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A few year back, there was a Netflix documentary about flat earther. They've done a couple of experiment to prove that the earth is flat which (Spoiler alert) demonstrated that the earth is round.

So now that these persons have demonstrated scientifically that the earth is round. How are they doing ? Still flat-earther ? or did they give up with the amount of evidence they collected ?

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[-] CaptainBlagbird@lemmy.world 182 points 1 year ago

The movie is called Behind the Curve, and imo is a great move.

It doesn't try to ridicule the people in it. Instead it tries to make a point that if a group like the flat earth society is being made fun of rather than engaged in discussions, then the gap just gets larger and the problem worse. (If everyone else makes fun of you, you avoid them and stay in the community that supports you.)

As far as I can tell, Mark Sargent is still believing in those theories and continues doing his part in it. This doesn't surprise me, he's quite prominent in that community and I guess if he stopped, he'd lose quite a lot of his personal achievements, friends, hobbies, etc.

I don't know about the others who were in the movie, it would be interesting to know. Especially about those who were directly doing the experiments, yeah.

[-] snooggums@kbin.social 166 points 1 year ago

It tries to show that good faith engagement is better than ridicule, but in the end it shows that flat Earthers are so contrarian that they will actively ignore the results of their own experiments and engaging in good faith is pointless.

[-] dustyData@lemmy.world 79 points 1 year ago

Basically, treat all humans with dignity. In psychiatry you're told to treat all patients with good faith, but don't let the guy who thinks he is Napoleon run the hospital.

[-] snooggums@kbin.social 34 points 1 year ago

By default all humans should be treated with dignity unless they are causing direct harm to others. Flat Earthers are kind of an edge case because their anti science and evidence approach is tied in with the antivax movement so they are harming others indirectly.

MAGA idiots, racists, and other hate filled people do not deserve dignity. In amedical setting, sure, but not in the real world where they are causing harm.

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[-] bionicjoey@lemmy.ca 14 points 1 year ago

"Don't let the horse run the hospital"

-John Mulaney

[-] lingh0e@sh.itjust.works 10 points 1 year ago

I didn't even know a horse could do that!

[-] vzq@lemmy.blahaj.zone 17 points 1 year ago

Why not, they are great at running.

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[-] HessiaNerd@lemmy.world 12 points 1 year ago

My takeaway is there is something driving that contrarian attitude. We need to figure out how to address those underlying causes rather than exacerbating them through ostracization.

Really good documentary. I watched it while trying to engage over at reddit's AskTrumSupporters. It was interesting to see that community become more and more radicalized as the years went on, as the insane bullshit piled up. Helped me come to terms with the fact that engaging on that level is counter productive if anything.

[-] Phanatik@kbin.social 68 points 1 year ago

The problem with flat earthers is that they don't listen to reason.

You can't reason someone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into.

[-] jettrscga@lemmy.world 39 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

The takeaway I got from the movie is it's not really about the theory, it could be literally anything that brings people together. It's just about being part of a community and being respected somewhere. Of course you can't logic someone out of that.

It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends on his not understanding it.

-Upton Sinclair

...But also his friendships, and entire sense of worth.

[-] Phanatik@kbin.social 10 points 1 year ago

I don't remember if it was said in the doc itself or it was a video discussing the doc (I think Hbomberguy), that said "they (flat earthers) are attempting a form of science".

To me, what that says is, if they were intellectually honest with genuine curiosity, then they would've changed their views in the face of contradictory evidence. Time and time again, they showed that they weren't willing to do that even after seeing the results of their own experiments.

As you said, they've staked too much on this notion that the Earth is flat and can't afford to give up the grift now.

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[-] michaelmrose@lemmy.world 29 points 1 year ago

Have you considered that there is actually more virtue in containing stupid than trying to rescue it. The audience for such communication is rarely the person afflicted because its almost impossible to convince such folks its the folks at the margins who might be convinced either way.

