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[-] RedWizard@lemmygrad.ml 103 points 6 months ago

Probably worth sharing the top comment from the lemmygrad thread:

The article was written by John Bechtel, who was chair of the CPUSA up until 2019.

This is their official take on the Oct 7 attack.

https://www.cpusa.org/article/stop-the-war-end-the-occupation-free-palestine/

[-] TheLepidopterists@hexbear.net 48 points 6 months ago

Someone else mentioned that Bechtel is still president of the organization that published People's World. Are they not under direct control of the CPUSA?

[-] Alaskaball@hexbear.net 19 points 6 months ago

Peoples world is a "privately held company" operated by members of CPUSA's central committee. Anyone saying that People's world isn't run by CPUSA because of a tissue paper's thickness worth of "plausible deniability" would be akin to denying that Washington Post is the mouthpiece of Jeff Bezos and his cohort because WAPO is owned by "Nash Holdings LLC"

[-] Al_Sham@hexbear.net 32 points 6 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)
[-] autismdragon@hexbear.net 23 points 6 months ago

Some things are bad there, but its not "just as bad".

Honestly in think condemning a statement that calls for an end of the occupation for not flaunting pointless bloodthirst and using a little disgression/moderation is fine. I know we're supposed to be dirtbags that dont care about tone here, but i think a national org is a different situation.

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[-] CrimsonSage@hexbear.net 21 points 6 months ago

Yeah they need to get their shit togeather and eject all the old blood from positions of power. Like respect to those people who kept the party going through the bleak years, but my experience with the older leadership is that they are terminally libbrained and election focused. The younger members seemed really full of energy and focus on direct action and community organizing.

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[-] FourteenEyes@hexbear.net 88 points 6 months ago

"Do your part, join an org"

The org:

[-] anarchoilluminati@hexbear.net 45 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

Honestly, I don't know of a single org that is not a cringe ass cesspool filled with useless pseudo-academics with terrible takes that ultimately don't want to do anything remotely revolutionary besides political education classes or reading groups.

It's no wonder the US is in the political state it is in currently.

[-] oscardejarjayes@hexbear.net 44 points 6 months ago

The IWW has unionized several workplaces, which is honestly more than most other orgs can claim.

[-] anarchoilluminati@hexbear.net 22 points 6 months ago

I hear that. I might try again later but I've given up on communist/socialist organizations in the US for the reasons I've mentioned above and more, but I'm very active and effective in my own workplace union. I figure that is far more impactful than a couple of awkwardly ignored rallies a year, at most.

[-] oscardejarjayes@hexbear.net 14 points 6 months ago

That's understandable. Wish you luck with your union!

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[-] sexywheat@hexbear.net 24 points 6 months ago

I've heard good things about the PSL, but I'm not American so I've not had any actual experience with them.

[-] the_kid@hexbear.net 27 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

I told this story in the news mega before:

I went to a PSL rally for Palestine and as we were doing the "whose streets? our streets!" chant, the organizers told us to move off the street to let some buses pass.

the US is hopeless, no socialist movement will ever happen in the imperial core

[-] GaveUp@hexbear.net 32 points 6 months ago

Of all the things to criticize PSL for this is probably the worst one I've heard

[-] NPa@hexbear.net 26 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

"what do we want?"

"incremental change!"

"when do we want it?"

"whenever it's convenient for the ruling class!" not-hillary

[-] oktherebuddy@hexbear.net 24 points 6 months ago

making way for public transit isn't too bad tbh

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[-] Great_Leader_Is_Dead@hexbear.net 31 points 6 months ago

"ORGANIZE!"

"With who?"

"Oh yeah."

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[-] star_wraith@hexbear.net 68 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

“Yes, organizing in the imperial core is pointless. You’re better off staying home and posting memes on Hexbear instead.” -fedposting

You know how I finally got involved in an org? I had a vision of the rest of my life. Spend my free time reading theory for the next 50 years or so. I could probably get pretty smart at this Marxism thing. Then I die. That big Marxist brain shuts off and I will have left the world not making even the slightest impact on it. Well, some people online knew I was a commie and some family members, but that’s it. I developed all this knowledge - devoted my life to it - and in the end it didn’t mean a thing. I couldn’t handle that, I had to do something.

