LGBT + legal equality index, 2024 : dataisbeautiful

[-] alcoholicorn@lemmy.ml 27 points 4 days ago

This kinda thing can't be reduced to a single number, how do you compare the US, where trans people often can't afford HRT in the best states, and are literally unable to get it in Florida, to Iran, where it's free, but surgery is mandatory and being gay is punishable by death?

A place where hatecrimes aren't uncommon, but there is some level of legal protection, to a place with far fewer hatecrimes/discrimination, but no special legal protections?

[-] guillem@aussie.zone 11 points 4 days ago

I agree that countries ara hard to compare "in bulk" but I think that naming the chart with the wording "legal equality" hints at acknowledging that it's representing a very concrete dimension of equality in general.

[-] CanadaPlus 4 points 4 days ago

Iran should probably be a lighter shade than Saudi, then. They're on a similar level for gay people, but actually ahead of the US on trans people.

[-] lqdrchrd@lemmy.blahaj.zone 13 points 4 days ago

Very few subjects can be represented by one graph and still give you the whole story. You could say this about almost anything posted here. I think it’s useful and interesting enough to be here.

[-] Nougat@fedia.io 11 points 4 days ago

... Iran, where it's free, but surgery is mandatory and being gay is punishable by death?

It's free because it's the "sentence" for being gay. Get an operation or be executed.

[-] CanadaPlus 1 points 4 days ago

I'm not quite sure how punitive it is. Basically they fully acknowledge trans people, but not homosexuality, so everyone gets pushed into the trans category.

[-] alcoholicorn@lemmy.ml -1 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago)

Yes, the point is a binary trans Iranian who wants surgery is less oppressed in Iran on the axis of being trans than in America, but they're quite obviously worse for someone in nearly any other position.

[-] Nougat@fedia.io 6 points 4 days ago

Those are some real heavy blinders you've got on.

Edit: More specifically, on this issue, the Iranian state is about forcing all people into rigid biological, sexual, and gender roles. The fact that that accidentally fails to oppress a sliver of people whose personal goals happen to align with the oppressive position of the state doesn't make that "less oppressive."

[-] alcoholicorn@lemmy.ml 0 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago)

That one specific group experiences oppression due to being trans in America they don't experience in Iran.

[-] shalafi@lemmy.world 3 points 4 days ago

Great points! My first thought was, bullshit on comparing the entire planet.

In any case, gays got it far better in America than they did 30-years ago. Shit takes time.

[-] untorquer@lemmy.world 2 points 4 days ago

Yeah, but also you can see some countries scoring lower due to trans rights where queer couples have equivalent rights to het. No "map" is going to take all the nuance. But your point is valid. Reducing to a number obscures things and it's worth little in terms of reliable, actionable info.

[-] CanadaPlus 8 points 4 days ago

Wow, South America, I did not see that coming. I mean, I knew about Brazil a bit, but I assumed it was a Thailand situation where the law and the practice were two different things.

[-] RamblingPanda@lemmynsfw.com 12 points 4 days ago

I was confused by Greece for a second as I put it in a religious conservative corner without thinking. But then I remembered Greek history.

[-] CanadaPlus 6 points 4 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago)

You have to skip over 1500 years or so, though. It's still surprising.

[-] RamblingPanda@lemmynsfw.com 1 points 3 days ago

Traditions do not have to be based on logic it seems

[-] CanadaPlus 2 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago)

I'm not sure what you mean by this. Presumably, being from lemmynsfw it isn't some kind of swipe at those dirty, deviant gays.

[-] RamblingPanda@lemmynsfw.com 1 points 3 days ago

No, I welcome everyone who's nice 💖

I forgot what I wanted to say anyways

[-] BonerMan@ani.social 8 points 4 days ago

Isn't China on the decline more?

[-] Aatube@kbin.melroy.org 5 points 4 days ago

Yes, but decline takes time.

[-] DMCMNFIBFFF@lemmy.world 4 points 4 days ago

Apparently it's more progressive than South Korea (though far less so than Taiwan).

