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submitted 8 months ago by nekandro@lemmy.ml to c/worldnews@lemmy.ml
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[-] ininewcrow@lemmy.ca 171 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

~~Ukraine~~ United States is going to lose if Congress doesn't send more aid

The fact that everyone understands that the war in Ukraine is based on American backing means that it's a proxy war between the US and Russia.

[-] Melkath@kbin.social 111 points 8 months ago

$773 billion dollars last year spent on fighting "proxy" wars around the world (and if you count the spying, domestically).

The only one that America has actual moral footing to get behind is the only one we are pulling punches on.

[-] CountVon@sh.itjust.works 43 points 8 months ago

Hardly the first time. I'd argue the US made the same mistake in Afghanistan in 2003, diverting resources to Iraq because Bush Jr. had such a hard-on for Saddam.

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[-] Karyoplasma@discuss.tchncs.de 122 points 8 months ago

Yes, no shit. That was the outlook from day 1.

The Russian Army is largely represented as a bunch of baffoons in the Western media, but it's still one of the 3 largest armies in the world. Ukraine cannot hold their lines indefinitely, the only way to "win" against an opponent that has multiple times your materiel available is guerilla.

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[-] istanbullu@lemmy.ml 115 points 8 months ago

It is a bad idea to trust and rely on Ameeica. Some Afgans learned this lesson in 2021, the same is happening to Ukraine now.

[-] Fidel_Cashflow@lemmy.ml 99 points 8 months ago
[-] Arcturus@lemmy.dbzer0.com 109 points 8 months ago

Gaddafi's is just sad. Such a terrible decision to give up their nuclear deterrence and trust western governments.

Nukes are why the DPRK hasn't been invaded again, and why it hasn't ended up Libya is now.

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[-] tiefling@lemmy.blahaj.zone 80 points 8 months ago
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The free world loses when Russia wins.

It's pretty much an invitation to China to do the same in Taiwan and an invitation for Russia to start more wars in eastern Europe.....

Helping Ukraine costs money. Not helping Ukraine costs even more.

[-] istanbullu@lemmy.ml 27 points 8 months ago

Does the free world also include places America has invaded or bombed?

[-] psmgx@lemmy.world 23 points 8 months ago

Japan, SK, and Germany seem on board with aid to Ukraine... So yes

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[-] AMDIsOurLord@lemmy.ml 21 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

"free world" has the same weight here as "state's rights"

Downvote and move on, but just like the American genocide in Iraq, you will realize I'm right in ~20 years

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[-] Alsjemenou@lemy.nl 76 points 8 months ago

People in this thread clearly don't understand what the implications are. There is a very clear danger of war on the European continent that will involve NATO and by proxy the US. Aid for Ukraine is the absolute cheapest option. Europe is not going to just let Ukraine fall and will ramp up their involvement. We already have France willing to send troops.

[-] LarkinDePark@lemmygrad.ml 24 points 8 months ago

You don't understand that the only danger of further war is again from US/NATO. Europe is going to let Ukraine fall because it has no choice. France is a laughing stock. Even what they threatened to send could do nothing.

In the case of shells, the problem isn’t money, it’s lack of production capacity. Even the mighty USA, owner of the largest military-industrial complex in the world, can only produce 28,000 rounds of 155mm per month – less than 10pc of what Ukraine needs – and this with its factories on 24-hour operation.

Comment from the Torygrapgh readership:

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[-] umbrella@lemmy.ml 24 points 8 months ago

the US is already involved by proxy

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[-] Tankiedesantski@hexbear.net 74 points 8 months ago

"It may be dangerous to be America's enemy, but to be America's friend is fatal."

[-] Linkerbaan@lemmy.world 72 points 8 months ago

Biden frantically sends more aid to israel

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[-] Yor@hexbear.net 56 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

Without the support of Congress, it will be "difficult" for Ukraine to win, "even to stay," Zelenskyy said in a video meeting with fundraising supporters, including Mark Hamill and billionaire Richard Branson.

Nightmare blunt rotation

Anyway, wow! You mean every time Russia was said to be slowing down or taking unsustainable levels of casualties wasn't entirely true? Wow! surprised-pika

[-] 420stalin69@hexbear.net 28 points 8 months ago

I think the weakness of Ukraine is also narrative.

Whatever narrative they push, it’s completely unrelated to the truth.

When they wanted western sympathy and when the western funds were rolling, it was the plucky tractor brigade killing Russians at $1.40 a kill.

Now that they aren’t getting another aid package, the front lines are about to collapse and Russia will be in Warsaw by summer.

It’s all bullshit. As in it’s unrelated to the truth. The truth has no relationship to what Zelenskyy says.

The fact Ukraine is starting to push an imminent collapse narrative is a key factor in me believing collapse is not in fact imminent.

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[-] Guamer@hexbear.net 25 points 8 months ago

Do they mean that Mark Hamill?

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[-] pelikan@lemmy.dbzer0.com 55 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

Definately NOT proxy cannon fodder

[-] Zuzak@hexbear.net 55 points 8 months ago

NATO is seeking to take control of decision-making powers on future aid packages — normally led by the US — in an effort to limit the impact of a potential second Donald Trump presidency on the ongoing conflict.

This is wild. It's bad enough that the US president has the power to start wars wherever he wants with no congressional approval. But now they're trying to make it so that the only people with the authority to withdraw from a conflict are unelected NATO officials accountable to no one.

Dronies will support this, because they love endless war across the globe and want to remove any potential for popular support to achieve peace.

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[-] ShimmeringKoi@hexbear.net 52 points 8 months ago

"Lol", said the red white and blue scorpion. "Lmao".

[-] yogthos@lemmy.ml 44 points 8 months ago

I was wondering how the media was going to explain the collapse in Ukraine when it finally becomes impossible to hide it, and now we know. The whole thing is going to be blamed on republicans holding up money in congress, as if pouring another 61 billion after all the untold billions that were already poured into this was going to make any difference. The fact that people genuinely believe this is frankly depressing. It shows just how utterly credulous and mentally deficient western public is.

[-] unreasonabro@lemmy.world 40 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

nice job america, now in addition to everything else, you've lost a war you weren't even fighting in. Fuck yeah!

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[-] Assian_Candor@hexbear.net 29 points 8 months ago
[-] CyborgMarx@hexbear.net 27 points 8 months ago

Lose away bozo, you got played

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[-] AFC1886VCC@reddthat.com 26 points 8 months ago

Countries will get fed up of sending aid to Ukraine long before Russia decides to return its annexed territories. We're already seeing signs of that.

If NATO isn't willing to go in and force the Russians out themselves, I fail to see how this war is anything but a net gain for Russia. They will just sit back and let their "new territories" become more and more Russified.

To me, the aid is just a delaying tactic to allow Ukraine to continue fighting until the west can figure out a way to accept that Ukraine has lost its territories without losing face.

It's a shit show, but I don't share the optimism that a lot of people have for a Ukrainian victory. It's like a game of chess, and it's currently Ukraine/NATOs turn, because the Russians are already dug in.

[-] ShimmeringKoi@hexbear.net 26 points 8 months ago

I mean yeah, the Russian Federation has clearly won this one

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[-] Hestia@hexbear.net 25 points 8 months ago
[-] NoLifeGaming@lemmy.world 22 points 8 months ago

Ukraine is already losing and unless something crazy happens they will lose.

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this post was submitted on 08 Apr 2024
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