this post was submitted on 25 May 2025
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I am noticing a rise in Holocaust denial with the rising anti-Zionism coming out of the Israel-Palestine conflict. Many of these YouTubers, tiktokers, and podcasters point to the writings of David Irving as proof. I know he is a holocaust denier and an idiot, but I would like to read it so I could point out the exact flaws in Irving’s “evidence” and stop getting the comment “You haven’t even read it!”. I also don’t want to send a penny to this author, but also don’t want to break the law in getting access to it.

How would you go about this situation?

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[–] Jimmycakes@lemmy.world 4 points 14 hours ago

Just get the torrent

My man, try Z-Library. Check the subreddit for the latest working URL's that won't get you doxxed.

[–] Dagwood222@lemm.ee 11 points 1 day ago
[–] Shotgun_Alice@lemmy.world 6 points 23 hours ago

Piracy, maybe see if Internet archive has any of his writings. I would just try to find a source where I didn’t have to pay for it.

[–] iAvicenna@lemmy.world 6 points 1 day ago* (last edited 17 hours ago) (1 children)

Ask a certain person called Anna, she might have it in her**'s archive**.

[–] Kairus@lemmy.world 1 points 15 hours ago

Totally thought this was code for Heran's Archivena

[–] Dearth@lemmy.world 11 points 1 day ago

Buy it from a used book store. He won't get any money from it and you'll support a local small business

[–] jeffw@lemmy.world 61 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Download a book? Illegally? Online? Through a popular torrent website?

I would never do such an illegal and terrible thing!!

[–] SatansMaggotyCumFart@lemmy.world 36 points 1 day ago (3 children)

That method is horrible because the author wouldn’t make any money off of it.

[–] Ugurcan@lemmy.world 2 points 14 hours ago

I heard there’s this Anna, keeping an archive of those horrible books.

[–] cecilkorik@lemmy.ca 11 points 1 day ago

Yeah that would be bad. I think we can agree that if there's one thing that's even more important than the ideology of an author, it's definitely capitalism, which is conveniently not an ideology at all, just one of the fundamental laws of the universe. That's why it's important to not pirate things for ideological reasons.

[–] hexagonwin 55 points 1 day ago (5 children)

go to a library and borrow it?

[–] Mariemarion@lemm.ee 3 points 23 hours ago

Dunno how it works where you are, but I (author) get money from library books. Much less than when a reader buys it (duh), but it pays for nice Christmas presents.

[–] AbouBenAdhem@lemmy.world 12 points 1 day ago (4 children)

Do most public libraries have holocaust denial works?

[–] Akasazh@feddit.nl 1 points 1 day ago

Academic libraries do

[–] Apepollo11@lemmy.world 9 points 1 day ago (1 children)

In the UK, certainly. It's not the library's job to censor what the borrowers want to read, even if it's David Icke.

In Australia too. I was in Gatton, Queensland, at their Library, and they had signs up warning people to basically go pound sand, the library is not a censorship authority, and that they will not remove books based on "religious morals", in the LGBT pride section, and a similar sign, lacking the morals bit in some of their conspiracy theory books. And Gold Coast Libraries stocks some of the weirdest conspiracy theory mags in the planet.

[–] hexagonwin 10 points 1 day ago

highly doubt it, but i've seen some similar cases..

i would just pirate tbh

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[–] throwawayacc0430@sh.itjust.works 13 points 1 day ago (1 children)
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[–] Apepollo11@lemmy.world 28 points 1 day ago

You could just buy the book second-hand. Authors don't get any of that money, and you'll be able to get it for much cheaper than new.

[–] doctorschlotkin@lemm.ee 1 points 21 hours ago

Google the book title + “.epub”

[–] andrewrgross@slrpnk.net 10 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

I think people overthink spending money on things they don't support. I think stealing it is justified, but If you're doing academic studies or learning how to deprogram people, go ahead and buy a Nazi's book if you have to.

That said, if you're looking to argue with Holocaust deniers, trying to defeat them by studying their arguments is a classic blunder.

Conspiratorial thinking is rooted in social maladies, and attachment to a theory is a downstream effect. You can no more talk a Holocaust denier out of their belief with evidence than you can fix a broken water main by sand-bagging the street. If you're trying to deprogram someone, you've got to learn how to get them to open up about the background experiences that led them to look for these answers and then usually find ways to help them find alternate communities that obviate their need for the conspiracy in a way that at least feels self-directed.