You know why people like Zizek have such shit takes? I think it’s largely because he (and frankly, most Marxist academics) aren’t involved in even the slightest bit of real praxis. He would rather jerk off other Marxist philosophers with his pettifoggery bullshit than help some homeless folks down the street. Being a commie isn’t about having the right takes. It’s about changing the world (with the right takes). Being right on the internet, now THAT is pointless.

Faith without works is dead, comrades.

Yeah, of course, those of us in the imperial core have our work cut out for us. The conditions aren’t there right now. The conditions aren’t close to being there right now. But you know what, things can change on you fast. Maybe it’s all pointless but if you’re not involved and doing something, then you’ve already given up and we may as well just wait while this whole planet just cooks. And even if it is pointless, do it for yourself. Do it so you can feel that you’re at least trying and doing what you can.

People here whine and moan about DSA and PSL. I promise you, their chapters in your city aren’t anywhere near as bad as you’re probably afraid of. Yeah, sure, maybe some folks there will say things like “China is state capitalist”. But if that’s enough to keep you from organizing then I’m sorry, you’re definitely showing me you have never engaged with other leftists outside of this website. There’s a lot of opinions out there, and a lot of leftist IRL who have a lot of potential are gonna have some shitty takes when you meet them. WHY NOT BE THE ONE WHO HELPS THEM NOT BE SO SHIT?

Both orgs I mentioned are desperate for good, knowledgeable, passionate comrades. A lot of you here are more than capable of doing great things in an org. You would be shocked, if you put the work in, how willing people will be to follow your lead.

[-] Maoo@hexbear.net 29 points 6 months ago

It's important to find good orgs and not just put up with shitty libs ruining your opportunities for praxis. You can go from being a stay-at-home big brain to an infighting-and-pointless-electoralism lib if you're not cognizant of your org and its weaknesses.

Step 1 is to join an org and begin doing work, including gaining organizing skills.

Step 2 is to either begin launching new campaigns yourself because you got lucky with your first choice of org or to instead join a better org so you can do better work.

Don't underestimate just how toxic or useless some orgs can get! You might be surprised at how little headway you will make in some spaces where you do the leadership things (organizing, planning, logistics, socializing, chairing, hooking people up, teaching, etc) and can't get anyone to move on key things like, "maybe don't put all of your effort into failing to get some random person elected that is already 6 months late into declaring their candidacy" or "maybe you don't need to put out a message condemning Hamas and both sides" or "maybe don't be pro-cop". I've seen or heard of all these things from very good organizers who moved on to better organizations. The issues above occurring in self-proclaimed socialist spaces, including some communist ones.

Consider also that step 1 may be hampered by a toxic or incompetent org. You may pick up bad habits or become complacent with failure or simply not be around anyone that can teach you good methods. You might even be in an org that actively quashes attempts to practice good methods because the folks around you think very highly of their own methods that never get results and believe it's their goal in life to tell you what to do, lol. I've also seen this.

So my rec is to try the two steps I listed but know when to bail on a step 1 org that you're not growing in.

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[-] TheLastHero@hexbear.net 28 points 6 months ago

on the other hand, there are a lot of orgs whose "praxis" is an utter dead end and squanders the potential of those passionate activists and end up burning them out after years of bashing their head against a wall with nothing to show for it. Their leadership of these orgs are often old heads who never got over the fact the cold war ended and love hearing themselves talk about "the good old days" when SDS "took over the campus" or just whoever had the most time on their hands and ran unopposed (usually the most online in the whole party too). If you do find an effective and active leader, more likely than not they're an actual federal undercover who is so active because their ass is literally getting paid to be there and take notes on you. So you will spend your valuable time doing useless shit like trying to sell newspapers on the street corner (what fucking century is it?) or knocking on doors for your local "progressive" democrat who will immediately sell you all out anyway. Maybe you can co-opt a few protests somebody else organized, good work Lenin. And party discipline? yeah right. good luck getting people to show up to meetings with them also trying to manage their lives in hellworld, half the time the only thing keeping the org running consistently is because the leadership is all in some ridiculous clique/polycule that inevitably collapses in a shower of bitterness and maybe SA allegations that takes the whole org with them on the way out. Not every org deserves your respect, and moreover your energy, time, and money just because they call themselves communists.

