this post was submitted on 28 Oct 2024
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Lefty Memes

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An international (English speaking) socialist Lemmy community free of the "ML" influence of instances like lemmy.ml and lemmygrad. This is a place for undogmatic shitposting and memes from a progressive, anti-capitalist and truly anti-imperialist perspective, regardless of specific ideology.

Serious posts, news, and discussion go in c/Socialism.

If you are new to socialism, you can ask questions and find resources over on c/Socialism101.

Please don't forget to help keep this community clean by reporting rule violations, updooting good contributions and downdooting those of low-quality!

Rules

Version without spoilers

0. Only post socialist memes


That refers to funny image macros and means that generally videos and screenshots are not allowed. Exceptions include explicitly humorous and short videos, as well as (social media) screenshots depicting a funny situation, joke, or joke picture relating to socialist movements, theory, societal issues, or political opponents. Examples would be the classic case of humorous Tumblr or Twitter posts/threads. (and no, agitprop text does not count as a meme)


0.5 [Provisional Rule] Use alt text or image descriptions to allow greater accessibility


We require alternative text (from now referred to as "alt text") to be added to all posts/comments containing media, such as images, animated GIFs, videos, audio files, and custom emojis.
EDIT: For files you share in the comments, a simple summary should be enough if they’re too complex.

We are committed to social equity and to reducing barriers of entry, including (digital) communication and culture. It takes each of us only a few moments to make a whole world of content (more) accessible to a bunch of folks.

When alt text is absent, a reminder will be issued. If you don't add the missing alt text within 48 hours, the post will be removed. No hard feelings.


1. Socialist Unity in the form of mutual respect and good faith interactions is enforced here


Try to keep an open mind, other schools of thought may offer points of view and analyses you haven't considered yet. Also: This is not a place for the Idealism vs. Materialism or rather Anarchism vs. Marxism debate(s), for that please visit c/AnarchismVsMarxism.


2. Anti-Imperialism means recognizing capitalist states like Russia and China as such


That means condemning (their) imperialism, even if it is of the "anti-USA" flavor.


3. No liberalism, (right-wing) revisionism or reactionaries.


That includes so called: Social Democracy, Democratic Socialism, Dengism, Market Socialism, Patriotic Socialism, National Bolshevism, Anarcho-Capitalism etc. . Anti-Socialist people and content have no place here, as well as the variety of "Marxist"-"Leninists" seen on lemmygrad and more specifically GenZedong (actual ML's are welcome as long as they agree to the rules and don't just copy paste/larp about stuff from a hundred years ago).


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The only dangerous minority is the rich.


5. Don't demonize previous and current socialist experiments or (leading) individuals.


We must constructively learn from their mistakes, while acknowledging their achievements and recognizing when they have strayed away from socialist principles.

(if you are reading the rules to apply for modding this community, mention "Mantic Minotaur" when answering question 2)


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Notable achievements in all spheres of society were made by various socialist/people's/democratic republics around the world. Mistakes, however, were made as well: bureaucratic castes of parasitic elites - as well as reactionary cults of personality - were established, many things were mismanaged and prejudice and bigotry sometimes replaced internationalism and progressiveness.



  1. Absolutely no posts or comments meant to relativize(/apologize for), advocate, promote or defend:

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submitted 7 months ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) by hamid@vegantheoryclub.org to c/leftymemes@lemmy.dbzer0.com
 
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[–] crawancon@lemm.ee 65 points 7 months ago (3 children)

Jesus, what do you mean by "you people"?

[–] Mango@lemmy.world 5 points 7 months ago

Well he's talking to a little black girl about race, so it's either black people or all of not white people.

[–] monke@lemmy.cafe 4 points 7 months ago

Nah, not Jesus too 😭

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[–] Maggoty@lemmy.world 46 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (8 children)

I'd be shocked if they put that much thought into it. It's probably just good old unconscious ethnocentrism. Jesus is white because I'm white and that's my default setting to view the world.

[–] x0x7@lemmy.world 8 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (1 children)

Or because at that time they only knew white people so they assumed he looks like a person.

It doesn't even have to be some subconscious ethnocentrism. It could just be someone painting what they know people to look like.

[–] Maggoty@lemmy.world 4 points 7 months ago

There's quite a bit of evidence they knew what other people looked like. Western Christianity goes big in Italy and they have regular trade contact with the Levant and Northern Africa.

That trade contact comes to the entirety of Europe thanks to the Byzantine Empire, also known as the Eastern Roman Empire.

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[–] TheDarksteel94@sopuli.xyz 41 points 7 months ago (16 children)

You know that there's different depictions of Jesus in many races, right? Like, people in Africa have depictions of a black Jesus, for example.

[–] Bassman1805@lemmy.world 52 points 7 months ago (3 children)

Yeah, I think the far easier explanation is "people around the world depict their religious figures as looking like themselves".

[–] Smorty@lemmy.blahaj.zone 6 points 7 months ago

Humans depict god and his boy like a human, so yeh makes sense

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[–] alsaaas@lemmy.dbzer0.com 13 points 7 months ago (2 children)

It's about European churches using historical revisionism (depicting Jesus as a white European) to establish a sense of "superiority".

