Ask Lemmy

The concept of a lone ship without Federation support stuck far away from home is compelling. Throughout the series, they go through some shit.

I think DS9 was pretty developed already by the end of TNG, so once it started there wasn't that much left to figure out. This can be seen by the TNG crew visiting DS9 towards the end. TNG, however, felt a little more uncertain in the first season in that the actors didn't have their characters nailed down yet, and it shows.

I suspect that Voyager might be a bit more like TNG in this regard - the concept was a bit more uncertain when they started. However, it does improve massively as it moves on.

I for one really like the temporal war storyline. And 7of9 is a great addition even if the writers' intent was mainly that of providing boobage.

Once you get past the Kazon it gets more varied. The Kazon are just terrible and they drag the show down with them.

That being said, some of my personal favorite VOY episodes are in the first few seasons, they just don't involve the Kazon.

I can't speak for everyone of course, but as someone who genuinely was not fond of DS9 (not because of writing quality or anything like that, it was great for what it was in that regard.)

After DS9, Voyager had the audacity to try to be FUN again. It offered a really good mix of some serious episodes with some downright goofy episodes. For every "Year of Hell" or "Equinox", you would get an episode where they were attacked by giant viruses, or a good old fashioned holodeck program goes haywire episode.

It wasn't afraid to dive into Shlock after DS9 tried to be sooooo fucking serious.

To me, that was a breath of fresh air.

Also:

1. Janeway is easily the best captain overall. She doesn't give "Picard Speeches" like Stewart of course, but in every other aspect, her leadership is amazing throughout that series.

2. Voyager 2 parters were usually epic. This of course comes from the fact that the CGI had come a long way from the TNG days, but with the exception of Best of Both Worlds, I'd put Year of Hell, Equinox and Scorpion ALL better than any other two parter from any other series.

If your comparison is to DS9 and you want "super serious" than yeah...of course Voyager isn't going to be for you. But if you want something that isn't afraid to be a little silly sometimes, Voyager is hella-fun.

The first season or two are rough. The Kazon stuff is just... Blah, imo. After that it picks up. The character development, I think, is the best part. Mostly the Doctor, if I'm being honest. Later when Seven joins, her character arc is great, too, and while she was definitely supposed to be sex appeal, her actress, Jeri Ryan, crushes it as a character and not just a sex symbol.

I'm guessing the whole Neelix thing is throwing you? He's definitely incredibly grating, but he'll weirdly grow on you as the show progresses.

In my opinion, it's definitely the weakest of the three you mention, but it still has its merits. Even after we leave the Kazon stuff behind, you'll get a one off episode here or there that just falls flat.

I'd suggest trying to power through a bit longer to see if you can pick up anything you start enjoying. And if not, there's no shame in not finishing. Not every series hits for everyone and that's okay.

Part of it is that Voyager has the unenviable role of being one of TNG's two successor shows. The other was DS9, and everything looks bad sitting next to DS9. Part of why DS9 was able to do the wild things that it did was because the writing team had minimal supervision and were allowed to go buckwild- paramount were keeping a closer eye on first TNG, and then Voyager. Because of that, Voyager plays it safe and worships the status quo even when the fiction is begging to go in another direction, and the whole series has this feeling of having been written by committee. This even frustrated the writers, one of whom left the show out of frustration to go write the Battlestar Galactica reboot, which is essentially gritty, serialized Voyager

that said, I watched the whole thing and largely enjoyed it. you kind of have to meet it where it is, and accept that major plot details get glossed over and everyone takes turns holding the idiot ball. for me, the characters are what salvages the underwhelming plot. being a smaller ship, younger characters like Kim and Paris are able to be movers and shakers, giving the show a coming-of-age quality not found again until LDS and Progidy. Janeway is great when she's not holding the idiot ball, it was really awesome seeing a captain who came up through science instead of command. When the blue or gold shirts give most captains a solution to a problem, they're glad the problem it solved, but Janeway would get excited about the solution itself, sometimes even finishing Belana's sentences.

Neelix had never so much as heard of starfleet, and had none of the training or skills even a crewman would need, but his good nature and see-a-need, fill-a-need ethos arguably makes him the most starfleet person on the boat. Kes is similar, with the added twist of dedicating herself to a voyage she won't live to see the end of.

the doctor is an interesting inversion of the good idea/meh execution pattern because his concept is unremarkable- essentially a rehash of Data learning to be human, just accidentally and with sarcasm- but the execution was incredible. later on when 7of9 joins the cast, she displaces him as The Data but he remains a main character and takes on a mentorship role which allows him to develop even further

all in all, it's a show full of then-new and brilliant ideas that regularly fumbles the execution. and that isn't for everyone, especially with the plethora of other great trek out there. but if you watch it and are able to forgive the not great scenario writing you might enjoy it nonetheless

Like the other two, it takes a season or so to find it's footing. I like a female captain, former enemies working together, and ship out of water stories. The redemptive and maturity arc of Paris, and his friendship with Kim. The Doctor and 7 learning what it is to be human. Chakotay's beliefs aren't made fun of, but explored. The hopefulness that even thrown across the galaxy, humans can (most of the time) stay true to their beliefs. That you can overcome your upbringing to become a better person. There's lots to like.