Consider an imaginary belief say 0.5% of the population believes that flu can be treated by shoving pancakes up your ass. If ridicule keeps the percentage at 0.5% instead of growing to 1% its incredibly virtuous whereas more respectful treatment of the belief might help you convince 0.01% to stop shoving starch in their rectum while allowing the mental virus to spread to far more people.

This theory is applicable everywhere. Every time you engage with a crazy person or a nazi imagine your audience is the other folks reading the discussion not the person you are engaging.

[-] HessiaNerd@lemmy.world 9 points 1 year ago

If ridicule keeps the percentage at 0.5% instead of growing to 1% its incredibly virtuous

That if is doing a lot of lifting. One of the points of the movie is that people and media was laughing off the flat earthers and they grew in strength to have a national movement.

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[-] Rhoeri@lemmy.world 24 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

These people deserve to be ridiculed. It’s time we stop catering to these Idiots and allow them to face the consequences of their ignorance. Same with the MAGA minions.

[-] Aabbcc@lemm.ee 8 points 1 year ago

What consequences are there for being a flat earth idiot?

I don't understand how you can see a comment that says "being mean is unproductive" and conclude "we should be mean anyways"

Do you carry the same principle for fat shaming?

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[-] Tedesche@lemmy.world 19 points 1 year ago

Didn’t they also establish that Sargent is a hyper-religious Christian and that the majority of American flat-earthers are? If this is a religious belief for them then there’s absolutely no hope that they’ll change their views.

[-] cogman@lemmy.world 13 points 1 year ago

It's mostly a religious belief. There are a couple of Bible verses that say things like "the earth will be rolled up like a scroll" and "spread to the four corners of the earth".

Biblical literalists cannot handle the Bible being incorrect about anything, so it's everyone else that's wrong.

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[-] lgmjon64@lemmy.world 162 points 1 year ago

I know a guy who was involved in some of those "experiments" and spent a considerable amount of time and money on them. He still is very adamant that it just proves that there is some other unknown confounding variable that just proves that the experiment was valid and that the designers of the flat earth already expected the experiments. It's really depressing. I used to really respect him when I was younger.

[-] Brunbrun6766@lemmy.world 57 points 1 year ago

Hold the fuck up. Now theres DESIGNERS of the flat earth? Jesus Christ

[-] Player2@sopuli.xyz 36 points 1 year ago
[-] Rivalarrival@lemmy.today 9 points 1 year ago

The Time Traveling adventures of Yahweh and his selfson, Jesus.

[-] BallsInTheShredder@lemmy.world 8 points 1 year ago

Luke, I am.. my own father

[-] Furbag@lemmy.world 8 points 1 year ago

Hi Dad. It's me, you.

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[-] Rhoeri@lemmy.world 132 points 1 year ago

I think they’re voting for Trump.

[-] Quadhammer@lemmy.world 9 points 1 year ago

They illuminati killed them for their insolence

[-] scytale@lemm.ee 90 points 1 year ago

Most probbably just doubled down and made excuses. The main takeaway of the documentary was a lot of those people are just lost/lonely and being part of that club gave them a sense of belonging to a group of similar people.

[-] MeatsOfRage@lemmy.world 26 points 1 year ago

Yea I'm glad the documentary uncovered that. It really shows why someone would get into this despite it being pretty easy to prove otherwise (even inadvertently proving themselves wrong) they have this little community of friends.

[-] Son_of_dad@lemmy.world 16 points 1 year ago

People like to feel like they're in on some truth that most people aren't aware of.

[-] dustyData@lemmy.world 12 points 1 year ago

The sad part is that the less intelligent someone is, then the stronger is the need for that hidden truth. Highly educated and intelligent people are more comfortable with ignorance and need less that validation of having secret knowledge.

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[-] Arcane_Trixster@lemm.ee 15 points 1 year ago

There was a short segment on 60 Minutes (maybe?) back in 2020 before the elections where they interviewed someone who had deprogrammed himself from Qanon.

