this post was submitted on 17 Nov 2025
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A reminder that as the US continues to threaten countries around the world, fedposting is to be very much avoided (even with qualifiers like "in Minecraft") and comments containing it will be removed.

Image is a map of the Western Sahara, sourced from this article in the Middle East Eye. Much of the information in the preamble also came from there, as well as this article.


November 6th marked the 50th anniversary of Morocco, under King Hassan II, beginning the invasion and occupation of much of the territory of the Western Sahara. Today, approximately 80% of the territory of the Western Sahara is controlled by Morocco, with the Polisario Front - the government of the Sahrawis - controlling the rest, hugging the border of Mauritania. Between them lies one of the longest walls and one of the largest minefields on the planet, of which construction began in the 1980s.

The legitimacy of Morocco's control over the Western Sahara is one of those long-lasting diplomatic issues which ultimately doesn't seem to matter very much in terms of on-the-ground realities, and reveals the eternal uselessness of the United Nations especially in regard to actually helping oppressed people. Up until about 2020, the US and certain other Western countries did not formally recognize Morocco as having sovereignty over the whole territory, but in terms of providing genuine opposition to Morocco, it seems that Algeria is the major player in the region. While American, European, and Moroccan corporations exploit the fisheries and phosphate minerals of the region, protected by their minefields (and claims of merely advancing the cause of renewable energy development, AKA greenwashing), Algeria provides what aid they can to support the displaced Sahrawi people, many of whom have been forced to live in refugee camps.

On October 31st, the US put forward a resolution in the UN Security Council which was adopted (Russia and China abstained) and provided major support to Morocco, urging the Polisario Front to adopt the 2007 "autonomy plan", which would, despite its name, be synonymous with an end to their independence movement. Such a plan was met with much jubilation in Morocco, with King Mohammed VI remarking "From now on, there will be a before and an after October 31, 2025.” Such a date was also the catalyst for the PF intensifying their guerilla struggle against Morocco, as legal avenues for autonomy and basic human rights are running out as the imperialists grow more desperate.


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Simplicius, who publishes on Substack. Like others, his political analysis should be soundly ignored, but his knowledge of weaponry and military strategy is generally quite good.
On the ground: Patrick Lancaster, an independent and very good journalist reporting in the warzone on the separatists' side.

Unedited videos of Russian/Ukrainian press conferences and speeches.

Pro-Russian Telegram Channels:

Again, CW for anti-LGBT and racist, sexist, etc speech, as well as combat footage.

https://t.me/aleksandr_skif ~ DPR's former Defense Minister and Colonel in the DPR's forces. Russian language.
https://t.me/Slavyangrad ~ A few different pro-Russian people gather frequent content for this channel (~100 posts per day), some socialist, but all socially reactionary. If you can only tolerate using one Russian telegram channel, I would recommend this one.
https://t.me/s/levigodman ~ Does daily update posts.
https://t.me/patricklancasternewstoday ~ Patrick Lancaster's telegram channel.
https://t.me/gonzowarr ~ A big Russian commentator.
https://t.me/rybar ~ One of, if not the, biggest Russian telegram channels focussing on the war out there. Actually quite balanced, maybe even pessimistic about Russia. Produces interesting and useful maps.
https://t.me/epoddubny ~ Russian language.
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https://t.me/UkraineHumanRightsAbuses ~ Pro-Russian, documents abuses that Ukraine commits.

Pro-Ukraine Telegram Channels:

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https://discord.gg/projectowl ~ Pro-Ukrainian OSINT Discord.
https://t.me/ice_inii ~ Alleged Ukrainian account with a rather cynical take on the entire thing.


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[–] vegeta1@hexbear.net 59 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (4 children)
[–] sewer_rat_420@hexbear.net 38 points 1 month ago (2 children)

Really wish one of these days China and/or Russia would stand up and veto one of these things. Not that it would stop USA from just doing it anyways

[–] cfgaussian@lemmygrad.ml 48 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (3 children)

Russia and China abstained. They said the US rushed the whole thing through without giving anyone time to even properly discuss it.

The problem is that this was supported by the Palestinian Authority, the Arab states, and Turkey. We here all know that these are compradors doing the US's bidding in the Middle East, but to the broader world this looks like Muslims are united in supporting it.

It would be a very bad look for Russia and China to openly oppose something that apparently (this is how the media presents it) Muslims themselves don't. The West's propaganda would immediately spin it as Russia and China standing in the way of peace for their own geopolitical reasons.

