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[-] windowsphoneguy@feddit.de 170 points 9 months ago

By pricing their models competitively, right?

...right?

[-] Tetsuo@jlai.lu 104 points 9 months ago

Exactly.

Europeans like Chinese electric vehicles because they are affordable.

Meanwhile European manufacturers are probably pushing behind the scene to restrict the Asian competitors on the market so they can decide what price is right.

In the next months in France they will reduce the subsidies for Electric Vehicle with a poor CO2 bill like imported Chinese cars.

So even less people will get to afford EVs.

I don't think this is just about cheap Chinese labor importing cheap Chinese cars to Europe. It's also about Europe ignoring the importance of battery tech and manufacturing for decades and suddenly acting all surprised that we are not competitive.

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[-] elouboub@kbin.social 52 points 8 months ago

Lol, a car industry that hasn't innovated in years is suddenly threatened by innovation. Still, fuck cars. We should make them nigh obsolete with better public transport.

[-] Moneo@lemmy.world 11 points 8 months ago
[-] vivavideri@lemmy.world 23 points 8 months ago

I love cars. Fixing them is a pain in the ass but a fun challenge. Driving them can be fun, too. But, I think I'd love some kickass, efficient, abundant, affordable public transportation even more.

God. We could have had it by now. It'd be so rad. But no.

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[-] tsonfeir@lemm.ee 49 points 9 months ago

They have an electric suv under $20k usd

Sure, it’s probably gonna last like a mid-90’s Kia, but for the price it’s pretty nice.

[-] agitatedpotato@lemmy.dbzer0.com 28 points 9 months ago

At the rate of industrial investment into this tech coupled with some places punishing gas cars, a cheap car that spans the gap from now until affoedable and better EVs is the perfect prescription, not to mention we havent stopepd having some form or financial crises since covid.

[-] CmdrShepard@lemmy.one 13 points 9 months ago

I think it's debatable. Is it really good if all the energy that went into making the vehicle goes to waste because it only lasts 50k miles? At that point you're basically building disposable vehicles.

I think the sweet spot for this period is in hybrids that allow people to run on electricity around town but also have the ICE as a fallback for long/extended trips. The main hesitancy with EVs is range anxiety (ignoring high prices) and hybrids solve that issue while still retaining a lot of the benefits of an EV.

[-] Addv4@kbin.social 10 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

The problem with that is that phevs are surprising expensive/heavy/complicated. It's why Chevy discontinued the volt over the bolt. And why chevy had to cut a lot of costs on the volt to get it down to a semi-acceptable price (the volt didn't even have power seats except on the Premier, and only on the drivers side).

[-] Satelllliiiiiiiteeee@kbin.social 12 points 9 months ago

Honestly, I prefer not to have power seats. It's faster to adjust manual seats in my experience and there's both fewer things to break and less weight.

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[-] tsonfeir@lemm.ee 6 points 9 months ago

If I was in the market for a new car, I’d strongly consider them because of the cost even knowing the quality may be low. It’s still an EV and would hold its value for now. It’s a good alternative to the slim-pickings we have here in the states

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[-] febra@lemmy.world 27 points 8 months ago

The political class trying to protect the interests of the billionaire class. You grow up under this capitalist system and all you hear is "competition is driving innovation" but the moment true competition comes knocking on your door, you lock yourself into a room.

[-] lustyargonian@lemm.ee 20 points 8 months ago

What is Europe if not Europeans?

[-] luciferofastora@lemmy.zip 18 points 8 months ago

Government trying to steer a herd of impulsive and selfish citizens into doing what makes sense for the collective (or what they believe makes sense (or what they're trying to convince us they believe makes sense))

[-] Username@sh.itjust.works 9 points 8 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

deeper nested brackets Or what the car lobby tells them they should try to convince they believe makes sense

[-] Aceticon@lemmy.world 8 points 8 months ago

Not a single head of any of the car makers who participated in the rigging of diesel car emissions testing went to jail.

Diesel car emssions are thought to kill around 10000 people per year in Europe (not all of which the excess emissions resulting from the rigging, but part of it).

Not even human lives are more important than the wishes of the car lobby for european politicians.

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[-] qooqie@lemmy.world 20 points 9 months ago

I’m not entirely sure why they want to fight low prices? The article doesn’t say why EU and others shouldn’t be able to afford e-vehicles

[-] lorez@lemm.ee 44 points 9 months ago

They undercut the sales of European vehicles which cost more.

