this post was submitted on 13 Dec 2025
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Why are anarchist mutual aid groups always like this? (hexbear.net)
submitted 2 months ago by allthetimesivedied2@hexbear.net to c/askchapo@hexbear.net
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I literally just got fucking scolded and told I have some "accountability for my behavior" or whatever because I replied to someone who was insulting me, defaming my character, and lying about me with "Fuck you, you lying piece of shit." This isn't the first time this has happened, and it's always in these anarchist/"radical" mutual aid groups. I was flabbergasted. It was like I was on some other planet.

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[–] Hyper_red@hexbear.net 51 points 2 months ago (4 children)

I have let to encounter any local anarchist, ML, DSA, etc group which wasn't led by like 3 of the most vile clout and Twitter-obsessed assholes with zero social skills.

The trots here in Ireland are really annoying (and have sex pest problems) but at least you can join a local group and its not being used by someone who wants to use it just to hold power over people.

Local trans groups are also like this but they're also usually led by trans anarchists who want to have power over people and yell at people.

its always "erm you SLIGHTLY disagreed with Sarah. YOU NOW NEED TO FUCKING DO A PUBLIC HUMILIATION RITUAL TO THE GROUP AND APOLOGIZE ABOUT HOW EVIL AND BAD YOU ARE OR YOU'RE KICKED OUT!"

Its like they want to run a cult not anything useful

[–] LeninWeave@hexbear.net 44 points 2 months ago (1 children)
[–] Hyper_red@hexbear.net 36 points 2 months ago (2 children)

"Because elites are informal does not mean they are invisible. At any small group meeting anyone with a sharp eye and an acute ear can tell who is influencing whom. The members of a friendship group will relate more to each other than to other people. They listen more attentively, and interrupt less; they repeat each other’s points and give in amiably; they tend to ignore or grapple with the “outs” whose approval is not necessary for making a decision."

Fun fact there are like three different trans socials in dublin. One is irrelevant. One sucks, and the other is for trans fems.

The one for trans fems was TAKEN OVER BY A FUCKING POLYCULE AT SOME POINT. SO if you went it would be super fucking awkward to try to socialize because a fucking polycule would be 80% of the people there and if they didn't find you hot or interesting enough to join the polycule they wouldn't talk to you.

So now the transfer social has a representation with local transfems (who aren't babytrans) of just being a big weird anarchist polycule. IDK if its still like that or if it still goes on. THe trans rights non profit shit down its building where it was hosted.

But this article is reminding me how these anarchist "no organizer" shit always ends up being toxic.

[–] cerealkiller@hexbear.net 24 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

Reminds me of our student movement here too.

They started out as anti-political essentially anarchist with some lib talking points about "democracy and a state that respects the law". To turning to electoralism and shit.

Only the be infiltrated by NGO's that are both lib and right wing lmao. The whole thing is essentially over now. People were hyping this up mind you to be a revolution.

[–] LeninWeave@hexbear.net 15 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

I assume this isn't Nepal because you don't mention riots, but this playbook seems very commonplace nowadays.

[–] cerealkiller@hexbear.net 19 points 2 months ago

Yeah, It's Serbia. We had ironically the most organized anarchist-ish student movement that didn't really succeed much lol.

[–] ConcreteHalloween@hexbear.net 24 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Yeah "political org that's actually just a Polycule" seems to be an oddly common experience around here.

[–] Collatz_problem@hexbear.net 16 points 2 months ago (2 children)

We should unironically enforce volcel police in our political organizations to combat this bullshit.

[–] ConcreteHalloween@hexbear.net 17 points 2 months ago

Problem is, you get a bunch of like minded young people together doing activities, some of them are gonna want to fuck each other.

[–] VOLCEL_POLICE@hexbear.net 6 points 2 months ago

The VOLCEL POLICE are on the scene! PLEASE KEEP YOUR VITAL ESSENCES TO YOURSELVES AT ALL TIMES.

نحن شرطة VolCel.بناءا على تعليمات الهيئة لترويج لألعاب الفيديو و النهي عن الجنس نرجوا الإبتعاد عن أي أفكار جنسية و الحفاظ على حيواناتكم المنويَّة حتى يوم الحساب. اتقوا الله، إنك لا تراه لكنه يراك.

volcel-police

[–] Hyper_red@hexbear.net 33 points 2 months ago (4 children)

I will also say the big difference I've noticed between joining local ML/maoist groups and anarchist groups is that ML groups are usually mostly men who watch the deprogram and hasan and use too much reddit have never read theory. Anarrchist groups will contain more women, who do not watch hasan or the deprogram, but they also don't read theory.

Trots usually do read theory, but its literally only ever trot theory and nothing else, and every trot group Ive seen has been very equal in gender %.

IDK what this means

[–] fort_burp@feddit.nl 24 points 2 months ago

but they also don’t read theory.

lmao

Fascinating though, fr

[–] Awoo@hexbear.net 21 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

IDK what this means

Speaking for the UK, the ML groups are almost all dudes because they're sexist terf wankers. The only women in them are terfs, a good portion of them probably fed plants or infiltrators.

All the women with pro-lgbt social views (which is near 100% of women left of liberal) find this a dealbreaker.

Can't speak for elsewhere in the world but sexism is probably holding back women organisers in orgs and it's charismatic visible organising women that tend to attract more women if there are no other dealbreakers.