They would blame Russia and China for any further war and Palestinian deaths, and a lot of Muslims internationally would believe it which would seriously damage what Russia and China are trying to do with the multipolar world. From their point of view it is better to let the US and the Arab states "own" this, especially since it is likely to be yet another failure.

I'm not saying they were right to not veto. I'm angry and disappointed too. I'm just saying that this is how the Russians and the Chinese are looking at this in the broader global context.

[–] sewer_rat_420@hexbear.net 25 points 1 month ago

That's a great analysis. I don't mean to give into the hopes that "China/Russia must save us" because I know that can't happen. This just illustrated how the UNSC and global geopolitics are not the fair game with rational politics, but actually a smokescreen for our imperialism. The fact that you describe why they can't stop it so well, but this is so clearly an evil act by American empire to those with eyes to see, it's very frustrating.

At the end of the day, we did the genocide, now our capitalists will make even more money and we will get another base built on the rubble is just...so disgusting

[–] Euergetes@hexbear.net 20 points 1 month ago (1 children)

would be a very bad look for Russia

after the fall of Syria they have basically no pull in the region anyway, its very hard to imagine abstention benefitting them more than denying UN legitimacy to the "ISF". UN shit is greatly undervalued by the second world

[–] cfgaussian@lemmygrad.ml 20 points 1 month ago (1 children)

The fall of Syria doesn't change the fact that Russia is a global player and maintains important relations with Muslim countries.

[–] demerit@lemmygrad.ml 10 points 1 month ago

And they maintain close relationship with israhell as well, given its massive russophone minority. As long as the Ukraine war rages on, there just isnt enough capital to invest in changing the status quo in the region. It seems most of the muslim countries prefer the gulf anyways, so trying to do anti-imperialist actions in the region would be micromanaging and triaging a hostile environment which sees anti-imperialism as sectarianism or shia supremacy. I mean Iran didnt even purge its liberals, this just shows how unwilling they are to confront. It is analogous to trying to do communism again 1990s eastern europe.

[–] Boise_Idaho@hexbear.net 15 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

They would blame Russia and China for any further war and Palestinian deaths, and a lot of Muslims internationally would believe it which would seriously damage what Russia and China are trying to do with the multipolar world. From their point of view it is better to let the US and the Arab states "own" this, especially since it is likely to be yet another failure.

Their veto would just paint Hamas and the rest of the Palestinian resistance as Russian/Chinese proxies since Hamas have spoken out against the deal while the rest of the Sunni Muslim world is apparently on board. This will have unforeseen ramifications if you have almost all (Sunni) Muslim countries and the PA support the deal while Russia/China/Iran, Iranian "proxies" like Hezbollah and Ansarallah, and Hamas oppose the deal. They did try painting Hamas as Iranian proxies, but that largely floundered because Hamas is Sunni while Iran is Shia. But selling Hamas as a Russian/Chinese proxy could work by delegitimizing their Muslim/Sunni credentials. After all, haven't the rest of the Sunni world, including the custodian of Mecca and Medina and the internationally recognized government of Palestine, support the deal?

The Zionists have placed a political trap where China and Russia lose out either way, so China and Russia is choosing the path of least resistance.

[–] MizuTama@hexbear.net 20 points 1 month ago

the veto is as likely as the U.S. not doing it imo.

[–] CleverOleg@hexbear.net 31 points 1 month ago (1 children)

I am really trying to cling to my optimism, but it’s getting hard.

[–] demerit@lemmygrad.ml 7 points 1 month ago

We are getting closer to revolution each day - this is a scientific fact, the only question who will be left to see that day.

[–] hellinkilla@hexbear.net 28 points 1 month ago (1 children)

All this talk about disarming hamas but how is anyone pretending to proceed when one side is completely belligerent about any concessions? The stated position is they will not adhere to any agreement.

Who will disarm the Israelis?

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2025/11/17/israels-ben-gvir-urges-killing-pa-officials-if-un-backs-palestinian-state

“If they accelerate the recognition of the Palestinian terrorist state, and the UN recognises a Palestinian state, targeted assassinations of senior Palestinian Authority officials, who are terrorists for all intents and purposes, should be ordered,” Ben-Gvir said, according to the Jerusalem Post newspaper.

Ben-Gvir went even further on Saturday, falsely claiming that the Palestinian people do not exist.

