this post was submitted on 18 Jan 2025
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traingang

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Honestly, seeing them zipping around everywhere they look pretty good on the face of it. The advantages seem obvious:

  • Save time versus walking
  • Quiet
  • No effect on local air quality

The main issue is them colliding with pedestrians, but (similar to bike lanes) that's a thing town planners should deal with by creating the right environment.

I'm willing to change my view if people tell me good reasons they are bad.

Yes, there is more environmental impact than a bicycle, but not than an e-bike, and they seem to be good for people reluctant to cycle.

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[–] TraschcanOfIdeology@hexbear.net 17 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (2 children)

They're dangerous as fuck. Tiny wheels and very minimal or no suspension means that any bump or small stone in the road is going to send you flying at 25-45 kph.

Electric bicycles are all the conveniences of an e scooter in a much more solid and stable frame, except portability.

[–] buckykat@hexbear.net 6 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Electric unicycles have the wheel size and suspension of an ebike but with better portability than an escooter, the only real downside is the steep learning curve.

[–] Wolfman86@hexbear.net 5 points 2 months ago (1 children)

What happens if you hit a bump or stone though? Seems like it would be even more dangerous?

[–] buckykat@hexbear.net 2 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Not really, the suspension and your knees absorb it and you keep riding.

For example, this is what it looks like riding an older, non suspension electric unicycle up and down curbs and stairs.

[–] HexReplyBot@hexbear.net 1 points 2 months ago

I found a YouTube link in your comment. Here are links to the same video on alternative frontends that protect your privacy:

[–] DragonSlayer999@hexbear.net 1 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Are they statistically more dangerous?

(I'm off to research ths online myself)

[–] DragonSlayer999@hexbear.net 1 points 2 months ago

https://www.ntsb.gov/safety/safety-studies/Documents/SRR2201.pdf

Although the existing scientific literature indicates an increase in the use of electric scooters and electric bicycles as well as an increase in electric scooter and electric bicycle rider fatalities and injuries, better quality data, efficient research methods, and replicable results are needed to improve our understanding of electric scooter and electric bicycle safety.

At least 119 electric scooter and electric bicycle fatalities occurred between 2017 and 2021; however, because the crash data are not standardized, they do not provide a robust representation of electric scooter and electric bicycle safety

So it's ambiguous and we don't have data on whethe they're dangerous

[–] PKMKII@hexbear.net 12 points 2 months ago (2 children)

In the abstract, fine. The e-scooter startups are annoying AF.

[–] buckykat@hexbear.net 14 points 2 months ago (1 children)

I do not love the dockless rental e-scooters. The incentives of the business model are all wrong: because they're paid by time, people tend to ride as fast as possible to save money, and even double up on one scooter. Because helmets aren't provided or required, nobody uses them, and because of the dockless structure people frequently leave them blocking all or part of the path and the companies all use underpaid gig workers to collect them overnight for charging.

It's a symptom of the capitalist desire to solve transportation problems with absolutely no infrastructure investment.

However, none of these problems are actually problems with electric scooters as such, they're problems with a specific business model which happens to primarily use electric scooters but which also sometimes uses electric or even accoustic bicycles with all the same attendant problems.

[–] Inui@hexbear.net 8 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

Peep what happened in Portland, OR when the scooters got out of control and people showed they couldn't be responsible with them. People started throwing them off of bridges into the river, or on top of inaccessible business roofs.

Other people collected them and turned them back in hoping for reward money, even using grappling hooks and other goofy things to pull them off the roofs they weren't allowed on.

They're a menace for pedestrians, especially if you live anywhere near a college campus.

[–] buckykat@hexbear.net 6 points 2 months ago

Yes, like I said, these are all problems with the dockless rental model, not with escooters

[–] happybadger@hexbear.net 7 points 2 months ago (1 children)

This video on the economics of them is great: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=91Oyd7zK1bk

A bazinga byproduct of the 0% interest rate era with little actual profit potential. In that video the narrator says an average rental scooter gets like 15 minutes of usage per day, which here would amount to like $3 in revenue while a gig worker has to drive around all day retrieving the ones people trash. I hate that we have that model instead of the city owning bikes or subsidising the cost of one for consumers.

