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submitted 8 months ago by VILenin@hexbear.net to c/askchapo@hexbear.net
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[-] UmbraVivi@hexbear.net 132 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

As a German: Because we have a lot of Holocaust memorials and are taught a lot about it in school, we love jerking each other off about how much we've learned from our past as opposed to say, Japan, who deny the atrocities they've committed to this day.

But of course, all the changes and improvements are completely superficial and meaningless. We are a neoliberal hellhole and maybe the most pathetically loyal US client state in all of Europe, which is saying a lot. Our political parties will performatively decline engaging with the fascist AfD, but still implement all their same policies because we are a capitalist nation in decline.

Germans think because their newscasters speak in a monotonous, boring voice, that what they're being presented is completely unbiased and nothing but the truth. They really do believe themselves to be the adults in the room. Trump derangement syndrome is also huge in Germany, our equivalents of Bill Maher or whatever still make fun of him, the president of a foreign country who hasn't been in office for over 3 years, while self-fellating over how much better our democracy is because instead of 2 identical parties, we have 5.

Germans think they're the most reasonable, objective and intellectual people in the West while blindly following whatever the current US propaganda campaign says, so completely deluded, ignorant and pathetically loyal that we will happily shoot ourselves in the leg to serve American interests.

I fucking hate this country. I hate its self-aggrandizing, pseudo-repentant, pathetic ass-kissing of Israel. I hate how everyone in this country is a staunch defender of the status quo, how everyone loves to dunk on America with a less-than-surface level understanding of why America is the way it is and complete ignorance about how we're on the exact same track but maybe 3 years behind. Even our "left" loves Israel because there is not a single person in this country who understands literally anything, it's all fucking vibes. Israel could literally come out tomorrow like "We have decided to rebrand the war against Hamas as "Holocaust 2"" and we would lick their assholes for it.

Germans are probably the dumbest, most ignorant and at the same time most self-important people on this godforsaken planet. The dumbest American is 10x more curious about the world than the smartest German. If the US told us to, we would happily exterminate the Jews again, our news would tell us that the Jews started it and that would be enough for the average German to feel proud and righteous about it.

[-] Alaskaball@hexbear.net 57 points 8 months ago

Americans in the room after reading this be like huh

[-] UmbraVivi@hexbear.net 96 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

Be grateful that you can't read German twitter

The amount of Israel worship among self-described communists would activate the school shooter gene in US leftists

Edit: I've said before that the reason why the entire world can dunk on the US and the UK is because everyone understands what you're saying at all times. Nobody outside of Sweden can dunk on unhinged ramblings of random Swedes in TV interviews, because their interviews are in Swedish.

[-] Gay_Tomato@hexbear.net 67 points 8 months ago

Be grateful that you can't read German twitter

The amount of Israel worship among self-described communists would activate the school shooter gene in US leftists

Holy shit. susie-laugh

[-] Ho_Chi_Chungus@hexbear.net 44 points 8 months ago

The amount of Israel worship among self-described communists would activate the school shooter gene in US leftists

and they say Germans aren't funny michael-laugh

[-] Alaskaball@hexbear.net 41 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

And this is why I love to constantly throw shit at Europeans. Even if I don't understand you, I have enough intimate intuition to know you're an entire continent of filthy swine rolling in the mud just like us.

Edit: also screw the sweds. All my Danish and Norwegian ancestors on a part of my family tree hate the sweds.

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[-] EffortPostMcGee@hexbear.net 36 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

As someone who grew up entirely in the US, had hardly zero contact with my German family members, and who fluently speaks, reads and writes German, I have to say your description of German people (on social media) agrees with a similar thing that I think every time I go read what is happening on "German" social media, namely, that some Germans have a very peculiar way of being smug and wrong, such that it is literally indescribable.

That's why when people I know in the US tell me that they'd like to live in Germany because of how much more "radical" German politics are, it so directly contrasts with my own experience that my brain disassociates for the next 20 minutes to protect my Ego from having heard something so absurd.

