well yeah most of its operating software was derived from opensource projects, but capitalists exploited those opensource project without giving the tinest bit back, so...
For a while there, the Darwin OS was open source.
"It's better to be a pirate than join the navy" - Steve Jobs
Darwin is open source. It uses some closed source device drivers but the core OS is APSL which is an open source license.
If you want to talk about Apple specifically, then consider this. When they began making popular tech like MacBooks and Ipods, they justified the prices by giving free warranties. They would replace or repair any device at no extra cost of the consumer. Well, they stopped doing that and then wanted you to pay an annual fee to get the same service. Then they did away with that and now it's pay per repair or replacement and the prices went up instead of down. My theory is that was their business target in the first place. Get their products wide spread, and then pull rug out from under the consumer. To me, Apple is the best example of capitalism
AppleCare still exists. So this is misinformation.
And just as an anecdote, I have not felt like Apple has ever “pulled the rug out” on me and I’m an Apple product consumer. Are you?
I was
That’s simply not true. Apple still has the same one year limited warranty they had when iPods were released. Steve Jobs justified the higher premium because you were getting “the store in the box,” referring to the in-store troubleshooting and educational support at no extra cost.
Source: worked for Apple for over a decade
What the hell is a store in a box?? Without cool aid it doesn't make sense
It means support and education at no cost. Troubleshooting and diagnostics are free at the Genius Bar. You only pay if hardware is replaced out of warranty. Free device and software education classes are available all day.
This isn’t really true.
Apple, at least here in the UK, give a 1 year warranty as is the law and anything repairs that need doing that are not the fault of the consumer (ie dropping and breaking the screen) are covered under this warranty. Furthermore, if there is a problem with a line of products then they will extend the warranties to cover that issue for a longer period of time.
You can pay to have AppleCare+ which will extend this warranty and add on accidental damage too.
There are plenty of legitimate reasons to shit on Apple without having to make up new ones.
Also, iPhones are a lot cheaper than they were a few years ago and they’re cheaper than their Samsung counterparts when comparing Pro vs Pro, etc.
Source: Worked for Apple for 3+ years and I’ve consumed many of their products, although I now only have an iPhone. For what it’s worth MacOS is infinitely better than windows.
Applecare is still around so you’re wrong already.
Look, Apple’s done some shitty stuff and as an iPhone and MacBook owner I won’t deny it. Every company right now is desperately trying to find ways to charge more for less because there aren’t really any corners left to cut for capitalism to pump stock numbers up but infinite growth is still making its usual demands.
Apple products are still way more robust than the competition and they’re way ahead on things like ARM and making OSs that aren’t complete trash(Windows is a worthless piece of shit and always has been, even at its best. I own and regularly use a self-built gaming PC, so I experience it all the time). I’ll buy their products because their shit actually works and can be relied on. Plus I was able to finance my laptop at 0% and honestly the price I paid for my 14” MacBook Pro was comparable to what I would have paid for the same tier back in 2010 when I got my first MacBook so honestly, with inflation and all, it was surprisingly affordable(it was still really expensive, I won’t lie).
Anyhow it kinda sounds like you don’y have much experience with these products or haven’t learned from your experiences with them and just want to ride that bandwagon. Look into the awful shit Samsung has been doing or how expensive some of the other Android options are and you’ll see that this goes way beyond your specific hate of “the evil fruit company”. Capitalism is just rotten everywhere.
All modern devices are made using one form of slave labor or another.
https://ethical.net/technology/the-slavery-supported-the-device-in-your-pocket/
I think that's what they must when they say "built by capitalism."
I mean, any other usage would be utterly ridiculous. So, that must be what they mean.
It literally is. The idea I’ve seen around is that these things couldn’t be built without someone getting the short end of the stick. They also believe that no one would innovate without a profit motive. These people genuinely believe that the only other option is flipping entirely over to that garbage attempt the soviets made at communism. They fundamentally cannot comprehend the idea of nuance and so “capitalism is the only idea that works”.
We know that CEO wages are insane and that the reason we can’t afford stuff is our stagnant pay. We know that people innovate for their own curiousity all the time. We know that capitalism actually hates innovation because it means retooling and spending money on R&D and we’ve seen it fight progress basically at every turn or watched it buy up competition so it wouldn’t have to any real work.
So yea, you’re right.
Well, it’s always “humans made this”.
I think it’s trivial to argue that without capitalism we would not have iPhones, they are the product of the desire to please a market to make a lot of money.
If the driver was "I want to build something useful for my fellow humans" that wouldn’t likely trend toward an elitist redundant unsustainable device built on the exploitation of cheap labor.
If not for capitalism, we’d be missing out on internet ads, online dating and for-profit healthcare!
Okay, sure, I'll play devil's advocate. The engineering that goes into a single iPhone is unfathomable. It would take an entire lifetime of study to even try to produce something close.
But Apple pays about a jillion engineers about a jillion dollars each, and so they're able to create new iPhones every year or so. That was 100% powered by capitalism.
Yeah, workers physically put the pieces together. Do you think any of them could design an iPhone without any help or reference? Or a single body to tie it all together?
Do you think people cannot collaborate without capitalism?
Absolutely not! I'd ask why they should, and obviously there are many reasons.
Is the "help or reference" coming from other workers?
... It's coming from the culmination of, like 5 decades of absurdly educated engineering. If you want to call them workers, then sure.
They weren't workers? is this "absurdly educated engineering" like a magic ghost inhabiting the halls of Apple HQ? Is this "engineering" in the room with us right now?
Seriously, I fail to grasp the point you're trying to make here...
It's coming from someone who dedicated their entire life to being smarter than you or me about electronics.
Go on. Give your opinion.
Engineers are workers. Well paid yes, but you're going against the wrong people, they're not capitalists and don't make the decisions that matter.
Then, why do you think an a economy post capitalist wouldn't be able to develop smart phones? Do you think we'd return to feudalism and the world would devolve into dark ages and all the scientific knowledge would disappear?
You're basically arguing that this process had nothing to do with capitalism. Like Apple isn't capitalist, it's just workers working. Like what is the logic here. Those workers didn't do it to create the iPhone... they did it because the capitalist who wanted to create the iPhone was paying them. So that his privately owned firm could compete against other similar firms in the market.
Yes and workers in the Soviet Union also made telephones. But only for the party leaders who didn't see there was a need for ordinary people to have phones.
Yes, workers make phones in any system. But who decides how many to make and what price to charge for them?
An international (English speaking) socialist Lemmy community free of the "ML" influence of instances like lemmy.ml and lemmygrad. This is a place for undogmatic shitposting and memes from a progressive, anti-capitalist and truly anti-imperialist perspective, regardless of specific ideology.
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