[-] jackoneill@lemmy.world 39 points 9 months ago

Oh no, capitalism hurts itself in its confusion

[-] Wogi@lemmy.world 29 points 9 months ago

"Capitalism breeds innovation and drivers prices down!"

Capitalism: no not like that

[-] bioemerl@kbin.social 10 points 9 months ago

Unsustainable Chinese state subsidy is not capitalism.

[-] IHeartBadCode@kbin.social 17 points 9 months ago

Unsustainable state subsidies are not capitalism. Remember it’s not just the Chinese that do this kind of stuff.

[-] barsoap@lemm.ee 9 points 9 months ago

Of course they are, subsidies are one of capital's favourite methods to siphon money out of the populace. Or were you under the impression that greedy people like playing fair on fair markets?

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[-] elouboub@kbin.social 16 points 9 months ago

US government shoving millions up the asses of the their industries: capitalism

China shoving millions into their industries: communism

Yours faithfully, the brainwashed USAian

[-] chaogomu@kbin.social 7 points 9 months ago

Every country does some level of industry subsidy. So it's kind of baked into capitalism now. And, technically, has been since the beginning.

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[-] Pringles@lemm.ee 16 points 9 months ago

It's not that simple. Caricatures are easy, but the fact remains that the Chinese auto makers are heavily subsidized and it's that government support that allows them (partially at least) to undercut the European auto makers.

That being said, the European auto makers really deserve to be hurt for their arrogance. And that's coming from someone whose income is directly related to how well they do.

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[-] bioemerl@kbin.social 15 points 9 months ago

low prices

They're fighting Chinese market manipulation that is specifically designed to make the world dependent on them and lowers wages across the world by creating massive market imbalances. Every nation with two brain cells should ban the import of all Chinese vehicles and eventually all Chinese industry entirely.

[-] paintbucketholder@lemmy.world 12 points 8 months ago

Chinese electric car makers get absolutely massive state subsidies. There are companies like Nio that have never made a single dollar of profit. Nio has been losing money on every single car they sell, to the point where they've been losing almost a billion dollars in the last quarter alone.

However, China doesn't care. The state keeps financing these companies, because if they can undermine European and American auto makers to the point where they're simply unable to compete and maybe even completely collapse, then Chinese car makers will be the only ones left in the market, and they'll be able to charge any price they want.

And realistically, which American or European car maker will be able to compete with a multitude of Chinese competitors that all can afford to lose billions and billions every year without batting an eye?

So that's why they want to fight "low prices."

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[-] DogMuffins@discuss.tchncs.de 19 points 9 months ago

Is it racist to say I'd never buy a Chinese car just on principle?

[-] BassTurd@lemmy.world 58 points 9 months ago

If it's because you hate Asians, then yes. If it's because you believe China makes bad products or because of their unethical practices, then no.

[-] snooggums@kbin.social 8 points 9 months ago

It could be all three since racists tend to think China makes bad products and have unethical practices because they are Chinese due to conflating race and culture.

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[-] isles@lemmy.world 8 points 9 months ago

It could be, you'd have to define the principle.

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[-] Peaty@sh.itjust.works 6 points 9 months ago

Only if it had something to do with race. If it's because you don't think their manufacturing standards are high enough to feel safe that wouldn't be racist per se.

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[-] bioemerl@kbin.social 17 points 9 months ago

State literally calls itself communist. (Operates more like a fascist state than a communist one)

Conducts ever more of its industry through the state and strictly controls the banks and loans.

Exercises huge subsidies across the entire economy which is visible through their massive and growing imbalance between their internal consumption and export.

"You only say it's not capitalist because they aren't white"

No I say they aren't capitalist because they aren't capitalist.

[-] Peaty@sh.itjust.works 27 points 9 months ago

China is closer to neo-mercantilism due to the level if direct state involvement in private business.

[-] ChrisLicht@lemm.ee 6 points 9 months ago

As a nationalist economic policy, neo-mercantilism integrates well with the fascist economic model, particularly in this age when the masses are so accustomed to foreign goods that they might find the explicit notion of autarky alienating.

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[-] febra@lemmy.world 8 points 8 months ago

And why should I, a European consumer, care if China has a communist economy or not?

Same shit to me. You live your entire life under capitalism being lied to about how "competition drives innovation" and suddenly when competition knocks on your door, you lock yourself in.

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[-] JasSmith@sh.itjust.works 16 points 8 months ago
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this post was submitted on 18 Oct 2023
249 points (95.3% liked)

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