Programming

i mean, you'll be able to write things in that language, which i'd say is somewhat useful 🤔

It's kinda like asking "is it worth doing long hikes before training to do 5km runs?", you probably don't need to go on hikes in order to start running, but it's less intimidating and if you then realize you're just not into running then you're still left with a useful skill.

Is this bait? Zig and Go are very much serious, especially Zig.

Generally python/Javascript is good for learning the basics. To know how types work learn c#/java/go. To learn how the memory works Zig/C are good. To learn about what a fully defined behavior means in a program you learn Rust. To learn what actually happens on the processor you learn assembly.

Honestly, if you're hyped about Zig go for it, although I'd suggest "warming up" by doing a tic tac toe in python.

Learing the bases of programming is language agnostic really. You can start even with pseudo code, then learn the language you will like to work with. Just choose any language that seems fun and enjoy the process.

Good luck!

Yes 99% of programming is the higher level thought process behind making a program, and that skill transfers between programming languages. The specific syntax doesn’t matter that much.

I question the suggestion that Zig and Go are not "serious" programming languages. They certainly weren't designed to be "easy" beginner languages.

I don't think it matters a whole lot which language you start with. Learning to program is largely separate from learning a particular language, and if you do programming for a while, you'll probably learn several. I do think someone who wants to understand programming deeply should learn each of:

• A lisp, probably Racket, but others will do. This teaches a lot about how computation works, and is at least a local maximum for abstractive power.
• C, an assembly language, or something similar where the developer must manage memory manually and has the ability to mismanage it. This teaches how computers work.
• A statically typed functional language, probably Haskell. This makes programming more math-like and probably represents a local maximum for what can be proven about a program's behavior without solving the halting problem.
• SQL. I wish there was something prettier with a modicum of popularity that does what it does (PRQL is my favorite recent attempt), but there isn't. This teaches thinking about data in sets and relations, and you will almost certainly use it in practice.

My personal 2 bits: start with JavaScript.

You can run it in your browser console and get at least a little but of benefit from it no matter how far you go, scripting on web pages you use regularly.

Thanks to Node, you can reasonably build full stack systems with it. Fair warning, it's really best for I/O, so it's not really ideal for genuinely logically complex stuff.

You'll more quickly get to bigger tangible benefits connecting things that have already been built anyway.

Python as a starter otherwise, which is suitable for that genuinely logically complex stuff.

Anything is better than nothing.

Go and Zig are serious languages. Go is especially established and has a big ecosystem and capabilities. You could stick with Go forever if you don't want to expand afterwards.

Starting 'simpler' is better because it gives you successes. It keeps you going.

crazy to call zig, a low level systems language, an "easy" language

Python is one of the most-widely used languages in the world.

If Zig is easy than that means C is easy (as Zig is pretty much nicer written C) and if C is easy than, oh wait everything is written in C. I guess the only thing left to do is learn an unnecessary overcomplicated abstraction of C like java or C++.

As for the question, pick a task than pick a language, servers? Go seems to be replacing Java for the next generation, Games? Zig C# Odin C C++ Lua, Rewrites? Rust. Random small scripts? Python. Bare metal? C C++ Zig.

Also Zig Odin and Go are all C like languages if you learn one you learn about them all (with the exception of manual memory management for Go). My biased self recommend Zig as I think its the nicest, you almost certainly won't get a job in it but the skills will transfer directly to C or Go where you can get jobs.

no. You must start with malboge

I don’t know about zig, but go is absolutely serious.

I found it easier to start with something considered medium difficulty, because "easy" languages abstract away a lot of problems of programming. So when certain problems arise, its hard to understand what is happening behind the scenes.

If you want to build something, python is great. If you wanna learn programming, it might be confusing.

The trouble with “easy” languages is that they allow you to write incorrect code without much pushback.

The trouble with “serious” languages is that they push back even when you’re writing correct code.

There’s plenty to learn from either route. Just pick something that piques your interest and dive in.

It's...sort of not a question of easy vs hard. Why would anyone make a hard programming language?

It's more about picking a language that is suitable for what you want to do with it.

Zig and Go are serious. I think Python would be a language that isn't serious (despite it's widespread use in serious applications) but has a reputation for being easy. I don't know if that reputation is really deserved.

Anyway I would start with one of Python, Go or Typescript (via Deno). I would avoid Rust, Haskell, OCaml, C++ as your very first language, but they could be your second.

Whatever you do don't learn Python and stop there. That's the way to be a crap programmer. And if you do use Python learn to use type hints early on.

Zig or go are not that unserious of languages. Zig is arguably quite hard due to being pretty low-level. Maybe think about what domain you want to do programming in.. Python might be a decent starting point tho (easy language, no memory management)

Go is not serious? TIL.

There is benefit in learning any language.

Where did you get the idea that Zig is an "easy" language?

I don't think most languages you'll encounter in the wild are too "easy".

Universities here start you off with Python in the first semester because it's easy for beginners to grasp. That doesn't mean it's not "serious" though, the whole AI/ML/Big Data ecosystem is ALL Python, largely because there are excellent data processing libraries for Python and stuff like PyTorch for offloading work to the GPU.

Just don't try to use Powerpoint for programming, it's possible but you'll go mad.

