What about Israel?
this post was submitted on 19 Mar 2025
248 points (98.4% liked)
Europe
4453 readers
1428 users here now
News and information from Europe 🇪🇺
(Current banner: La Mancha, Spain. Feel free to post submissions for banner images.)
Rules (2024-08-30)
- This is an English-language community. Comments should be in English. Posts can link to non-English news sources when providing a full-text translation in the post description. Automated translations are fine, as long as they don't overly distort the content.
- No links to misinformation or commercial advertising. When you post outdated/historic articles, add the year of publication to the post title. Infographics must include a source and a year of creation; if possible, also provide a link to the source.
- Be kind to each other, and argue in good faith. Don't post direct insults nor disrespectful and condescending comments. Don't troll nor incite hatred. Don't look for novel argumentation strategies at Wikipedia's List of fallacies.
- No bigotry, sexism, racism, antisemitism, dehumanization of minorities, or glorification of National Socialism.
- Be the signal, not the noise: Strive to post insightful comments. Add "/s" when you're being sarcastic (and don't use it to break rule no. 3).
- If you link to paywalled information, please provide also a link to a freely available archived version. Alternatively, try to find a different source.
- Light-hearted content, memes, and posts about your European everyday belong in !yurop@lemm.ee. (They're cool, you should subscribe there too!)
- Don't evade bans. If we notice ban evasion, that will result in a permanent ban for all the accounts we can associate with you.
- No posts linking to speculative reporting about ongoing events with unclear backgrounds. Please wait at least 12 hours. (E.g., do not post breathless reporting on an ongoing terror attack.)
(This list may get expanded when necessary.)
We will use some leeway to decide whether to remove a comment.
If need be, there are also bans: 3 days for lighter offenses, 14 days for bigger offenses, and permanent bans for people who don't show any willingness to participate productively. If we think the ban reason is obvious, we may not specifically write to you.
If you want to protest a removal or ban, feel free to write privately to the mods: @federalreverse@feddit.org, @poVoq@slrpnk.net, or @anzo@programming.dev.
founded 8 months ago
MODERATORS
We should definitely stop selling weapons there but do we even buy anything from there? They have their own heavy vehicles and AA but I’d be surprised to see a Merkava tank or something in a European army and Iron Dome only works on rocket equivalent of rocks thrown over a wall.
[edit] we probably get ammo
Yes we do. Finland has ordered David's Sling for example.
PULS is bought by Germany and Spain, with the Netherlands and Denmark using it already.
Germany has also bought Arrow3 as a anti ballistic missile AA system. There is nothing like it available in the EU.
Lots of those advanced Israeli AA weapons are developed together with US defence contractors and multinationals (Arrow3 = Boeing, David’s Sling = Raytheon) so one could hope they’re off the table too.
We already know different countries buy intelligence software for law enforcement purposes. I would not be surprised if other intelligence and cyber warfare suppliers were Israeli.
I doubt tools for policing citizens are in scope of this fund.
If you abstract to intelligence tools, which is what they are, I am quite sure they will be included.
EDIT: and indeed they are
Thanks for finding this! Still holding on to the hope that there’s a difference between electronic warfare and electronic surveillance.
I learned the hard way that hope, like fear, is a bad habit.
Good stuff, reaming by buying foreign equipment is only kicking the can down the line.
Investing into defense industry that can build new weapons is far stronger then temporarily buying weapons.
Or worse, renting or “licensing” weapons.
"Unless their home countries sign defense pacts", which I kinda expect the UK and Turkey to sign.
Dangit, if only we had some sort of defense agreements with the US... /s
UK: Damn Brexit...
Switzerland: Neutral neutrality neutral ...
Ukraine: We're still alive. At some extent...
USA: Tariffs! I'll covfefe all those idiots!!!
Putin: ?
Switzerland is targeted because of this:
states would not be able to spend the money on products “where there can be a control on the use or the destination of that weapon . . . It would be a real problem if equipment acquired by countries cannot be used because a third country would object,” one of the officials said.
Which is perfectly reasonable. Switzerland can sit on a throne of flawless ethics but it’s just pointless to source weapons from there.
Remember at the start of this war Germany could not send the artillery shells (and maybe tanks? Don't recall exactly) it wanted to Ukraine because they were being made in Switzerland.
This is the logical consequence of the Swiss neutrality position.
Gepard ammunition
Thanks!
It's even worse, it's FLAK ammo, not even something potentially used as offense like artillery.
Do not underestimate the effect of 1100 rpm of 35 mm shells vs infantry and lightly armored vehicles. The gun can be lowered to -10 Degrees and AFAIK the Gepards in Ukraine have been used in a ground combat role.
If you have seen one of these Gepards in action, you know that everything on the other side of the barrels are in big trouble, except it's heavily armored.
And I guess even if it is the occupants might be deaf by the end of the barrage.
I kinda remember memes, after a Gepard killed a rusian tank, so even that might not be a hurdle
Yep. (Of course it’s the far right in our country preaching about “neutrality” because they are in the pockets of imperialist russia).
Put in: Nazis everywhere!
Do any European defence companies have SAMs competitive with the Patriot, or are they still a generation behind?
Multiple
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_surface-to-air_missiles
German Iris-T Norways NASAM French Aster 30
You're comparing apples and oranges.
Of those I would say that only Aster 30 + SAMP/T is a viable Patriot alternative.
And I believe IRIS-T is superior to current US alternatives.
The big advantage of Iris-T is the price of a missile. As in Iris-T is at 250k, Aster30 at 2million and Patriot at 4million. The problem with it is the much shorter range and no anti ballisitc missile capability.
There is going to be so many Boxers..
my beloved 😍