If only people could understand the basic concept that hating a government is possible without hating the people living there.
Exactly. Hamas is a monstrous organization based on the most corrupted religious fundamentalism, but I have nothing but love for the people of Gaza.
Reminder that Hamas is widely supported by most Palestinians
53% of Palestinians believe Hamas is "most deserving of representing and leading the Palestinian people"
https://apnews.com/article/hamas-middle-east-science-32095d8e1323fc1cad819c34da08fd87
First of all I really wouldn't put much weight on the voting results in an area where Hamas uses violence for decades to keep in power. Especially if there isn't any semblance of a modern democratic state such as regular(!!) elections, freedom of speech and a free press. A 1-2 generation long youth indoctrination like the Nazis did also really doesn't create an educated and politically mature population.
And of course 53% still leaves a huge amount of people who aren't in favour. Not to mention that there is a 70+ year long ongoing conflict which has left pretty much no one in Gaza (or Israel for that matter) who doesn't know someone getting hurt or killed by the opposing side's actions. It's hardly surprising that there's hard feeling (major understatement) in a lot of people.
And lastly we certainly wouldn't want to use public opinion as justification for killing civilians. That's the reasoning the likes of Osama bin Laden do to justify shit like 9/11.
TL;DR: This conflict is complicated as hell and basically a self fueling cycle of hatred where even the good side is acting very shitty a lot of times.
Yes, but also that hating a government (or even just decisions of a government) doesn't extend to hating people across the globe who identify with the same religion that government is using to oppress people.
(American Jew who hates what Israel is doing)
One of my favorite quotes:
If I have one message to give to the secular American people, it’s that the world is not divided into countries. The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don’t know each other, but we talk together and we understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same. - Marjane Satrapi
Different situation, same idea.
A reminder:
Palestinians are awesome!
The genocidal regime that rules over Gaza who murder innocent people while blocking Palestinian democracy is NOT AWESOME!
What about all the Palestinians internationally that are currently celebrating that massacre?
Yeah those guys are on the side of the genocidal regime.
Palestinian fascism.... Hamas won the election with just a plurality of the vote then permanently suspended elections ever since. Same old story. Odd how it's never talked about. I suppose Palestinian fascism complicates support for Palestine for the left so they pretend it isn't a thing, while it also complicates the "them people are all terrorists" narrative ofr the right.
It's hard to determine the popularity of Hamas now (there has been an election in over a decade and a half) in the Palestinian population. There is obviously support of the genocidal maniacs in the Palestinian populace because of those celebrations. The people that support Hamas have either been duped by their propaganda or are just straight up evil, or both.
I agree in general, but what an image choice for the Jewish people. Hassidics are far far less awesome and far far more right wing themselves.
Yeah, it's like picturing a Christian man wearing a maga hat, camo pants and a wifebeater he justifies the name of, surrounded by a fearfully obedient family. Like "Christian people are awesome!"
Hasidics consider the average conservative "too liberal".
In my opinion this is an "everyone sucks here" situation and no one knows how to approach it as a result.
Maybe stop killing each other and take it from there? No? More rockets and human rights abuse? Yeah that'll work...
Israel could start by ending apartheid and allowing the Palestinian people a modicum of dignity and representation in government, or let them have their own state.
I would agree in principle, but there are a few issues that need to be resolved:
Yeah, it’s gotten to a point where the divide is so deep and so old and there has been so much slaughter on each side that nobody is ever going to feel like “things are fair now.“ Both groups have committed atrocities, both groups have been victims of atrocities, and it’s just become a vendetta at this point with endless retaliation.
I don’t know what the answer is to be honest.