[–] Hyper_red@hexbear.net 17 points 2 months ago (1 children)

I wrote a paper once how second wave feminism in the UK only really started because men in all the uk maoist organizations literally couldn't stop themselves from hating women

[–] Awoo@hexbear.net 15 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

I suspect this has been inherited in the left from Men's Working Clubs and the pre-Thatcher left being all-male dirty industry like mining and ship building. The culture transitioned to many of the surviving unions instead and still stinks up the hard-left to this day.

It ironically might be better today if MORE of the left had been destroyed back then so that the culture didn't survive.

[–] ConcreteHalloween@hexbear.net 15 points 2 months ago

I will also say the big difference I've noticed between joining local ML/maoist groups and anarchist groups is that ML groups are usually mostly men who watch the deprogram and hasan and use too much reddit

side-eye-1 side-eye-2

[–] ufcwthrowaway@hexbear.net 6 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

Where I am, MLs are trans women, and anarchists are cis lesbians and enbies, I have yet to meet a cis-het activist. The gay men are syndicalists.

[–] Hyper_red@hexbear.net 5 points 2 months ago

Trans women here are liberals or anarchists.

The anarchists ones are "organize" (create polycules)

[–] Awoo@hexbear.net 28 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Local trans groups are also like this

Some trans groups are looking to fight people over things so hard that they attack other trans people for literally no reason over incredibly minor mistakes of language with no regard whatsoever for tone or intent or international cultural differences in language use. It's led to so many people I know having horrendous experiences when joining some groups and getting attacked. It's really not good.

[–] dragongloss@hexbear.net 13 points 2 months ago

And then a few months or years later the whole thing collapses in dramatic fashion. Members scatter, sometimes traumatized. It sucks. I'm not part of any trans groups anymore. Also I'm not baby trans anymore, so that could be a factor too.

[–] SerialExperimentsGay@hexbear.net 38 points 2 months ago (2 children)

I've seen that happen as well, both in anarchist and in less ideologically focussed / more liberal-leaning queer communities. There can be some pretty hardcore ostracism mechanics going on in self-organized groups with hidden, clout-based hierarchies. It's also always coming from a specific kind of person in my experience, i've learned to recognize their vibe and watch out for them. I find it hard to put into words, but some folks, they're like a live wire when it comes to this stuff.

[–] Hyper_red@hexbear.net 37 points 2 months ago (2 children)

some "socialists" or "leftists" want to be cult leaders and use "organizing" as their way of fulfilling their fantasy

Ive seen a lot of queer people use queer organizing as a way to create toxic polycules which take over the org which is sus

[–] purpleworm@hexbear.net 30 points 2 months ago (1 children)

When education is not liberatory, the dream of the oppressed is to become the oppressor

[–] SerialExperimentsGay@hexbear.net 13 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

I've seen this mostly from sex negative transmisogynist transmascs who will slutshame trans women at every opportunity, but besides that, i recognize a lot of the behaviors described ITT

[–] LeninWeave@hexbear.net 35 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (2 children)

There can be some pretty hardcore ostracism mechanics going on in self-organized groups with hidden, clout-based hierarchies.

The Tyranny of Structurelessness, by Jo Freeman.

[–] allthetimesivedied2@hexbear.net 23 points 2 months ago (2 children)

What if instead of Jo Freeman it was Jo Fremen.

[–] MemesAreTheory@hexbear.net 9 points 2 months ago

I'll take Jo Stalin, personally

[–] ufcwthrowaway@hexbear.net 6 points 2 months ago

When an anarchist is writing an essay on the need for structure, you'd better listen to her!

[–] microfiche@hexbear.net 19 points 2 months ago (1 children)

It isn't the first time what has happened? You've been told you need to be accountable for your behavior, or the first time you've butted heads with mutual aid groups?

it's probably not what you want to hear but I get the feeling you're leaving something out. It doesn't really seem like you're asking a question either but i know very little.

[–] allthetimesivedied2@hexbear.net 20 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

I'm not.

And I mean, this isn't the first time I've been attacked in one of these groups, and then scolded for biting back and feeling like I'm in an episode of The Twilight Zone because it's like they don't see the person attacking me at all. It almost seems like a joke, like I'm being punked, but I'm not.

[–] Acute_Engles@hexbear.net 22 points 2 months ago

When I played sports we had a saying "the referee won't see the instigating but they will see the retaliation"

Sorry that happened to you

[–] allthetimesivedied2@hexbear.net 12 points 2 months ago (1 children)

I like how this thread has progressed. I did a good thing by making this post.

[–] allthetimesivedied2@hexbear.net 10 points 2 months ago

I'm legit happy to know I'm not just crazy.

[–] mendiCAN@hexbear.net 8 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

i dunno where you're talking about specifically or what the rules are in those spaces but i hope that chump got banned. dunno any space that works as hard as hexbear to trim libs stumblin n' ruckus'n, and even our mutual has jackasses brayin

[–] allthetimesivedied2@hexbear.net 11 points 2 months ago

Yeah. I appreciate how anti-homeless, anti-drug user, shitty comments are always removed from my posts by the time I see the relevant notification lol.

These motherfuckers would ban me the moment one of these anonymous chudsters "calls me out."

[–] infuziSporg@hexbear.net 3 points 2 months ago

This sounds kinda like a clash of communication styles that my friends and I had to deal with all the time when we ran an anarchist space. One type of people that walks in feels comfortable in a "curated" environment, another kind is used to a "raw" environment. These aren't perfect descriptors, and there were many other polarizations, but it always became impossible to harmoniously fit these two groups under the same roof.

What had the other person been saying about you?