The national security minister said “there is no such thing as a Palestinian people” and called Palestinians a “collection of immigrants from Arab countries to the land of Israel” who have “sown terror, murder and atrocities everywhere”.

He reiterated his support for the so-called “voluntary migration” of Palestinians out of their lands, which critics say underscores Israeli plans for ethnically cleansing Palestinians.

Israeli authorities, from Ben-Gvir and the far-right parties forming Netanyahu’s coalition to the more moderate opposition figures, are all united in their unyielding objection to the establishment of a sovereign Palestinian state.

Bezalel Smotrich, Netanyahu’s finance minister who acts as a de facto governor of the occupied West Bank, has been pushing for the annexation of the Palestinian territory as another response to the growing international support for Palestinian statehood.

Israeli officials have also repeatedly stressed that they will not allow the PA to become the governing force in Gaza.

[–] Evilphd666@hexbear.net 10 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (1 children)

isntrael projection The national security minister said “there is no such thing as a ~~Palestinian~~ isntrael people” and called ~~Palestinians~~ Israhellis. There are collection of immigrants from ~~Arab~~ European countries to the land of ~~Israel~~ Palestine” who have “sown terror, murder and atrocities everywhere”.

[–] hellinkilla@hexbear.net 6 points 1 month ago

~🔻~🔻{isntrael|🔥🔻🔥🔻🔥🔻🔥🔻🔥} 🔻 ~🔻~

that quote above from AJ about Ben-Gvir is honestly about the evilest thing I have ever posted. I've felt dirty ever since that it passed through my textbox.

[–] plinky@hexbear.net 27 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (1 children)

i wonder why china abstained, they truly don't have that dog in them smh. like i understand real-politicking "arabs don't care why should we", but like at least demand token concession on un force composition or some shit with palestine state timeline, instead of trump resort on the auschwitz but we said it's bad.

china continues to be my denial of treats (only) champ, hopefully they crash oil market into unrecoverable state after ai crash, and gulf states get what they deserve. or sunnis wake up instead of getting mad about shias, but that's even less likely, as it requires not being online and/or being critical of saudis.

[–] xiaohongshu@hexbear.net 26 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (3 children)

China is very pragmatic, and if you’ve seen my posts, China is currently going through a phase of economic downturn with prolonged deflation and local government debt crisis, and so without a domestic consumer market, it really cannot afford to let the US screwing up global free trade as Trump has been threatening to do. All the best cards (e.g. rare earth exports) are being used to keep the US from decoupling from China precisely because of this. The two economies are too closely tied to one another that China cannot afford to see prolonged inflation or a recession in the US.

The government has already spent trillions of stimulus to boost domestic consumption and resolving debt issue (化债) but the effects have been marginal at best. All the details that have been released about the 20th Five-Year Plan so far have shown that there will be nothing out of ordinary from its usual policies, except for more focus on high-tech sector and boosting consumption.

Government subsidies and high-tech sectors aren’t going to solve massive wealth inequality, it requires a complete restructuring of how the economy is run. If the government does not want to run a deficit to provide full employment, then it cannot resolve these fundamental issues.

On a side note, I’ve seen an uptick on the left internet lately that have fully bought into the “China is WINNING, the US is COLLAPSING” discourse, which is really just the inverse of “China is going to COLLAPSE any day now!” narrative fueled by right-wing propaganda, neither of which even made an attempt to understand the complexity and the dynamics of global economic, trade and financial systems.

And once you understand these and knowing that China is very pragmatic about saving its own economy, a lot of things will make sense.

Russia is also more or less the same. It has failed to use the opportunity provided by the Ukraine war to achieve an economic transformation under global sanctions, and so will have to continue to play by the rules set by Washington.

[–] mkultrawide@hexbear.net 22 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Brace Belden always jokes "the dragon rises" in regards to China, but in terms of foreign policy, "the jellyfish floats" seems more applicable.

I have a hypothesis floating around in my head about the US seeking to control/neuter China not by outcompeting it in production but by taking control of enough of its customers that the US has essentially monopsony power over Chinese production, but not enough to put into an effort post.

[–] xiaohongshu@hexbear.net 10 points 1 month ago (1 children)

I also don’t think the US is trying to compete with China on industrial production. Both mainstream and alt media are guilty of perpetuating this narrative.

