to do even attempt to do anything because any attempt at moderation would count as "politics" while creating the software in the first place and freely allowing it to be used for hate... Wouldn't be, somehow?
I do appreciate the transparency from the Lemmy devs and re their views (whether only alleged or actual) on controversial topics, I think the issue is not in the software itself and in how the devs themselves are using it. However given the nature of the fediverse and how Lemmy is programmed, you can use the software however you like, as we do here on Beehaw.
Similarly, we can look to the "death of the author" debate to settle this. I'm not going to discuss what that is and what it isn't here (as that isn't the purpose of this post or this comment), however, I will state that my definition of "death of the author" involves critically enjoying a piece of media despite its author's bad views if and only if those views aren't inherent to the work and they aren't profiting off of my consumption of the work itself. Beehaw is like that. Sure the creators of the software are involved in a controversy, but the way the devs use their own software is not an inherent feature of the software. Beehaw has a fantastic setup and ethos, so I find my home here. Sure, there's not that many specific communities, but that's what federation is for.
Another analogy, however accurate (no analogy is perfect): people lobby governments with money to get them to pass problematic legislation, but people still participate in the economy.
note on that analogy because I feel it needs saying
Yes, I know that participating in the economy, especially in the United States where I live but really anywhere is a bit necessary to, well, exist most places if not everywhere, but people unknowingly support controversial people all the time. See Nestle and their controversies. Even bringing that up reminds me of the illusion of choice and how everything is owned by five companies (and even then mostly everything is owned by like two VC groups). I'm digressing, of course, but I hope you see my point in bringing this up.
TL;DR: The way the devs use the software should not impede our use of the software given that the devs' views are not inherent to any use case of the software.
I agree with the first part. I completely fail to see how the analogy at the end applies. Capitalists and their corporations lobby the government to pass legislation that directly fucks the economy to make it worse for working-class people who use it (and, in fact, depend on it for their basic survival). So it's much, much more like Reddit where people have to use the one corporate system that exploits and oppresses them than like someone developing a piece of FOSS software that other people can use independently. In fact, if you try to build a separate economy, the state's violent enforcers (police and/or military, depending on the context) will come in and abuse and murder you and tear apart your independent economy and force people back into the fold.
My point with including thr analogy about the economy was to say, in essence, "people do bad things with money all the time yet we still use it," although, again, I will bring up how this isn't a good analogy because of our reliance on capital to obtain things like healthcare, food, and housing.
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Wow they went from 1 user to 27. It feels like way more than 27 people
(I'm aware of what they meant, but it's incorrect in English)
Yes, every single English speaking country uses a period for decimals. And English Wikipedia requires it in their style guide.
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