[-] ZapataCadabra@hexbear.net 44 points 8 months ago

I honestly can't fathom a nation being dumber than America. Maybe that's my American exceptionalism talking but we really are dumb.

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[-] Aryuproudomenowdaddy@hexbear.net 38 points 8 months ago

Trump derangement syndrome is also huge in Germany,

I had an Australian tell me recently that their liberal party being frothing fascists is because Trump set a precedent for them or something? It's not like they only legalized gay marriages less than a decade ago.

[-] UmbraVivi@hexbear.net 69 points 8 months ago

"Erdogan is basically the Turkish Trump"

"Milei is basically the Argentinian Trump"

"Wilders is basically the Dutch Trump"

"Orban is basically the Hungarian Trump"

Wow, could there be material reasons for why all these right-wing figures are popping up with similar rhetorics?

NO, IT MUST BE BECAUSE OF THE ORANGE MAN'S BAD VIBES jokerfied

[-] Aryuproudomenowdaddy@hexbear.net 28 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

Yeah it was posed as a question on why the liberal party acted the way they did and I was told I was wrong when I said that they resorted to culture war bullshit because neither party had the ability to materially improve people's lives as they'd been captured by corporate interests. No it must be Orange Man that made the world crazy. The liberal party definitely wouldn't have had China derangement and spent billions of dollars on nuclear submarines to protect themselves from their primary trading partner if Hillary had won.

[-] Frogmanfromlake@hexbear.net 25 points 8 months ago

The most irritating part is knowing that Erdogan and Orban have been in power long before Trump was.

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[-] WalterBongjammin@hexbear.net 31 points 8 months ago

This is too accurate. It's wild that despite the massively strong competition, Germans might genuinely be the worst Europeans

[-] zed_proclaimer@hexbear.net 23 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

I think the perfidious albion inches just ahead personally, but it's a close one

[-] RyanGosling@hexbear.net 26 points 8 months ago

The Canada of Europe

[-] ntzm@lemmy.ml 20 points 8 months ago

I could literally say the same thing about the UK except we know we're not very clever

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[-] emizeko@hexbear.net 59 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

not sure if it directly answers your question but have to pass on this from @the_kid@hexbear.net in the news mega

Bad Memory: Germany is acclaimed for its efforts to atone for the Holocaust. But its method of repudiating the past has become a tool of exclusion.

excerpt

Sometime in the 2000s, a group of mostly Turkish women from an immigrant group called Neighborhood Mothers began meeting in the Neukölln district of Berlin to learn about the Holocaust. Their history lessons were part of a program facilitated by members of the Action Reconciliation Service for Peace, a Christian organization dedicated to German atonement for the Shoah. The Neighborhood Mothers were terrified by what they learned in these sessions. “How could a society turn so fanatical?” a group member named Nazmiye later recalled thinking. “We began to ask ourselves if they could do such a thing to us as well . . . whether we would find ourselves in the same position as the Jews.” But when they expressed this fear on a church visit organized by the program, their German hosts became apoplectic. “They told us to go back to our countries if this is how we think,” Nazmiye said. The session was abruptly ended and the women were asked to leave.

There are a number of anecdotes like this in anthropologist Esra Özyürek’s Subcontractors of Guilt, a recently published study of the array of German Holocaust education programs dedicated to integrating Arab and Muslim immigrant communities into the country’s ethos of responsibility and atonement for Nazi crimes. As Özyürek shows, those who pass through these programs often draw connections their guides do not intend—to nativist violence in contemporary Germany, or to the bloody circumstances they fled in Syria, Turkey, and Palestine. For many Germans, the anxieties these historical encounters stoke for migrants are, in Özyürek’s words, the “wrong emotions.” One German guide who leads concentration camp tours recalled being “irritated” by members of immigrant tour groups voicing the fear that “they will be sent there next.” “There was a sense that they didn’t belong here, and that they should not be engaging with the German past,” the guide said. To be really German, they were supposed to play the part of repentant perpetrators, not potential victims.