Our politicians fucking love regimes that murder reporters
Calling the Israel govt "genocidal" is not fair or accurate. Israel has had military superiority over Gaza every day since it was captured in 1967. If they were genocidal, they could've slaughtered all the people in Gaza at any time. Instead, the population of Gaza has doubled since 1967. If you want to know what a real genocidal regime looks like, imagine the situation were reversed and Hamas had overwhelming military superiority over Israel. Imagine Hamas had tanks, F-16s, F-35s, and Apache helicopters. What would happen? The genocide would start immediately. Hamas would be slaughtering civilians en masse. No restraint. No negotiations. True Genocide.
Before you ask, I'm not Jewish and I'm not defending Israeli atrocities. I just think this is an extremely simplistic and unfair characterization of Israel.
The language lacks a nuance in between "intentional mass slaughter" and "systematic eradication and displacement of ethnic group."
Both are classed as genocide by international conventions, even if in our heads they seem very different.
Genocide isn't about just slaughtering people, it is also about removing and displacing a people from a region, something which Israel policy definitely and inarguably has systematically been.
If a bunch of refugees flee roaming Jewish folk running around trying to murder them (like Muslims fled India and Hindus fled Pakistan during Partition as folks of each religion roamed around trying to murder people of the minority faith) in 1948 and refugees flee the 1967 war, fearing for their safety, and then they're not allowed to return to their homes, that's ethnic cleansing. If you're constantly being pushed off your land and your home in order to be replaced by settlers of another faith, that's also ethnic cleansing.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_cleansing
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1948_Palestinian_expulsion_and_flight
Don't forget the forced evictions, but this is worse don't get me wrong
Am I the only one suspicious about the timing of this attack? Right on the time Netanyahu is under extreme pressure at home a major war comes out of his ass.
Can't help but notice everybody loses with this war, except him. He's the only one that takes advantage of this situation. Not Israel, not Hamas and sure as hell not the Palestinians.
There's a stench here. Something is not right.
Is this really a win for Netanyahu though? His intelligence branch really fucked up big time. Real winner is probably any far-right groups looking for an opportunity to spout even more nationalistic bullshit, causing even more violence.
I wish all Jewish people of the world a happy and safe day of rest for Shemini Atzeret; peace and safety for anyone living in the Gaza region.
I've been awake too long, but isn't murdering infidels and blowing up thousands of years of culture so you can seize a land promised to you by an invisible omnipotent being that only important powerful people can talk to kind of like the Crusades?
I could be wrong. I'm an illiterate pagan. I find religious expression hugging trees and doing a number of other activities in the nude.
This part of the image has me dying. The cutesy simplistic art style would fit in a kindergarten class but it's about war crimes lmao.
Lemmy's flooded with anti-palestinian-occupation propaganda today.
Please keep it up.
Love these over simplified, deep fried karma farms. I'm so cool let me vote up or down.
Im seing a bunch of things about israel right now, im out of the loop on this. Can somebody fill me in on what (if anything) happened?
Hamas launched a bunch of rockets from Gaza in a surprise attack on a holy day and then put ground fores in. This attack killed at least 100 Israeli civilians (Israel is also claiming near 1000 more injured) and has captured more.
Israel is of course going to retaliate and try and destroy the sites (surrounded by civilians since Hamas is known to try and use sensitive civilian locations as shields) and probably occupy Gaza in an effort to keep these rocket attacks from happening. Which will cause more Palestinian casualties, thus the cycle continues.
Israeli already killed more than 200 civillians in Gaza including bombing a hospital killing at least one international MFS medic.
Hamas launched a surpise attack on Israel yesterday, invading by land air and sea.
They massacered over 300 people, injured thousands, and abducted tens more.
Some of the victims are soldiers, the vast majority are civilians.
They cut up, desecrated and paraded the bodies of Israelis in their streets while chanting and cheering.
They fired thousands of rockets indiscriminately on Israeli cities hoping to cause as many civilian casualties as possible.
There is place to criticize Israel and their crimes agains Palestinians. There is no place to condone Hamas.
Hamas are terrorsists, and it disgusts me to my core to see Lemmy cheer on these bloodthirsty ghouls.
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