The doctor is hilarious and I want B'lanna to step on me

I loved it when it was new, but I'm not sure I'd watch it now.

The idea I got from it was, it was supposed to be like a cross between The Next Generation, with a Starfleet ship exploring the unknown, and Deep Space Nine, with epic arcs as opposed to self-contained episodes. Essentially it seemed like they wanted another TNG but in the DS9 format. They also wanted to try having a female captain and I think they were going for that for a while. They gave us a Black captain and that went over well enough, so they were going with Roddenberry's vision of inclusion and diversity. Not everyone agreed at the time, that a crew would follow a woman. Now it seems like it wouldn't be a problem, but 30 years ago?

I liked the premise of being stuck in the Delta Quadrant trying to get home, until Janeway started refusing shortcuts to get the ship home during their lifetime. The episode "The Omega Directive" where she doomed a pre-warp civilisation to never being able to go to the stars made me dislike Janeway, though honestly the directive, which overrides the Prime Directive, was set up by Starfleet. She was just following orders. And the alternative would have been to allow a "competitor" to warp drive that would have made warp drive through that system impossible (due to the omega particles). The solution should have been to just teach them warp drive, but then the Prime Directive says you can't do that, so she left them in the stone age or something. IMO the worst episode. That one everyone hates with the forced evolution? That was just dumb. Omega Directive had a lot of thought put into it and it ended up being stupid and a slap in the face to anyone who supported Starfleet.

I was kinda ace-leaning in my teens, so Seven's outfit didn't do much for me. Once I heard Jeri Ryan didn't like the "cat suits" they put her in, I really started disliking how the show was being run. They did a similar thing to Mariana Sirtis (Troi) on Next Generation.

I always liked Neelix, too. I thought he was funny, and his self-appointed position as "morale officer" is where I saw myself if I were on the ship. Sure, we all wanted to be Chakotay or Tuvok or, more accurately Tom or Harry. We all (straight guys I mean) argued over who we wanted to be with, between Torres, Kes, Seven, and even Janeway herself (my pick). No one ever said they wanted to be Neelix. Nobody liked him. But Neelix was always my boy. And then when that kid showed up and he was helping her, and she was afraid of Seven and he showed her that there was nothing to be afraid of, that's when I realised Neelix was me on the ship. So yeah, Neelix is kinda why I like Voyager. And Janeway. And Tuvok, because while Data was cool, he wasn't quite Spock, and DS9 didn't really have such a character. Odo maybe? Hardly. I think the "logical character" got shuffled between Dax, Odo, Kira, Bashir, O'Brien sometimes... there basically wasn't one. I loved Tuvok though. Data's his own character, but I liked the Vulcans better. So, much as I think I'd hang out with LaForge on the Ent-D, I felt that Voyager was more "my crew." They were the misfits, and they made it work. They also felt the most like family to one another, IMO.

The show did have a lot of problems. I won't argue against them. It also had Blink of an Eye which is easily a Top 5 Trek episode (along with DS9's In the Pale Moonlight, TNG's The Inner Light, TOS's The City on the Edge of Forever, TNG's Best of Both Worlds, TNG's All Good Things, DS9's The Visitor... which ones take the top 5 spots varies, but The Inner Light and In the Pale Moonlight stay in the top 3 always.

"Computer, delete that entire personal log."

I had loved Voyager for years before I found out that a lot of fans don't like it. I don't care, I still like it a lot. I think Janeway is a terrific captain.

It was Enterprise and Discovery that I thought really, really sucked.

Voyager is a very different feeling show but still 24 century based. I think it's got better with age - but also, when compared to most of the modern shows, it is more political and follows the usual concepts of a Trek show. Not the action focused stuff it is now (sadly)

It was still a lot better than whatever else was on TV at 8 PM in 1997. That's pretty much where I'm at with it.

Once Tuvix shows up as a regular cast member the show gets much better

So far, I'm not finding it as enjoyable as the other two.

That's 'cause it's not.

It's still good enough to be worth watching, though.

I hadn't watched any Star Trek for years. Then, just yesterday, I was watching regular TV and this episode of Voyager came on. Me and my son watched it. It was the one where it turns out they're all clones and basically, in the end, they all melt just before the real crew can help them. It was such a cool story, aided, in no small part, by a scene in a Jeffrey's tube where 7 of 9 discusses monogamy with B'elanna.