This expectation has become the basis for what scholars Michael Rothberg and Yasemin Yildiz have called the “migrant double bind.” In this paradigm, the core of contemporary “Germanness” is found in a certain sensitivity to antisemitism, conferred through a direct, likely familial relationship to the Third Reich. Migrants and racialized minorities are expected to assume the per­petrators’ legacy; when they fail, this is taken as a sign that they do not really belong in Germany. In other words, in a paradox typical of the upside-down dynamics surrounding Jews, Arabs, and Germans in contemporary Germany, a questionably conceived anti-antisemitism has become the mechanism for keeping Germanness Aryan.

really great article if you want to understand the German brain-type

[-] rottingleaf@lemmy.zip 32 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

It's really funny to see Turks having a problem with putting themselves into the "repentant perpetrator" and not "potential victim" role, though.

Typical German behavior on the Holocaust is problematic in the sense that they put their own shame above the reality and possibility of other real genocides, some happening now. So if their repentance means endorsing a genocide committed by someone else - it's fine, their repentance is more important for them.

So moral play is made more important than moral action, or even than refraining from immoral action.

EDIT: Ah, and if you are in conflict with this worldview of theirs and you are Jewish, - no, they are not going to shut up.

[-] the_kid@hexbear.net 23 points 8 months ago

It's really funny to see Turks having a problem with putting themselves into the "repentant perpetrator" and not "potential victim" role, though.

as someone whose ethnic group was nearly exterminated by the Turks, yeah lol...

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[-] CascadeOfLight@hexbear.net 56 points 8 months ago

It is absolutely the most galling shit and every imperial core lib does it.

"Yes we did some horrible things in the past, but we've learned not to which makes us wiser than everyone else"

[-] zed_proclaimer@hexbear.net 42 points 8 months ago

We freed the slaves all on our own accord, which if you think about it makes us the most moral people to ever exist!

[-] CascadeOfLight@hexbear.net 28 points 8 months ago

And then we realized colonization is bad, so we agreed with the locals to leave and helped sort things out and set up their governments for them (they needed the help after all, the precious darlings) and then we packed up and left blob-no-thoughts

[-] zed_proclaimer@hexbear.net 31 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

Unfortunately, they were too primitive and stupid to run the country on their own so it became an impoverished shithole without our wise guidance. That's why we have to have the IMF come in and rescue them and hold their hands on what to do. Because non-white people are simply too stupid to have rich advanced nations. Colonization didn't have anything to do with this, in fact we gave them a headstart and they squandered it!

By the way, racism is evil and an eternal force of the universe that can never be defeated only temporarily repressed. It has nothing to do with colonialism either and has no basis in material history.

[-] Teekeeus@hexbear.net 53 points 8 months ago

the real germany died 33 years ago GDR

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[-] Maoo@hexbear.net 44 points 8 months ago

Germans project and believe an image of themselves as being a self-critical society that acknowledges the evil of their Nazi past and has now moved past it.

At the same time, they barely even understand who the Nazis were and how they came to power and who beat them into submission so they think it's just being racist and having swastikas.

As such, they're still pretty fash even though they don't know it and feel they have special brownie points to lecture everyone else about what counts as racist or Nazi even though they're idiots.

[-] usernamesaredifficul@hexbear.net 31 points 8 months ago

guy who started a grease fire in the kitchen by accident going on to give seminars in fire safety without ever having learned what causes grease fires

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[-] plinky@hexbear.net 42 points 8 months ago

Cause they've learned thats the only bad thing they did

[-] tree@lemmy.zip 37 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

It's so pervasive there are people who describe themselves as anarchists and zionists as if those things are possibly compatible. And there are a lot of them especially online.

https://novaramedia.com/2023/12/11/whats-up-with-germanys-pro-israel-left/

[-] anarchoilluminati@hexbear.net 34 points 8 months ago

No State but the Jewish ethnostate!

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[-] PM_ME_YOUR_FOUCAULTS@hexbear.net 33 points 8 months ago

I think we can all agree that the world would be better off if the German speaking peoples were still scattered across a thousand tiny states called like the Grand Archbishopric of Pissdrinken

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[-] SteamedHamberder@hexbear.net 31 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

Here's a whole podcast with some good resource/analysis in the links.

