news
Welcome to c/news! We aim to foster a book-club type environment for discussion and critical analysis of the news. Our policy objectives are:
-
To learn about and discuss meaningful news, analysis and perspectives from around the world, with a focus on news outside the Anglosphere and beyond what is normally seen in corporate media (e.g. anti-imperialist, anti-Zionist, Marxist, Indigenous, LGBTQ, people of colour).
-
To encourage community members to contribute commentary and for others to thoughtfully engage with this material.
-
To support healthy and good faith discussion as comrades, sharpening our analytical skills and helping one another better understand geopolitics.
We ask community members to appreciate the uncertainty inherent in critical analysis of current events, the need to constantly learn, and take part in the community with humility. None of us are the One True Leftist, not even you, the reader.
Newcomm and Newsmega Rules:
The Hexbear Code of Conduct and Terms of Service apply here.
-
Link titles: Please use informative link titles. Overly editorialized titles, particularly if they link to opinion pieces, may get your post removed.
-
Content warnings: Posts on the newscomm and top-level replies on the newsmega should use content warnings appropriately. Please be thoughtful about wording and triggers when describing awful things in post titles.
-
Fake news: No fake news posts ever, including April 1st. Deliberate fake news posting is a bannable offense. If you mistakenly post fake news the mod team may ask you to delete/modify the post or we may delete it ourselves.
-
Link sources: All posts must include a link to their source. Screenshots are fine IF you include the link in the post body. If you are citing a Twitter post as news, please include the Xcancel.com (or another Nitter instance) or at least strip out identifier information from the twitter link. There is also a Firefox extension that can redirect Twitter links to a Nitter instance, such as Libredirect or archive them as you would any other reactionary source.
-
Archive sites: We highly encourage use of non-paywalled archive sites (i.e. archive.is, web.archive.org, ghostarchive.org) so that links are widely accessible to the community and so that reactionary sources don’t derive data/ad revenue from Hexbear users. If you see a link without an archive link, please archive it yourself and add it to the thread, ask the OP to fix it, or report to mods. Including text of articles in threads is welcome.
-
Low effort material: Avoid memes/jokes/shitposts in newscomm posts and top-level replies to the newsmega. This kind of content is OK in post replies and in newsmega sub-threads. We encourage the community to balance their contribution of low effort material with effort posts, links to real news/analysis, and meaningful engagement with material posted in the community.
-
American politics: Discussion and effort posts on the (potential) material impacts of American electoral politics is welcome, but the never-ending circus of American Politics© Brought to You by Mountain Dew™ is not welcome. This refers to polling, pundit reactions, electoral horse races, rumors of who might run, etc.
-
Electoralism: Please try to avoid struggle sessions about the value of voting/taking part in the electoral system in the West. c/electoralism is right over there.
-
AI Slop: Don't post AI generated content. Posts about AI race/chip wars/data centers are fine.
view the rest of the comments
I'm not the resident Hexbear oil understander, but I don't think you need to go very deep to understand that there's something wrong going on. Look at this picture:
The SPR is at its lowest levels since the 80's, and keeps falling, although at a lower rate. From what I could gather, there's a legal limit of 250MMBbl, which means that, effectively, the current 319MMBbl in the SPR is actually 69MMBbl (nice).
However, anything below 300MMBBl is uncharted territory, since there are structural concerns that start coming into play once you draw down to these levels. The salt caves start having structural integrity issues, and problems will start way before you reach the physical limit of 100MMBbl, under which there's no way to remove the oil from the underground salt caverns, kind of like the leftover hand soap below the tip of the tube of a soap dispenser.
One of the problems is that crude is like Turkish coffee, in that the sludge at the bottom is undrinkable. This means flow and quality are increasingly compromised the lower the SPR goes. The previous drawdown was, on average, 6MMBbl, but last week it was 3MMBbl.
Demand is probably on the rise with the recently increased military activity in Iran, which consumes a metric fuckton of jet fuel. There's also a push to lower gas prices in the US artificially. Crude oil prices are shooting up again. All of these factors seem to me like they would suggest that the drawdown should increase, not decrease. Are we going to see the SPR hitting a practical, real-life tank bottom sooner than expected?
Stick a big spoon down there and stir it up a little
I kept watching after the part about the salt caverns. The guy on the left (physically, certainly not politically!) is one of the real-est realists I've heard talk about this war in such a pro-global-north forum in a long time. The interviewer either is really playing into the devil's advocate interview style, or he's an idiot who's drunk the koolaid. The interviewee was actually talking straight-up material conditions. He's a ghoul, but a smart ghoul. I really hope American policymakers are ignoring him.
