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submitted 3 months ago by JRepin@lemmy.ml to c/technology@lemmy.world

cross-posted from: https://lemmy.ml/post/20289663

A report from Morgan Stanley suggests the datacenter industry is on track to emit 2.5 billion tons by 2030, which is three times higher than the predictions if generative AI had not come into play.

The extra demand from GenAI will reportedly lead to a rise in emissions from 200 million tons this year to 600 million tons by 2030, thanks largely to the construction of more data centers to keep up with the demand for cloud services.

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[-] Kyrgizion@lemmy.world 93 points 3 months ago

Between AI and shitcoin mining, these two "technology branches" already consume more power than all the green power added to the grid combined.

It's why humans will always remain de facto slaves to a few masters. Anything that could potentially be advantageous to all life on Earth? Only if the ones at the top get to profit first. No profit? Enjoy scorching to death on hell-planet for the next forty years!

[-] zaphod@sopuli.xyz 44 points 3 months ago

Between AI and shitcoin mining, these two “technology branches” already consume more power than all the green power added to the grid combined.

And your sources? I only did a cursory search, and according to the IEA data centers are responsible for somewhere in the range of 2-6% of electricity demand. Renewables are currently around 30% globally.

Source: https://www.iea.org/reports/electricity-2024

[-] Lost_My_Mind@lemmy.world 24 points 3 months ago

I feel like some people are just emotional reactionaries. They see a certain story, and in their own mind they make the story worse than it is, and treat their feelings as fact.

I have no sources on this, or proof that this guy in particular is doing that.

.........wait, am I doing it right now???

Hmmmmm......

[-] LodeMike@lemmy.today 3 points 3 months ago

Maybe they got confused about total power usage (maybe) being more than the green power added?

[-] Sanctus@lemmy.world 2 points 3 months ago

I dont think much will remain after this extinction event. Do you know how long it takes niches to refill in an ecosystem? We're going to get to a point where industry collapses and we are reset if we survive at all.

[-] Kyrgizion@lemmy.world 11 points 3 months ago

We wouldn't even be able to restart. All the easily available resources have been delved. Three thousand years ago people could scoop pure gold from rivers by the kilos. Today, all decent deposits lie kilometers below the surface.

But it'll be for the best. We had our shot and blew it.

[-] Tenniswaffles@lemmy.blahaj.zone 12 points 3 months ago

Resources like gold would be more accessible, y'know because it already been mined and made into things. If society collapses what few survivors there are could recycle shit like metals. The actual issue is fossil fuels. Getting to a point where you can use renewable power would be difficult with using fossil fuels for power first.

[-] technocrit@lemmy.dbzer0.com 4 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

Pretty sure immortan joe is going to be wearing all that gold.

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[-] Blaster_M@lemmy.world 1 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

AI consumes power, yes, it's projected to triple its environmental impact, yes, but its environmental impact is much less than most other things. If anything, the AI hate train draws angry peoples' focus off the big polluters that matter.

"Arrghle AI is in everything and modern cars track you, I'll just drive a 30+ year old pickup truck because they don't has no AI tracking nonsense"

Oil and gas companies: money

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[-] Ragdoll_X@lemmy.world 35 points 3 months ago

I remember when scientists were more focused on making AI models smaller and more efficient, and research on generative models was focused on making GANs as robust as possible with very little compute and data.

Now that big companies and rich investors saw the potential for profit in AI the paradigm has shifted to "throw more compute at the wall until something sticks", so it's not surprising it's affecting carbon emissions.

Besides that it's also annoying that most of the time they keep their AIs behind closed doors, and even in the few cases where the weights are released publicly these models are so big that they aren't usable for the vast majority of people, as sometimes even Kaggle can't handle them.

[-] RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world 27 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

Everyone thought AI was going to kill us via some Terminator-like Skynet.

Nope.

It’s just going to let us kill ourselves via greed and accelerate destroying the environment.

[-] sik0fewl@lemmy.ca 7 points 3 months ago

But it's ok because it's also going to solve climate change.