It depends on how far you've gone. Most Star Trek shows of the era took a while to get up to speed.

Voyager has a cadence similar to TNG except that the various species that Voyager interacts with changes over time. After the Kazon, the new species are better designed and fleshed out.

Seven of Nine is a far better designed character than Kes and the writing for her was so much better. It also seems like the show was able to identify the characters that could carry an episode.

It definitely gets better as it goes along. It's a great concept for a ST show, and the cast is strong. And aside from resting too heavily on the holodeck, and having a few real lemon episodes (like the one where Janeway and Paris turn into amphibians), it's pretty dependable. But yeah, the first 2-3 seasons can be a chore to watch.

It got a lot of hate for the first 15-20 years, but it seems like it's getting a bit more appreciation these days. So I think it's agreed pretty well.

On a non-ST show topic, I highly recommend Stargate SG-1 if you haven't already seen it. Really fun show that also gets better in the later seasons (especially around seasons 6 and 7). Some very clever ideas, a lore-rich universe, a very solid cast, and it manages to hit hard with the drama sometimes while still not taking itself too seriously (and actually has a surprising amount of comedy).

Voyager has more and good horror episodes, so if you like those you'll like VOY. It's best enjoyed an episode a day rather than binged. Put one on after work l, that's how I watched it

My favourite thing about Voyager is Seven of Nine, but she doesn't debut until season 4

It's the most action oriented Star Trek series. Or was when it was newish, anyway. Stuff is always happening, there are very few political episodes that just consist of talking, they do a bunch of fun shit with the holodecks, and it has an exciting premise.

It is my favorite series right behind Lower Decks for these reasons. Deep Space 9 is just beside it and not above or below, because I love it equally for entirely different reasons (it does the drama, politics and even religion stuff so fucking well).

I have very, very shallow tastes in TV.

Honestly, I like Voyager better than TNG and DS9 just because the image quality is better. Early TNG is old enough to be jarring.

Totally understand this might be a cultural deficiency of mine but that's the honest truth.

Yeah, at the time Voyager came out I considered it the worst of the Star Trek live action series. It's since been surpassed many times over for that title, but there's still a lot of episodes that are not very good individually and the overall premise of the show was wasted.

That said, there are a few very good episodes, and a couple of the characters were really enjoyable. The Doctor and 7 of 9 became some of my favourite Star Trek characters across the franchise.

Unfortunately Janeway was an inconsistent psychopath and Chakotay was a block of wood. So they had to struggle against the background.

It's been too long for my memory to be able to dredge up a recommended viewing list of the best episodes to focus on, but perhaps you could scrounge one up on the web somewhere. Voyager was back in the day when series had a lot of episodes and a lot of them were relatively stand-alone so skipping over a bunch likely won't hurt if you pick them well.

The cast. That’s what I love about the show. The writing can be uneven and often downright contradictory (they ignore the whole “we have limited photon torpedoes” thing from the pilot pretty much immediately and have fun counting the number of shuttle craft they wind up destroying over the course of the series). But the cast is great, especially after a season or so when everyone has figured out their characters a bit.

The more I've been thinking about this, the more I realize that because Voyager (or most trek of that era) isn't totally serialized, there's no real reason that you HAVE to watch it sequentially for the first time.

As long as you're avoiding spoiler episodes, there's no reason that you can't just watch some random stand-alone episodes, and I'm confident that watching some of those first will make you want to go back and watch the entire thing to see "how they got there."

So with that said, if you want to understand my love for Voyager, these are the top ten episodes I would recommend that are stand-alone and don't contain spoilers and epitomize why I say that Voyager is better than most people give it credit for.

• Living Witness (S4)
• Blink of an Eye (S6)
• One Small Step (S6)
• Timeless (S5)
• Scientific Method (S4)
• The Void (S7)
• Relativity (S5)
• Counterpoint (S5)
• Shattered (S7)
• Deadlock (S2)

There are others that I would put in there, but those would include character spoilers that I'd want to avoid.

I believe if you watch those standalone stories, you'll get the gist of what people love about Voyager.

Far away from everything just needing to survive resonated with me and is a good concept. And at that time the 3d rendering wad a massive leap.

The content was a pretty mixed bad but with some good stuff. The missing reference to the directive all the time was a welcome change.

Not a fan of anything past DS9 either. Voyager by it's nature was too far removed from the familiar setting of the original/TNG and the ever simmering political tension between the Federation/Klingons/Romans.

The main characters in Voyager were also not terribly compelling. I personally found lots of side characters in TNG like Barclay and O'Brien were just way more interesting than relatively forgettable main characters in Voyager like Harry Kim, Chakotay, or Torres.

Towards the end they entirely leaned too far into tired borg shit. But hey it was was good for star trek related memes at least :>