It was the same story. He had no friends IRL, no social support, he had turned his mom onto Qanon and she was still down the rabbit hole.

He said that was the part that kept him in it for so long, even once he started questioning things. All his "friends" and close relations were part of the cult and he would have to cut ties with everyone or worse, they would turn on him and attack him as a traitor.

It would be sad if these online-cults weren't so damaging to society.

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[-] seitanic 43 points 1 year ago

Did you watch the movie? Because the experiments showed that the earth was round, they decided that there must have been something wrong with the experiments.

[-] c0mbatbag3l@lemmy.world 29 points 1 year ago

Flat Earth Follower: "So what was the result of that laser gyroscope experiment we all gave you money for?"

Flat Earth Leader: "Well it showed a 15 degree an hour rotation... So we think 'heaven energies' are affecting it."

Flat Earth Follower: Nods happily, knowing he doesn't have to change his beliefs.

[-] NoiseColor@startrek.website 35 points 1 year ago

Very important question! Did they do the mind acrobat tango and still believe it's flat or did they just go to the next conspiracy theory?

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[-] kevin@programming.dev 30 points 1 year ago

The documentary was called "Behind the Curve" and featured Bob Knodel. Unfortunately he passed away this year. https://www.robertsfhsc.com/obituary/RobertBob-Knodel

It looks like you still believed in the theory though. He had a YouTube channel that was devoted to flat Earth conspiracy.

The experiment he was involved in was the gyroscope one. The documentary showed what happened after his experiment "failed": he decided the experiment was flawed and needed to be refined.

The aftermath of the wood slats with holes experiment at the end wasn't shown, but based on the rest of the documentary (and the history of people with conspiratorial beliefs) it's almost certain they did the same.

RIP to Bob, though. I hope his friends & family are coping well.

[-] DontTreadOnBigfoot@lemmy.world 11 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

he decided the experiment was flawed and needed to be refined.

Ah yes, the scientific method:

  • Make an observation or ask a question
  • Gather background information
  • Create a hypothesis
  • Create a prediction and perform a test
  • Analyze the results and draw a conclusion
  • ~~Share the conclusion or decide what question to ask next~~ Discard the experiment if it doesn't support your preconceptions
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[-] cpw@lemmy.ca 28 points 1 year ago

Going to suggest the folding ideas YouTube channel on the same topic.

https://youtu.be/JTfhYyTuT44?si=m2b1gAkCOlDOnCle

Spoiler: his hypothesis, well supported in my opinion, is that a large proportion of those formerly in flat earth are now neck deep in qanon, and since the film was made many are now into other conspiracy stuff. The election was fake etc.

Also, his video of minnewanka lake is just perfect flat earth debunking.

[-] ramenshaman@lemmy.world 27 points 1 year ago

I'm sure they changed their minds... /s

[-] yata@sh.itjust.works 21 points 1 year ago

There is not a lot to laugh about with flat earthers. The theory stems from Christian fundamentalism, and it is tightly connected to the christofascist movements trying to coup the USA at the moment.

And no, they are not going to give up their beliefs, because they didn't come by them through rational thought, so rational thought isn't going to disprove it for them.

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[-] octoperson@sh.itjust.works 15 points 1 year ago

It's not specifically about those same individuals, but I want to mention Dan Olsen's documentary In Search of a Flat Earth, which touches more on the ideology of the flat earth movement, and how it's developed in recent years. No spoilers, peeps!

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[-] KISSmyOS@lemmy.world 14 points 1 year ago
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[-] electrogamerman@lemmy.world 10 points 1 year ago

I saw some of them in the zoo last sunday.

[-] Hotdogman@lemmy.world 9 points 1 year ago

Apparently their theory fell flat in a round-a-bout way.

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this post was submitted on 11 Nov 2023
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