[-] Rakudjo@lemmy.world 4 points 3 months ago

And even if it doesn't, it'll still make hundreds of trillions of dollars doing it, so it was worth it in the end.

[-] exso@lemmy.world 2 points 3 months ago

Don't worry, it's all very green!

The cash and stock tickers that is.

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[-] credo@lemmy.world 26 points 3 months ago

Which search engines give results without an AI generated response?

[-] noodlejetski@lemm.ee 16 points 3 months ago

Startpage and DuckDuckGo, but you might want to disable summaries in the latter's settings.

[-] Wispy2891@lemmy.world 14 points 3 months ago

Every IT company now: we should increase our server costs by 100x to offer unwanted gimmicks that users don't want and aren't willing to pay

[-] towerful@programming.dev 3 points 3 months ago

And don't trust

[-] gedaliyah@lemmy.world 10 points 3 months ago

Look, i'm not saying that this isn't a problem. My only question is, is this one of those "global warming is because people don't recycle their soda bottles" things? In other words, How concerned should I be about this vs, taking attention away from the energy, beef, and transportation industry?

[-] RustyShackleford@literature.cafe 27 points 3 months ago

Very concerned. It’s currently a race who can speed run us to extinction first.

[-] catloaf@lemm.ee 7 points 3 months ago

I don't think this is something to focus on. Tech being 40% of all emissions in the US is suspicious, given that in 2021, all industry was 30.1%, and all transportation was 28.5%. And the total emissions in the US was 6.3 billion tons. https://www.ers.usda.gov/data-products/chart-gallery/gallery/chart-detail/?chartId=108623

I don't have more recent data (if it's in the article, I didn't see it at a skim) but I feel like oil, gas, and agriculture are the bigger long-term targets.

[-] ElderReflections@fedia.io 11 points 3 months ago

Looks like Techradar misunderstood parts of the source story. The projected emissions over the next 10 years is equal to 40% of all US emissions. The Register

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[-] Teknikal@eviltoast.org 8 points 3 months ago

It's a nice gimmick and sometimes fun but probably not worth it given the state of the planet already.

[-] mrvictory1@lemmy.world 8 points 3 months ago

Call me surprised.

[-] werefreeatlast@lemmy.world 5 points 3 months ago

This is exactly what using AI feels like:

https://youtu.be/lM0teS7PFMo?

[-] alienanimals@lemmy.world 4 points 3 months ago

"The only way to interpret statistics is with a healthy dose of skepticism and a thorough understanding of their context."

While people in this thread jump at the opportunity for this slice of statistics to affirm their confirmation biases, intelligent people will ask what the total carbon dioxide output looks like by comparison.

[-] Facebones@reddthat.com 6 points 3 months ago

You're quick to imply that this study is bullshit, yet offer no counter argument except "believing statistics is for losers lul"

So where are your sources to refute the article?

[-] NocturnalEngineer@lemmy.world 7 points 3 months ago

Ita also trivial to come to the same conclusion at a smaller scale.

You can run a LLM at home and see the amount of GPU & power resources it takes to compute the larger models. If I ran that full time, your household bill will most likely be 3x alone.

[-] alienanimals@lemmy.world 3 points 3 months ago

Never said the study was bullshit. I just said to look at the bigger picture.

I would show you how Google works and provide an article, but your reading comprehension leads me to believe you'd come up with another straw man fallacy to support your confirmation bias.

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[-] MonkderVierte@lemmy.ml 3 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

Lesson: only ask AI if you're still stuck after searching and have no colleague around.

[-] explodicle@sh.itjust.works 6 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

This is the "carbon footprint" fallacy created by big oil. We should vote left and unionize until either the external cost of pollution is internalized with pigouvian taxes, or electricity is rationed by a community-owned organization.

Nobody will notice us shooting ourselves in the foot and expecting corporations to do it too. They don't care if we lead by example unilaterally.

[-] drunkpostdisaster@lemmy.world 3 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

Oh yea, this is happening too.

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this post was submitted on 15 Sep 2024
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