A lot of basic principles remain the same from one language to another. Some have more features than other, some have slightly obtuse grammar, but as long as you stay in the same class of programming language, it can be a good learning experience. Learning from "simple" languages and building up was the way to go for a long while.

I'm not sure I'd call Zig or Go "easy" programming language though. Most languages you'll hear about these days are quite high level (even C++ and C got there over time). These days, I'm not sure where one would start from scratch. "scripting" languages are a good idea, since they are extremely easy to experiment with, and unless you start poking too much can't do any harm.

But basically, if you stay with imperative programming (most used languages are like this) 80-90% of the knowledge you'll get in one translate into another; there's no bad way to start.

I would suggest a different approach. Think about what you want to achieve with programming. Look at the languages which can be used to do this task. Choose one and try some tutorials, I recommend freecodecamp it helped me a lot.

I can't really comment on zig and go but I think they are pretty serious languages tbh.

Python is designed as an easy language. Yet it is a fundemental important language in the IT, backbone of many Linux operating systems and servers. One could even say... a serious language.

I personally wouldn't care if a language is called "easy" or not. You should also look at what it is capable at its peak and where it is used most often, if it works for you. Pick the language that you think fits you the best. I wouldn't call Zig as an easy language to get into, its still low level language.

Exactly don't start with easy languages you should start with the best programming language HolyC, the divine language.

It's not so much easy-difficult, it's high-level-low-level. Low-level languages can be easy in the sense that you don't have many entities to juggle (stacks, registers, etc.) and high-level languages can be miserable, like C++.
Of you're interested in starting with the fundamentals, go with C. If you just want to get something made, go with ~~Claude~~ Python.

C

Any language is good to start with. When you learn a language pick one that makes sense to you. The main thing you are learning is not the language it's how to change how you think about problems. From there the differences between languages are technical and any language can be conquered in time except JavaScript because fuck JavaScript.

Zig or Go are serious programming languages. Zig is actually the language I would least recommend for complete beginners because in my opinion it is one the most serious languages currently. What lead you to your examples Zig and Go and how do you determine what a 'serious' programming language is?

so one thing about programming languages is at the end of the day, they can all generally accomplish the same things. they are all turing complete and generally capable of expressing programs that any of the others can.

as others in this thread have said, many patterns you learn within one programming language will transfer to others. some personal context, i attended and then taught at a coding bootcamp for a year about a decade ago, saw over 300 students and have been doing software engineering since. it was full time and the students would learn ruby basics over 4 weeks and then would be able to do the same things in javascript in a few days. that said, those languages are pretty similar but i hope it makes the point.

so my main suggestion is to start with a general purpose, syntactically simple language. the less syntax and overhead in the language, the more you will be able to focus on the fundamentals of programming and less on jumping through the hoops of the language you're working with. stay away from typed languages for at least the first few months unless you really really only want to do low level stuff.

some languages i think you should consider: ruby, python, javascript. they are relatively similar for a beginner. python has more usage in data heavy scenarios due to it's extensive data libraries. ruby's whole mantra is being a joy to write. javascript is simple but that also means you don't get much help from it out of the box. consider it as a first/second language mainly if you are interested in websites.

It us totally OK to start easy.

Scheme (for example Guile) or Racket are great beginner languages, because they have a very minimal core, and at the same time a lot of power. Created by teachers, they also have great guides.

Clojure is also a fantastic Lisp language, extremely elegant and very powerful. Its user community has many experienced programmers, and it is very friendly.

Python is probably the most popular choice for beginners. It has a nice tutorial and countless libraries, which allows to put programs together from components. But its build and packaging system is notoriously messy (though it seems improving) and can get in the way when doing more complex stuff later. Its user forums also suffer currently most from AI slop.

I wouldn't recommend Go language for beginners. It is relatively simple, true, but although it is well-geared to its main target - web applications - it has serious pitfalls with concurrency, which can lead to arcane bugs and a lot of hair-pulling.

You could also start with Rust. The language is larger than others, that's true. But you do not need to learn it all at once. Also, it has best-in-class online tutorials, books and documentation. Its compiler error messages are extremely helpful. And its build and packaging system are so much easier to use than almost anything else. This matters for beginners, too, since this allows you to put together interesting programs quickly.

Logic is common to all programming languages. Everything else is syntax and knowing what functions or utilities you can capitalize on. No matter how complex things seem under the hood it's only one instruction at a time that is being processed. Speed and memory make it seem like multitasking. It's as simple as "If this, then that". Once you get the foundations of logic down, you're good to go. Everything else is experience and time takes care of that. Good luck and have fun. As far as confidence goes my mantra throughout life, especially when faced with complex situations is a derisive "How hard can this be?", while plodding forward.

Go is easy??

Nothing is easy when learning programming from scratch and by yourself ; just choose whatever you feel is cool (at beginner level, it does not make a big difference).

Avoid the compilation process by using interpreted language

Go is as serious as it gets. Go is also pretty simple and gives you great foundation and understanding.

Either go with Go (!) or with a lisp like racket, following the book https://htdp.org/ These are different approaches but will give you a huge headstart and better understanding of how to actually design a system instead of getting lost in code. I personally recommend the second approach to people who ask me.