A community for discussing events around the World
Rule 1: posts have the following requirements:
Rule 2: Do not copy the entire article into your post. The key points in 1-2 paragraphs is allowed (even encouraged!), but large segments of articles posted in the body will result in the post being removed. If you have to stop and think "Is this fair use?", it probably isn't. Archive links, especially the ones created on link submission, are absolutely allowed but those that avoid paywalls are not.
Rule 3: Opinions articles, or Articles based on misinformation/propaganda may be removed.
Rule 4: Posts or comments that are homophobic, transphobic, racist, sexist, anti-religious, or ableist will be removed. “Ironic” prejudice is just prejudiced.
Posts and comments must abide by the lemmy.world terms of service UPDATED AS OF OCTOBER 19 2025
Rule 5: Keep it civil. It's OK to say the subject of an article is behaving like a (pejorative, pejorative). It's NOT OK to say another USER is (pejorative). Strong language is fine, just not directed at other members. Engage in good-faith and with respect! This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban.
Similarly, if you see posts along these lines, do not engage. Report them, block them, and live a happier life than they do. We see too many slapfights that boil down to "Mom! He's bugging me!" and "I'm not touching you!" Going forward, slapfights will result in removed comments and temp bans to cool off.
Rule 6: Memes, spam, other low effort posting, reposts, misinformation, advocating violence, off-topic, trolling, offensive, regarding the moderators or meta in content may be removed at any time.
Rule 7: We didn't USED to need a rule about how many posts one could make in a day, then someone posted NINETEEN articles in a single day. Not comments, FULL ARTICLES. If you're posting more than say, 10 or so, consider going outside and touching grass. We reserve the right to limit over-posting so a single user does not dominate the front page.
We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.
All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.
News !news@lemmy.world
Politics !politics@lemmy.world
World Politics !globalpolitics@lemmy.world
For Firefox users, there is media bias / propaganda / fact check plugin.
https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/media-bias-fact-check/
The world's car makers struggled to compete with Japan back in the '70s, but I would argue that struggle gave people access to better vehicles.
Turned out the winning move was to make affordable cars that were fuel efficient to operate and people would rush to buy them.
Japan even failed to learn from Japan judging by everything I see here. Not necessarily as badly as the US mfgs did, but still. Especially for those chasing hydrogen right now and Nissan going through its thing (and I drive a Nissan kei car).
Maybe they should try practical and repairaible cars for a change?
Alternate headline: "The World's Carmakers Have Become Too Fat And Bloated To Compete With China".
This is my take too.
It's not that America and Europe can't compete. It's that they've got their fat asses propped up on piles of misbegotten cash and are too fucking lazy and greedy to make a good product.
Then don't. Make cities walkable and invest in public transport.
China is also doing that, believe it or not.
In my experience, the best we can do is change the bus schedules so you have to walk further to a bus stop and wait longer for a bus that never arrives at the scheduled time...
This would be ideal.
They go for next quarter profits instead of value for consumers . Stopped building affordable cars favoring trucks. Shipped car industry to China. The end
Even if you ignore the US obsession with trucks, western manufacturers labour costs are much higher and there aren't subsidies on manufacturing EVs, only buying them. Chinese EVs get manufacturing subsidies and then in many countries they also get a local subsidy at the point of purchase. It's an underhanded tactic, the Chinese government is essentially paying people outside of China to buy Chinese EVs so western competiton would die.
It’s an underhanded tactic
It’s a normal tactic
US car makers get tax incentives and bailouts, effectively subsidized by the government as well.
The US government doesn't pay Ford to make me, an Estonian, a car so I wouldn't want to buy a Volkswagen.
That's what china does.
they have all the manufacturing there, I'm sure all the parts are dirt cheap for them if you don't ship em cross ocean.
I'm not sure about china paying for you to buy them, many countries counter that with tariffs. I think those prices are close to natural prices given the enormous scale of china and nearby markets.
Yes, the tariffs counter the artificially low price. At least on the more expensive models, as tariffs aren't a flat fee per car like the subsidies. You're then still left with a workforce that's paid about a third if not a quarter of what they'd be paid in some European countries that manufacture cars.
If we really wanted European EVs to be competitive with Chinese, unions need to be abolished and wages lowered. Unfortunately, we ALSO want people to have good living conditions, so that's sort of a no-go.
ChatGPT says 10-15% of the cost of a typical car is labor
a workforce that’s paid about a third
So that would give Chinese manufactured vehicles a 6-10% price advantage
We wish
Are you implying Chinese people do not have good living conditions?
I have been in China only a few months working on the assembly line. Work was long and tough, but the pay was good and they'd give you free housing and food. Plenty other workplaces were available if you wanted to work less hours.
How many hours is that about? They don't have 40 hr limit? How about work safety and health insurance? Free healthcare right?
That was 14 hours a day 6 days a week. It was non specialized jobs mostly filled by people getting their first job moving from the farms to the cities. Many people changed job within the first year. 40 hours work weeks were available. Regarding work safety, factories I visited were quite good, modern equipment and practices. I have seen machinery being used quite commonly which would elsewhere be considered highly specialized. Not sure about free healthcare, I did not get to need the hospital.
I'm not saying it's the best country in the world, but in general the people I met were happy and enjoyed a good life without many problems.
Went for trucks for greater profit margin and lower regulations but lost the volume game. For capitalists, they sure suck at it.
They don't even need cars to do it. The BBSHD kit from Bafang I'm gonna throw on the bike I'm building will save me thousands of miles on my existing car.
China is keeping me from buying a new car by helping not need to use one.
I wonder if the fact that most American and European carmakers are stubbornly clinging to the 1800s technology known as the internal combustion engine while Chinese ones are actively embracing the modern technology that car buyers actually want has anything to do with it 🤔
What? Rubbish. Total incomprehensible rubbish.
Right, time to get the coal burning in my steam tractor!!
It probably has more to do with the cost of labour in China.
And also the fact that they control all the resources (like rare earth minerals) needed to make EV batteries while every other manufacturer is forced to buy them at a markup from China. They even have their own slave labor force to work the mines so that they can keep prices low for themselves.
That's another part of it, sure, but DEFINITELY not the whole or even main reason.
Many brands are assembling their cars in China. https://www.thecarexpert.co.uk/which-new-cars-are-built-in-china/
I mean, from what I can see half of them aren't even trying.
Who could have ever foreseen this result when we outsourced all of our manufacturing and skilled labour to China???
It's almost like chasing thoughtless, short-term profit gains is a horrible idea.
Our design engineering is lacking too. I read not long ago how the president of Ford said how they tore down a Chinese EV and said “we got it all wrong.” I’m in the automotive manufacturing industry and we source some parts from China. The factories I work with are all IATF/ISO certified and they can make parts for 10x less AND not require a minimum production that would last me 5 years. And the comment about working around the tariff is absolutely true. One of our Chinese suppliers started building a plant in Thailand not long after the election. State of the art. less tariff. Quality parts. My first order is shipping this week.
is there a tina from china community on here..
Short term profit and doing compliance cars and half assed attempts with certain irrelevance in a decade or so, or choosing to forgo profit and really go for converting to EV.
Every board room figuring a golden parachute in 10 years sounds really good.
China funds all these companies and their projects, that's why China is pushing forward.
So like you think us and Europe not prepping their manufacturing by combination of loans and tax breaks?