[–] HexReplyBot@hexbear.net 1 points 2 months ago

I found a YouTube link in your comment. Here are links to the same video on alternative frontends that protect your privacy:

[–] FloridaBoi@hexbear.net 10 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Owning one: incredible. Love it. I commute a short distance to work and take it inside even when I go shopping.

Rental ones: trash. Worse carbon emissions than an entire EV car. Docking bikes are much better.

[–] DragonSlayer999@hexbear.net 1 points 2 months ago

This is advocacy of private property

[–] lemmyseizethemeans@lemmygrad.ml 8 points 2 months ago

I am in Beijing. They are everywhere. Totally silent which means I have almost been Tboned a few times crossing the road but I'm 100% behind them

[–] buckykat@hexbear.net 7 points 2 months ago

I am in favor of all forms of electric micromobility: e-bikes, e-scooters, e-unicycles, etc. My main form of transportation is my electric unicycle, it's great.

[–] Frogmanfromlake@hexbear.net 7 points 2 months ago

I use them. A lot cheaper than a car and preferable in my flat rural town

[–] Dirt_Owl@hexbear.net 5 points 2 months ago

They're good for places that aren't bike friendly. Honestly anything outdoory getting popular is a win in my book.

[–] Zuzak@hexbear.net 5 points 2 months ago

I have one and I absolutely love it, but, I also understand why some people don't. Many people who use them (especially rental ones) don't wear a helmet and some will go up on sidewalks at full speed. You gotta be careful with them especially when you're first getting used to them, I had a couple falls starting out (I'm klutzy). Gloves and kneepads aren't a bad idea (in addition to a helmet, obviously), and always be careful around corners and doors and watch for potholes, especially on your first time taking a route. If you're careful and responsible, they can be great. Very portable, affordable, and fun and easy to ride. If the streets are bad, you can get on the sidewalk, if the sidewalk's bad you can get on the street, and if things are hazardous, you can go slow and just step off if you need to. Only bad thing is if they run out of battery, you're kinda stuck, as opposed to an ebike where you could ride it manually.

[–] windowlicker@hexbear.net 5 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

i think they're a great idea and they're pretty fun to ride, but i really don't enjoy how fast people go with them on busy sidewalks with lots of pedestrians and how they're just left to clutter up sidewalks when people throw them to the ground after use. they're not much else than an annoyance on tighter sidewalks to me, but i'm sure to people who require mobility aids they can make life really difficult.

[–] happybadger@hexbear.net 4 points 2 months ago

I want more pedestrian paths and fewer cars. While I don't like that the rentable ebikes/escooters don't come with helmets and people leave them everywhere, they're riding on the biking path I need instead of driving and both of those things benefit me.

That being said I'd much rather areas take Colorado's approach of subsidising ebike purchases. They're so practical and can replace almost all local driving with 50kg+ of cargo capacity. I want people to have a free option that best meets their transport needs while building up the biking industry.

[–] transnationalmaoist@lemmygrad.ml 3 points 2 months ago

I can't stand them, mainly because there are always people flying around in them and weaving through pedestrian (and car traffic for that matter) and almost colliding into everyone in sight. And there are so many people that don't even have driver's licenses that are flying around in those things.

[–] Gorb@hexbear.net 3 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

As a strict walker and train rider it has the same problem as any individual human operated vehicle where they all seem to want to kill me for daring to walk. I've seen people go on them very quickly on pavements without slowing down for pedestrians at all. In an ideal world they'd be great but honestly i think personal transport and people don't go so well together. More buses, trams and trains pls or at least less cars so electric bikes and scooters can go on the road instead

[–] gm0n3y@lemm.ee 1 points 2 months ago

The dental field loves them…