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What popular quote are you tired of hearing? (lemmy.world)

submitted 1 year ago by PP_BOY_@lemmy.world to c/asklemmy@lemmy.world

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Bonus points if it's usually misused/misunderstood by the people who say it

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[-] mnemonicmonkeys@sh.itjust.works 11 points 1 year ago

A "well regulated militia" had a different meaning back then. Also, there's a comma in the middle of the amendment that means the first phrase is only a clarification. The second clause stands on its own.

[-] xigoi 6 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

I just attended a lecture about this specific comma today. It was there as a rhetorical pause, not to separate clauses. A great example of how ambiguity in punctuation can cause thousands of deaths.

[-] wjrii@kbin.social 5 points 1 year ago

Yup. I'll go with the linguists on this one.

Textualism and originalism
A group of linguistics scholars describe developments in the field of corpus linguistics, which did not exist when District of Columbia v. Heller and McDonald v. City of Chicago were decided, that have allowed for a new understanding of the language used in the Second Amendment. Researchers in American and English history have digitally compiled thousands of Founding-era texts, making it possible, for the first time, to search and examine specific terms and usage from the period. The resulting evidence demonstrates that “keep and bear arms” had a “collective, militaristic meaning” in the late 18th century. The scholars write that, consistent with that meaning, Founding-era voters would have understood the right to be subject to regulation.

[-] mnemonicmonkeys@sh.itjust.works 2 points 1 year ago

The resulting evidence demonstrates that “keep and bear arms” had a “collective, militaristic meaning” in the late 18th century.

And what is this even supposed to mean in a way that would contradict the originalist viewpoint? The definition of "militia" in the period is already understood to mean all able-bodied men that are suitable for military conscription. And by extension, a "well-regulated" meant said militia having proper equipment and knowledge of how to use said equipment. Quoting this changes nothing.

Also a side note: you should look at some of the arguments above the one you quoted in this link. There were 2 based on the State of New York discriminating against people, particularly racial minorities and LGBTQ individuals, which have the most need for the ability to defend themselves

[-] Xariphon@kbin.social 6 points 1 year ago

It meant "properly equipped," not "heavily restricted."

[-] LarryTheMatador@sh.itjust.works 6 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

[-] Donebrach@lemmy.world 4 points 1 year ago

Ah yes, because the founders wrote in modern American english that is wholly objective and unassailable in its original meaning. it is for this reason alone that no new laws have been passed or enforced since the penning of the Constitution.

[-] mnemonicmonkeys@sh.itjust.works 0 points 1 year ago

Alright, we can discuss the first clause. Here is another comment I made in the thread on that topic: https://sh.itjust.works/comment/4356959

this post was submitted on 11 Oct 2023

142 points (93.3% liked)

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