I mean, did anyone forget that the US could not even compete with Japanese industries back in the 1980s, when the US industrial base was MUCH stronger back then. Who in their right mind would think the US can now compete with China? It would require the entire US establishment to forget the decades-long struggle against Japan’s much more energy and cost efficient industrial base where the lessons were already learned 40 years ago, which is absurd.

The only way out for the US is to go full financialization, using tariffs to exploit China’s industrial power to kill other exporter economies in the Global South (since China refuses to give up its net exporter status), then the US comes in with financial takeover of the failing sectors, which will allow it to reshape the global supply chain.

There is one problem though: how would the US deal with the deteriorating conditions for the working class in the US, which had led to a rise in populist movements? Here’s where Europe comes into play. The US is going to force the EU into switching places with itself, where the US gets partial re-industrialization (with the EU being coerced to import from the US, since the US is not able to compete with China and other exporter economies at much lower cost) while the EU de-industrializes itself.

[–] mkultrawide@hexbear.net 3 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

I haven't had time to flesh this out, although I have been thinking of making a post, but I think the US, at least the current admin, does intend to compete with China on manufacturing, just not on the "cheap stuff".

I have been trying to square the circle on how the current immigration enforcement strategy benefits any of the GOP's monied interests, given that the US economy, at least at the lower levels of service and agriculture, essentially runs on cheap labor, and these policies will interrupt that supply. I was talking with someone who works at a large agricultural co-packer, and they mentioned that the CEO started a project that they spin off into a new company based around a robotic/fully automated harvester. This is a machine that is too expensive relative to migrant labor to be profitable for farmers or agricultural corporations. But if that pool of migrant labor dries up, if the ICE polices essentially act as a tarriff or import ban on cheap labor, then all of these robotic, AI driven machines being built by the tech/VC people that have made an alliance with Trump became much more economically competitive. I suspect the goal, other than to create a new bastardized SA for the American right, is to make cheap labor scarce, and thus not cheap, in the process bolstering American production of new advanced machines that previously were too costly to make sense for most business.

[–] plinky@hexbear.net 18 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (1 children)

i mean, just generally, good will of populace instead of regimes in muslim countries might be (definitely) worth more than piddly 20 billion in trade with pisrael/usa "goodwill" which they'll say "fallen for it again, chicoms" anyway. russia is more complicated with pisrael, their own stuff (although its definitely in russia interest to complicate turkey/pisrael bromance, so why not insist on turkey peacekeeping force idfk)

in other words this is a bet on pisrael dominating middle east for 20 years which is very blackpilled and blackpilling

[–] demerit@lemmygrad.ml 5 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (1 children)

20 years is absurd. Israhell wont outlast the US of A. Though how long it will last, will increasingly depend on the inaction of arab leaders and populace.

[–] plinky@hexbear.net 6 points 1 month ago (1 children)

spoilerimagine the global south under the drone fleet, forever. doomer but fr, the iron grip of arab regimes around in coordination with entity would only dissolve on climate change shock/lack of resilience from the local compradors, only entity thinks about water seriously.

[–] demerit@lemmygrad.ml 3 points 1 month ago

That is the plan, drone fleets which kill massive swathes of people helot-style operated by AI so it doesnt feel remorse/break psychologically and libs can feel good because they can use the "scentific" excuse to remove all agency.

Or maybe they will just kidnap people from the global south, lobtomize them and neuralink them into those NEO robot things.

[–] hellinkilla@hexbear.net 5 points 1 month ago

And once you understand these and knowing that China is very pragmatic about saving its own economy, a lot of things will make sense.

sure it "makes sense". nobody would say otherwise. there is no economic reason for china to care about palestinians who are like 0.0001% of the earth's population. they can live or die or something in between and nobody in china must notice.

it shows a lack of principled, moral leadership. that's something everyone is looking for these days. every nation run by fascists or cowards. anyone who is a (non-anarchist) communist is wanting china to step in because it would be demonstration of communist principals in stark contrast to all capitalist nations. it would show that communism is a better way to be even in the context of global capitalism. that a (even nominally) communistic economic system imposes some intrinsic solidarity which surpasses those craven capitalist nations.

china doesn't need to attend to the concerns of palestinians or their global supporters. they don't need us, that's not the balance of power. their plans suppose a global capitalist system, with which they interact to their benefit. I guess in that way they benefit from all this havoc and evil and don't have any interest in calming it down at all (??!). but we need them to make good on "the people's liberation army" and start liberating some people.