[-] BonerMan@ani.social 10 points 4 days ago

Idk why but SK is very problematic regarding civil rights in general from a Democratic point of measurement. Japan is considered petty conservative but they are progressive compared to SK.

I however doubt that China is better than SK as they outright ban LGBT characters in media and even mentioning trans people is a problem.

[-] match@pawb.social 1 points 3 days ago

this is kinda weird because i watch gay shows from china all the time

[-] BonerMan@ani.social 1 points 3 days ago

China or Taiwan?

[-] match@pawb.social 1 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago)

China, via bilibili

[-] BonerMan@ani.social 0 points 3 days ago

Ah they get the freedom to intrude western media and spread subtile "China good" propaganda, inside China they get censored.

(I kinda like some of the mangas as well, so no offenes)

[-] CanadaPlus 1 points 4 days ago

Huh, this is the first I'm hearing about this. Any recent examples?

[-] Aatube@kbin.melroy.org 2 points 4 days ago

The South Korean government has to balance a lot of interests: The powerful Kleptocracy (Samsung etc.), the military, domestic nationalism (and the people), the US, and all while constantly animositing with their neighbor to the north. I got that from a Chinese political-cartoonist pundit who later got cancelled for good reason though, so take that with a grain of sulphates.

In China, LGBT+ stuff is mostly just censored in state-aired mass media. Anything else, like the most popular manga on the most popular platforms, semifrequently include such stuff, to the point where there are dedicated genre names for at least both. Admittedly, those genre names are borrowed from Japan, but Chinese internet and youth culture in general is fused with East Asian culture (ACG), which was popularized by Japan. That also brings up the question on whether the culture is also fused in Korea. Now, I have no experience with actual South Korean culture, but my anecdotal impression is that the Koreans I meet are less receptive to ACG. From what I can see from a quick skim-through of the relevant Wikipedia article, the LGBT+ are legally more recognized but culturally more persecuted in South Korea.

You can easily search for such genres and obtain such works online (piracy is quite rampant in China). However, many teachers often still ban them in schools like the US deep south due to personal bigortry (but they also ban cards in school soooo). Those teachers are a microcosm of the government's current direction, which has already closed down LGBT+ establishments and started instituting the aforementioned censorship years ago.

[-] Vilian@lemmy.ca 2 points 3 days ago

I was reading a very obscure manga that had day characters and the author was forced by the Chinese government to stop it or remove the gays characters, he stopped writing the manga because he became demotivated

[-] Kaboom@reddthat.com 6 points 4 days ago

Scandinavia is only mid blue? Why?

[-] nyankas@lemmy.ml 22 points 4 days ago

The source for this data is Equaldex. According to their data on Sweden, for example, the following things are rated negatively:

non-binary genders aren‘t legally recognized
intersex infant surgery is not banned
donating blood is not always possible for homosexual men
conversion therapy is not banned

They might also take their public opinion section into account for the country‘s overall score, but I haven‘t looked into that more thoroughly.

[-] untorquer@lemmy.world 13 points 4 days ago

Yup. Changing gender also requires sterilization in Norway. It's fucked.

[-] Kaboom@reddthat.com -1 points 4 days ago

Isn't that just the byproduct of bottom surgery?

[-] untorquer@lemmy.world 2 points 4 days ago

No. It's common not to get surgery.

[-] ContrarianTrail@lemm.ee 3 points 4 days ago

Changing gender requires sterilization even if you don't get surgery? What's the logic there?

[-] untorquer@lemmy.world 3 points 4 days ago

To get estrogen/change state registered gender. Latent hate from an older generation of senior medical people. It was explqined to me over a year ago so i can't remember specific details.

[-] DMCMNFIBFFF@lemmy.world 6 points 4 days ago

Russia, Iran, and Saudi Arabia are red.

[-] Feathercrown@lemmy.world 2 points 4 days ago

More colors does not a better scale make. Just do red -- white -- green.

[-] match@pawb.social -1 points 3 days ago

thailand legalized gay marriage a few months ago, this map is surprisingly out of date

Data is Beautiful