askchapo

I have a unique insight on this. My uncle is a deranged Trump guy and posted one of those memes you're talking about, where it was like, "This is what happens when you don't beat your kids!"

I reached out to him, and I asked if he beat his kids (my cousins), and he became furious at me for suggesting he abuses his kids. He even got my aunt to yell at me for suggesting the same.

So, basically, they think other people's kids should be beaten.

There was a clip of the praguer U guy talking about a kindergarten poster with the words “the world is a better place because you are in it” and he was shitting on it and then it took a turn and he goes “my dad never said a thing like that to me [and I turned out fine]” and I just felt so terrible for him, daddy issues will turn you into a piece of shit.

In the US at least it starts off with the fact that something like half of all births are totally unplanned for. Then through some combination of hubris and stupidity most Americans don't actually make any substantial effort to learn how to be a parent. Then between the cost of it all and the general social malaise lead to the parents lashing out at the weakest and most vulnerable people in their vicinity - their children.

Of course our society facilitates this bad parenting. Family planning is extremely inaccessible and sometimes even looked down upon. The same goes for therapy or counseling. Children cost a lot and there's very little universal support. Still though it's kinda shocking to me that people don't take it upon themselves to make an effort to learn and plan. Anecdotally it seems that millennials and Gen z are more inclined to that though which is good.

its probably because they see their kids as property

Because we still live under patriarchy

religion and a lingering view of children being property

Child abuse is normalized, if it stops being normalized then they have to reckon with what it means to be a 1) victim, 2) victimized by the very people that should love them unconditionally, 3) live in a society where this is totally okay.

A society that eats it's children. Capitalist society sees greed and exploitation of lower classes as natural, and child raising flies in the face of this notion as it requires empathy and investment from society. Capitalists see this as a burden. In their eyes these are people of lower status that cannot look after themselves, and people of lower status who cannot look after themselves must be nipped and bitten until they pick up the slack or die.

It is a deeply flawed and sick way to run a society.

People view children as property who the parents should have total and complete control over. I don't know why children are dehumanized in this way (probably patriarchy etc) but it's pretty clear that's where a lot of this stems from.

My siblings and I grew up experiencing frequent physical abuse over minor things. Now, as adults, the aftermath is painfully clear. One of my sisters ran away when she was still young. I’ve cut off all contact with our mother — she’s never met her grandchildren. One of my brothers struggles with drug addiction, another is chronically in debt due to a gambling addiction. The only two siblings still in touch with our mother are my brother who has a cognitive disability — caused by a grenade shard injury when he was a baby — and the brother who sexually abused my sister, and was then protected by our mother. This system is built on child abuse and neglect.

Wales banned spanking (classified it as child abuse) years ago and the English media has spent that time calling it "controversial" or "nanny state". just stop hitting your fucking kids

My guess would be boomers who are very vocal online and have nostalgia for being hit by their parents mad they couldn't do the same to their kids without fear of cps coming knocking.

Our minds shutdown when tackling incest and child abuse. Same reason why it's impossible to have a conversation about Epstein and it's insane implications.

I became aware of Dorothee Dussy, a french sociologist who wrote a book called "the cradle of dominations: an anthropology of incest", this past semester and it was quite harsh but eye opening. I suggest looking into it.

Trauma is self perpetuating 😔

I think in the context of history treating children as human beings is a very recent thing, like past 20 years kinda recent. In england child labour wasn't abolished until 1933 you don't have to go back that many grandparents before you had people who sent their children to work at the youngest possible age. Things like banning hitting children wasn't implemented until 2020 ffs, schools were allowed to hit children when my parents were there. Also the idea that children are property to be utilised and if they don't should be beaten or discarded. On the upside younger parents tend to see their children as individuals with autonomy and the culture around parenting is changing.

Ofc what I'm saying only applies to crackerland I'm not sure what its like in other places in the world.

Idk, yo.

All I know is that my mom used to beat my brother and I for "discipline", and now I never speak to her and my brother has severe mental health issues. I just have moderate mental health issues.

Establishing that physical abuse and corporal punishment are normal early in life sets an expectation that high control institutions can exploit later in life. (Culture, political parties, religion, employers, etc.)

Ultimately a key cog in the same machine of uniformity that foists strict gender roles, heteronormativity, neurotypical-first culture and so on upon us.

If everyone is passively conditioned to behave in a tightly controlled way under threat of force by their ostensible guardians in youth, it’s not gonna seem unusual when various power players play off that same dynamic later in life.

Notably, this creates cycles of abuse as abused children go on to abuse their children - a self-reinforcing dynamic. Quite convenient for the aforementioned high control institutions.

The Taipei government made child abuse illegal* like five months ago. the beacon of freedom in east asia folks

*actually only when the child abuse is too harmful, "mild" child abuse is still OK i guess

They fuck you up, your mum and dad.
They may not mean to, but they do.
They fill you with the faults they had
And add some extra, just for you.

But they were fucked up in their turn
By fools in old-style hats and coats,
Who half the time were soppy-stern
And half at one another’s throats.

Man hands on misery to man.
It deepens like a coastal shelf.
Get out as early as you can,
And don’t have any kids yourself.

Childism is a pretty sad fact of life. There are some excellent books on the topic, Childism is more academic but thorough and Because I Said So is more of a parenting book.

Was talking with my chef who's ten years older and had some pretty hard ass parents growing up while watching kids run around the restaurant and how as kids it was something neither of us had even considered. He went to the perceived and understood threat from his parents. For me it was cause I didn't see anyone else running around and the vibe was clearly not that, there are people carrying trays of drinks and hot food around, I can't recall ever even the passing thought. Also my parents figured out pretty early that a pen and a few sheets of paper would keep me happy in boring situations and that's a big part of how I got gud at art. They got that a toddler is a pretty impatient person and gave me a distraction that I'd spend hours at home doing anyway. Even other people my age growing seemed to either have overbearing or not giving a shit parents. Mine just treated me like a person, dude I work with now is still mind blown that my parents are not only gamers, when I visit we often play video games together and we did when I was growing up too and pretty often, at least 3 times a week we'd boot up the GameCube together and play some Mario Kart or melee and sometimes other shit. Back on n64 my dad and I became a really good doubles team in Mario tennis when he got shoulder surgery and had the summer off with me. They have their own switch and have 100% completed Mario Wonder. And they kinda just went along with my going full stenchcore mode for my late teens until almost recently, they just kinda seem to understand that I will do what I want anyway so best to just be supportive. Hell, they even understand that things are waaaaaay more fucked for me than it was for them at their age and are willing to help out because of it. Rent has skyrocketed at Mach speeds, grocery prices had tripled over the last 8 years or so let alone when they were my age and wages are stagnant and good jobs aren't there. They get it and they get how lucky they got. I find it offputting when parents talk down to their kids let alone anything that would be considered abuse legally.

Spare the pee, spoil the poo poo

It unfortunately was (and is) normal for many... People don't want to think about that, so they continue the cycle of abuse.

Newtonian ethics. The larger a thing is the more moral weight we give it.

Consider. If I killed an ant you wouldn't care right? However if I killed an elephant you would be upset no? Hoever both cases are clearly murder. Just because an elephant has more weight it has more moral weight. Consider a less extreme case. A rat vs a horse. Rats are probably smarter than horses so have a greater subjective personhood but you would kill a rat and you probably wouldn't kill a horse right?

It is a vauge understating in our dna from back when we were fish