Edit: Also a lot of Norman Finkelstein's "The Holocaust industry" goes into the issue with German reparations, the maleable definition of "holocaust survivor," and how "Establishment" organizations largely funnelled the funds to pro-Israel organizations.

[-] Timberknave@hexbear.net 31 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

I was once in Jordan with a bunch of them - they accused everything of antisemitism. After seeing a pic of an Israeli soldier in nazi garb eating children (EDIT: Yeah, that one was antisemitic, they saw it everywhere though, with a generalized contempt for these arabs not having the noble german guilt to bear), they commented on how antisemitic that was and the swastika being drawn the wrong way around and I bursted out "Glad we are here to show them how it's done" and I still think that is the best summary of german thought I can give

[-] oregoncom@hexbear.net 21 points 8 months ago

Eating children is a classic blood libel trope tho.

[-] Timberknave@hexbear.net 19 points 8 months ago

That one was true tbh, didn't mean to defend the jordanians here, I meant to say they didn't just see it there

[-] RyanGosling@hexbear.net 31 points 8 months ago

Because in the typical euroid fashion, they still believe they have superior opinions.

[-] Evilsandwichman@hexbear.net 22 points 8 months ago

Because in the typical euroid fashion, they still believe they have superior opinions.

An elegant way of conveying a thought I've had for a while, that being that when eugenics and the open discussion of killing the poor and the mentally disabled was publicly talked about, and how acceptable colonialism was, they thought themselves superior to the non-Western world; when they realized it was insane and evil and stopped, they still believed themselves superior. There doesn't seem to be a point where they see the rest of the world as equals.

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[-] Tankiedesantski@hexbear.net 31 points 8 months ago

I'm suddenly very tempted to ask German libs if they condemn the Warsaw Rising.

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[-] Cunigulus@hexbear.net 30 points 8 months ago

German libs seem to be the only ones in the West truly enjoying supporting Israel's genocide. They're totally convinced that supporting Israeli murder of Palestinians makes them clever/moral good boys who are just better than everyone else. Everyone else is sheepish about it or just doesn't want to talk about it, but the Germans watch their media blatantly propagandizing them to support this crime against humanity and eat it up like Uncle Sam dripped some lard over their kibble this morning. It really encapsulates everything that is sick and wrong in the German political consciousness. They've really got a lot going for them as a society, as loathe as many of us here are to admit it, but it makes them so damned arrogant and blind to their ideological domination.

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[-] ComradeChairmanKGB@lemmygrad.ml 29 points 8 months ago

Cause that's how cracker chauvinism works. When you do a lot of heinous shit, you arent guilty. You've simply become an expert.

[-] captcha@hexbear.net 28 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

Because its literally illegal to support Palestine in Germany. It got written in law decades ago so now every political party must support Israel. Who is going to articulate to them the reality? Online foreigners? Thats just people who never had to face their antisemitism.

[-] AssortedBiscuits@hexbear.net 25 points 8 months ago

The only time you should ever hear a German's opinion on genocide is if you want to know how to conduct one.

[-] Evilsandwichman@hexbear.net 23 points 8 months ago

I hate that now that the Russian SMO is underway, you have Germans saying genocidal rhetoric, for example that Russians have a different view towards death and don't value life (like WEEEEEEE in the West do), and that they're not really Europeans.

I wonder why being or not being European is even worth bringing up in the first place, surely it's not a racism thing, riiiiiiight?

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[-] SkingradGuard@hexbear.net 23 points 8 months ago

KKKrackers think they have authority on every subject

[-] dat_math@hexbear.net 21 points 8 months ago

Do they? If they're not German Jews, that's fucked up

[-] casskaydee@hexbear.net 26 points 8 months ago

The girl from the famous Finkelstein "crocodile tears" Q&A clip did it

[-] Raebxeh@hexbear.net 21 points 8 months ago

God what a great moment. So thankful he could retain a calm enough head to pull that off with the tact he did.

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[-] flan@hexbear.net 19 points 8 months ago

Trying to make themselves feel better probably

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this post was submitted on 13 Dec 2023
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