Those churches are by far the most dominant

[–] Flocklesscrow@lemm.ee 27 points 7 months ago (1 children)

I prefer juiced up Korean Jesus. Does thy god even lift?

[–] Albbi@lemmy.ca 24 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (1 children)

I had to check this out. Jesus!!!

[–] jlow@beehaw.org 10 points 7 months ago

Jesus the Barbarian, amazing ✨

[–] antonim@lemmy.dbzer0.com 14 points 7 months ago (2 children)

Frankly this comes off almost as a conspiracy theory. Christian art in Europe developed its typical imagery when the vast majority of Europeans could have no direct contact with non-Europeans, before colonialism or coherent ideas about racial identities, when far-off lands were thought to be occupied by one-legged giants...

[–] alsaaas@lemmy.dbzer0.com 6 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (1 children)

You know that... Christianity developed in the Roman Empire? The Middle East (more exactly Palestine and Syria. Which were larger that today's counterparts) wasn't some magical place where giants lived, but a province of said Empire

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[–] BMTea@lemmy.world 6 points 7 months ago (2 children)

"Black Jesus" is a deliberate response to the traditional white depiction of Jesus, arising out of an acrimonious colonial relationship with whites. We're trying to discuss why Jesus was depicted as white in the first place.

[–] HomerianSymphony@lemmy.world 9 points 7 months ago (1 children)

Actually, Christianity in Ethiopia dates from the 4th century and is not the result of European colonialism.

Their Jesus usually looks pretty black.

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[–] angrystego@lemmy.world 23 points 7 months ago

Jesus: It's because I'm not your god. I'm god of the people that colonized your country, took some of your people as slaves and made you all believe in me instead of your original black gods.

[–] TheObviousSolution@lemm.ee 20 points 7 months ago (1 children)

Jesus is like a Marvel superhero. Like any pop culture fiction, it's rendition changes to reflect and is a product of the era of that particular iteration of the superhero. You even have the religious offspring sect equivalents of Invincible and The Boys.

[–] UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world 7 points 7 months ago

Was going to say... there's no shortage of art - historical or modern - that portrays Jesus as the dominant regional ethnicity.

Case in point

A theory that claims multiple leaders – from Jesus to Barack Obama – are actually Turkish and that modern nations are little more than portions of a greater Turkic whole is gaining traction in many countries

[–] gedaliyah@lemmy.world 19 points 7 months ago
[–] HawlSera@lemm.ee 17 points 7 months ago (12 children)

Or hear me out, most depictions are from the renaissance when "Not being white" was a relatively new concept to Painters?

[–] finestnothing@lemmy.world 25 points 7 months ago (1 children)

Jesus is white and ripped because of several very prominent renaissance painters using their hot twink lovers as their models

[–] HawlSera@lemm.ee 5 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (1 children)
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[–] NaevaTheRat@vegantheoryclub.org 5 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (3 children)

This is a pretty flawed understanding of history.

Humans have always travelled, in Europe even serfs would hope to go on pilgrimage and Lords generally had to allow it. Although it may only be to a nearby cathedral. Italy was a trade hub, and a relatively short trip by boat to north Africa.

European painters knew that people came in different shades. As proof, go look at the school of Athens painting.

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[–] PanArab@lemm.ee 15 points 7 months ago (1 children)

Jesus became white when Christianity spread in Europe and became a European religion. Earlier Jesus paintings had him a few shades darker. Palestinians are still light skinned and the dark skin is mostly acquired from working in the field.

[–] Manmoth@lemmy.ml 5 points 7 months ago

Jesus is depicted as black in the Ethiopian Orthodox church and is shown as Japanese in some Japanese Orthodox churches.

[–] Semi_Hemi_Demigod@lemmy.world 13 points 7 months ago (4 children)

Because the Vorlons have programmed the younger species to view them as holy beings

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[–] 01011@monero.town 13 points 7 months ago

Ethiopian Jesus looks like an east African.

[–] ILikeBoobies@lemmy.ca 10 points 7 months ago (5 children)

Because he was drawn by Europeans

Just like Black/Yellow Jesus existing in those populations

You ask someone to draw a person, they will likely draw someone resembling people they see. If you tell an artist a thousand years ago “from the middle east” they will say what’s that

Then you just propagate those depictions

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[–] sabreW4K3@lazysoci.al 7 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (2 children)

Say it louder for the people in the back. This is how white supremacy works. One of capitalism's most powerful tools.

[–] Mango@lemmy.world 6 points 7 months ago (2 children)

I don't feel very Supreme. I don't even feel Gucci. I feel Private Selection at Kroger at best.

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[–] MossyFeathers@pawb.social 5 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (2 children)

This is why deities, demons, spirits, angelic beings and so forth should be animalistic, aka furry. Have fun being racist about animals lmao.

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[–] meiti@lemmy.world 4 points 7 months ago (4 children)

It's not only Jesus, but it's religious figures too. Muslims do the same to depictions of their saints, they should always look like "us".

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