Edit: I got to a later point where he's talking about supporting an AI boom. So maybe he's not such a realist. Still smarter than the average ghoul though.
I found a YouTube link in your comment. Here are links to the same video on alternative frontends that protect your privacy:
If the war drags on long enough that we truly reach this point, I’m very curious to see whether or not this is another legal limit that the Trump regime will try to ignore. Will they continue to draw on reserves to artificially lower the cost of gas, risking a shortage for military use and/or a collapse of the storage facilities? Or will competent managers of empire step in to save the reserves?
Trump’s plan so far seems to be to keep everyone happy and ignorant about the war’s cost and impact to the US (which is working, do any USians really notice or care right now outside of slightly higher gas prices?), so I imagine he’ll fight to keep releasing the reserves as long as possible. It’s a lose-lose situation. Either try and prepare ahead of time by halting the release of reserves, driving prices up and pissing people off, or keep doing what they’ve been doing and face the consequences when it becomes a crisis and we drive off the cliff.
I guess the one winning scenario would be for the war to end soon and things go back to normalish, and drawing down the reserves was a gamble that pays off, but it seems like that only has a few months left to happen.
Looking at the graph. Is the initial drop 2022 due to Russian SMO or COVID?
Both, here's a history of release events.
The interesting thing will be seeing how it happens. Demand isn't decreasing, so once one tank somewhere is empty, all other tanks have to increase output to compensate. Meanwhile, the SPR output is more and more limited. The crash could be a big cascading failure instead of a managed drawdown.
That’s an easy fix, just pour a little water in there and you’re golden. Stupid tankies don’t know anything.
the crude oil isn't stored in tanks, so we're gonna need some salt cavies to weigh in on the matter
The US and Israel have had a 'if Israel ever needs oil we have to sell it to them from the SPR' deal that they've never used but kept going on paper just in case since the 70's. Netanyahu could do the funniest thing possible here
Shit is really gonna hit the fan
Wonder if there’s another mafia-esque contractor Trump is banking on totally fixing the structural issues for hundreds of millions of dollars
You could probably displace the oil with water. (Unless the oil is denser then water I guess.)
Would it be wise to introduce vast amounts of water into the types of salt caverns used for oil storage? I'm not being sarcastic, I'm genuinely hoping somebody with knowledge of oil storage in salt caverns could chime in on that.
Apparently pumping water into the caverns is how they remove the oil.
https://www.energy.gov/hgeo/opr/spr-storage-sites
After reading through this page I'm wondering where the idea that the salt caverns could collapse came from. It seems as easy as pumping water in (which they're doing already to extract the stored oil) to prevent the caverns from collapsing.
Actually, now that I think about it, they create the caverns in the first place by dissolving the salt with fresh water, so maybe leaving the caverns completely full of water causes them to dissolve over time, and they rely on a regular amount of oil to maintain their integrity?
i wouldn't think they are particularly prone to dissolution, but i rather suspect they look like inverted (and very wide) trees, so unless you put pipes every which way, the oil will get stuck in small branches and mini caverns just naturally
Oil is more dense than water though?
Less dense. That's why it floats on water.
That's what I meant and I still got it backwards somehow
Dumb question: is it stored in individual barrels or a gaint pool of oil?
It's stored in four sites which each consist of one or more caverns around the Gulf of Mexico. The caverns are artificial and made by dissolving natural subterranean salt dome structures with water, then filling them with oil.
The process of drawing oil out is to pump water in. Because crude is lighter than water it'll float up and be piped out. To store oil, surface systems forcefully pump oil into the cave and drive the water out through the bottom, where it can be piped back out by the piston force of the oil above. Both actions gradually expand the cave, as water will dissolve salt to brine. This is fine, because it just grants more capacity over time, for free.
However, the caverns must always be full, because hydraulic pressure is the only thing stopping their collapse. Further, a minimum amount of oil needs to be stored to form a "blanket" against the roof of the caverns. If water hits the ceiling, it will erode it rapidly and cause cave-in. That oil blanket also needs to be thick enough to guarantee that brine isn't drawn into the oil drawdown pipes.
Lots of pools in different areas (although a lot are clustered in certain regions).
It just fills up the salt caverns, so giant pools of oil. And the more it's drawn down, the more you risk structural damage to the caverns.
Big underground caves that may collapse if they get too low
I found a YouTube link in your comment. Here are links to the same video on alternative frontends that protect your privacy: