The result of several decades from NRA successfully screaming Dems gonna get you guns!

Something bad. Is it something bad? I bet it was something bad.

Look at the results of that 90s LA bank robbery. It was the first time that two guys had enough body armour and firepower to challenge the local police. What was the end result? Every police officer across the country getting assigned body armour and high powered rifles, and every police agency militarizing and buying APCS, tactical units, etc.

The idea that the government would allow you to own weaponry that would legitimately challenge them is asinine.

You're describing exactly how the tyranny is done

At some point people confused peaceful with harmless. Harmless people who got accustomed to the idea of outsourcing the capacity for violence... but then the vendor had a change in ownership...

If you need to exercise your right to bear arms, you have already lost. The battle is won in education, critical skills, and mobilising together (unions, etc).

This is honestly, the dumbest, most American take in the world.

It literally ignores the plainly obvious fact that not a single other developed country allows gun ownership, and yet, still have rights and democracy and freedom.

Guns did not get your rights, and they do not protect you from a government that has AI powered drones with anti tank mines on them. Hell a fucking APC with a sound cannon will make your AR look like a child's toy.

Guess what happened when a pair of guys had enough guns and body armour to challenge the local LA government in the 90s? Oh would you look at that, every single local government's police force across the country just militarized and bought tanks and SWAT teams in response. The idea that the government will let any random potentially mentally ill or terrorist citizen, buy enough firepower that they could legitimately challenge the government, is dumb on its face. No government anywhere allows that or would for obvious (see: terroristic) reasons.

Wide spread gun ownership just makes everyone less safe. Full stop.

You're right. It's a liberal idea to allow the (largely) unregulated possession of firearms. However, it takes a certain mindset to pickup that forearm and try to decide how the country is run with it through armed insurrection. One that's more akin to authoritarian, or at least paternalism.

Personally I feel if the 2nd amendment is there for this reason, the ln the no kings marches should have had arms. That's a powderkeg scenario and we'd probably be looking at hundreds dead at this point. However if there was ever a reason for the 2nd amendment, this is it and that's the cost. Otherwise there's no point in the right to bear arms and you should scrap it.

Look at somewhere like Syria. Governments still get taken down by armed revolutionaries. Yes, there is the issue that governments are better armed. But there are a few fatal flaws in the idea that this makes them invincible:

1. A lot of expensive weapons systems like airplanes and tanks can be taken out by much cheaper and accessible systems like MANPADS and drones.

2. There will be people on the side of the rebels with previous military experience that will know how to use the heavier weapons.

3. Groups of revolutionaries armed with civilian-accessible weapons can find lightly defended military bases, storm them, and seize heavier weapons.

4. Rebel groups always receive outside assistance from foreign powers.

If a group of revolutionaries deposes the California state government, declares the New California Republic, and tries to secede from the US, they won't be fighting with AR-15s for long. They'll be using the strongest available civilian weapons to raid National Guard armories and other locations that may not be so heavily defended. They may even do so with the tacit support of those working at those facilities. Then their goal will be to hold out long enough against the US government that they can petition foreign powers like China to support their rebellion against the US federal government.

Revolts don't happen in a vacuum. Rebels don't need to hold out against the central government indefinitely armed only with light weaponry. At the end of the day, there's going to be some other well armed country out there that's going to be more than happy to see their geopolitical rival be embroiled in a war of secession. If California decided to rebel on Monday, by Friday the PRC would be loading every drone, antitank missile, and MANPAD they can find into crates, ready to smuggle them in container ships past the US Navy. Even if China didn't support the aims of the California rebels, it wouldn't matter. Hell, they wouldn't even care about the final outcome of the war. They would happily fund heavy weapons to the rebels just to make sure the US federal government was too embroiled in a crisis at home to devote many resources to places like Taiwan.

The Vietnamese and Afghans could probably tell us a thing or two.

One aspect I don't think many appreciate is the deterrent effect of private gun ownership. The fascists would have already overrun us were we not armed. Notice the major ICE raids have been in NYC and California? Those are the two places in America with the strictest, and often dumbest, gun laws. Anecdotally, being visibly armed likely saved me two ass beatings in the past year. LOL, one guy was so fucking mad he was shaking, choking himself to be polite.

Most of our military might can't be brought to bear on civilians. The examples you gave are purpose built to fight another military on their turf. The Air Force isn't going to deploy fighter jets to put down a riot. And NONE of those things will continue working about a week after civilians pull support.

Because the military would fracture during a civil war.

You see, if the government bombs it's cities flat, it no longer has anything to govern, and falls anyways.

What we need are armed protests. Something you can't just easily police thug your way out of. We can all go protest and wave signs all we want, but until those in power are once again afraid of it's people, nothing will change.

Only you don't accidentally beat someone to death with a hammer.

Gerrymandering. Registration purges. Compromised voting machines. Voter suppression and intimidation. Banning mail-in voting. Closing, relocating, and reducing polling sites.

Insert meme: “Is this voting rights?”