It's a much slower process, but if that's what you want to do, read up on that and don't bother wasting money on Irving's book.

[–] LovableSidekick@lemmy.world 5 points 1 day ago

The ethics of social media dictate that stealing from people you've decided are evil is somewhere between totally ethical and a moral imperative.

[–] PM_ME_VINTAGE_30S 22 points 1 day ago

Just break the law lol. The law is made up horseshit 😆

[–] wpb@lemmy.world 4 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

People who deny genocides (either the current ongoing one in Palestine as committed by Israel, or the one carried out by the Germans in WWII) are the lowest of the low. Absolute scum. To see people make excuses for atrocities as the Nakba, Sabra and Shatila, and the Holocaust in real time, as one is happening has been the most disturbing development of our age.

I don't think downloading things illegally is OK, and I also don't think spending money on genocide deniers like Irving is ethical. I also don't think reading Irving will help you in any way, because genocide deniers are pretty much all the same, and there's not a shred of credence or validity to what they have to say. If you still wish to see genocide denial and defense of people who say stuff like "Erase them, their families, mothers and children. These animals can no longer live", and the denial of that which is obvious, you'll find plenty of it available for free in modern day conservative shitrags talking about the ethnic cleansing Israel has been carrying out for 77 years.

1000% agree. Those who deny genocides such as the Holodomor, Nakba, Holocaust disgust me. It is so infuriating to read about the horrors, people being shot in their homes, trying to eat grass for food due to malnutrition, and dying of horrible preventable diseases, and then see that Alan Jones thinks "It was a false flag operation to advance the secret societies controlling the world", etc.

[–] solsangraal@lemmy.zip 14 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (3 children)

https://annas-archive.org/search?q=david+irving

edit: on the ebooks topic, i've had a pretty good experience with the kobo libra color ereader along with calibre, but it's a miserable experience trying to read graphic novels on it-- any recommendations (that are not amazon/apple/android/google) for an ereader that can do graphics well?

My recommendation for a basic piracy-friendly (to a degree) ereader is one of the old Sony's, second gen usually.

[–] scintilla@lemm.ee 2 points 14 hours ago

If you're looking for a color e-reader the unfortunate truth is that they are just not there yet. The best on available is not really that much better than the Libra color since most are using the same technology as it.

There are a few RLCD devices that are available but from my understanding they aren't very well reviewed and basically habe to be outside to be used without a backlight.

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[–] voracitude@lemmy.world 18 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (5 children)

Ugh, of course those people would point to any source that supports their current claim, without vetting the source itself. They'll even tell you that of course they don't support antisemitism, while spouting that antisemitic Irving shit all day, and that's okay because they pick and choose only what they agree with out of the rhetoric. As though they couldn't find sources that support their point without the concomitant antisemitism.

First and foremost, then, I'd go about this by not denying the genocide in Gaza and not saying stuff such as "I bet you love Palestine" like it's a pejorative, spacecadet.

My second point would be to recognise that there is no moral or ethical reason not to pirate Irving's works. If you were able to find it at a library, it would be there because someone paid a publisher for the copy and likely some kind of library license. Some of that goes to Irving. There is no way to deny him profit and acquire his work legally. So, pirate it. Fuck that guy.

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[–] ElectricAirship@lemmy.dbzer0.com 9 points 1 day ago (6 children)

Check if it's available at a library?

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[–] Geodad@lemm.ee 8 points 1 day ago

🏴‍☠️

[–] AbouBenAdhem@lemmy.world 15 points 1 day ago

Legally, you could buy a used copy if you could find one.

[–] neidu3@sh.itjust.works 6 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

People you disagree with may still produce something of value to you.

[–] capybara@lemm.ee 4 points 1 day ago

People who spread disinformation and conspiracy theories should profit as little as possible from it

[–] nokturne213@sopuli.xyz 9 points 1 day ago

I would start by asking Anna if she has the book in her archive.

You could… hahum… found it there, lying on the internet… hum

[–] GaMEChld@lemmy.world 3 points 1 day ago

You can wheels within wheels this shit for eternity. Answer this question and you'll have the answer. What do you want to do? Do that.

You can steal it, buy it, borrow it, whatever. Ultimately there is no objective right answer. If you think you'll be better equipped to counter argue the message by reading it, I say that's more honorable than arguing against it without knowing what it is.

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