Now not to be entirely cynical, there are definitely some notable exceptions. Ethnic identity orgs are some real disciplined heavy hitters in the American activist scene who know how to get shit done. Black Panthers, Brown Berets, AIM, hell look at groups like SJP causing congressional hearings right now. They've all learned valuable hard-won lessons from the white nationalist police state trying to roll them over, though if you're a complete cumskin you're probably going to stick out a little (a lot) trying to join one. DSA and PSL aren't bad, it does really depend on the chapter it seems- it's a good sign if they have more than 6 people in it and they aren't all fucking eachother. Do not get into extremely online arguments about soviet agricultural policy, its annoying to everyone else and more importantly irrelevant to the current political struggle. Ironically anarchist groups tend to have their shit together more often because they don't take themselves so fucking seriously like some trot or ML orgs do (who are nearly all completely irrelevant cranks and losers). FNB does real easy and good praxis and they have all been chill as hell. In reality if you are getting out to demonstrations in your locale you are probably going to eventually be meeting with other like minded orgs in your community, and you could and should be judging who has the most juice and invest your effort in them accordingly. rarely do they care about your "personal ideology" as long as you aren't annoying about it and you are putting in work, everyone is desperate for more people like OP said.

So respect yourself and join orgs that respect you, its the people in them that matter and not whatever is on their pamphlet, we're all just trying to fight against this rotting genocidal empire in our own ways. And until we get an honest to god revolutionary vanguard forming in this country I don't think you should be afraid to walk away and stay away from an org that you feel is wasting your time or draining your fucking lifeforce. Left wing political organization is still very nascent and many of them will go the way of the Trudoviks (abandoned or absorbed into a more powerful party) once a legitimate class conscious proletarian force starts politically coalescing around whatever party (or whatever it will be called) in the future. You'll know when you find some real comrades- they'll earn your loyalty and you will earn theirs, and it will be beautiful. And that's what will change the world.

(keep shitposting on hexbear in the meantime tho I need my slop)

[-] Mardoniush@hexbear.net 15 points 6 months ago

A good sign is when the orgs have members who are also union reps etc etc, not because of entryism but because the party decided boosting local non party worker and activist orgs was the right thing to do.

There's a reason a lot of organisations say you cant be member of a socialist org and that's not because of entryism but because if you're a committed and effective member of that org, people will start discussing your politics and where they can get them.

[-] GarbageShoot@hexbear.net 25 points 6 months ago

Zizek is by his own admission not a Marxist, he just talks about Marxism a lot. I think he says stupid shit because his existence is based on getting money from neoliberal media institutions, which means he can't be radical in any useful sense. What he really believes is immaterial to that question.

[-] MiraculousMM@hexbear.net 23 points 6 months ago
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[-] very_poggers_gay@hexbear.net 67 points 6 months ago

How do y’all balance the importance and need to get involved and join an org with how cringy and critically flawed many of them are? I feel at a loss with this

Stuff like this also reminds me how spoiled I am with hexbear though, lol, because I’ve rarely ever seen something super cringy or lib without it getting informative and/or entertaining pushback. “Leftist” spaces on Reddit feel really confused, poorly read on theory, and infested with libs and ruiners. This place is kinda built different like that

[-] TheLastHero@hexbear.net 49 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

CPUSA has been deeply infiltrated by feds for decades. I have no idea why anyone would waste their time and energy with them in 2023 when it's obviously a honeypot

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[-] Mardoniush@hexbear.net 41 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

You find one marginally less cringe and hope for the best. The day to day work is generally less online.

The other option is to work via non party orgs. Food banks, unions, protest groups, and attempt to inject revolutionary theory into them. This is sometimes hard for more party centric tendencies to cope with though.

This statement is probably risking a rank and file split in CPUSA.

[-] GaveUp@hexbear.net 29 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

Ehhh, take out the food bank and all other charity groups from that list. The inherent structure of it makes it useless to radicalize

Do entryism in a mutual aid group instead that's not anarchists (not sectarianism, just better to radicalize libs than trying to change other ideologies you don't like)

[-] GaveUp@hexbear.net 39 points 6 months ago

Obviously the answer is to never touch grass and keep posting rat-salute

[-] GeorgeZBush@hexbear.net 29 points 6 months ago

you become a doomer and pray every day that the West is just completely destroyed

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[-] CrimsonSage@hexbear.net 14 points 6 months ago

I don't know how PW relates to the party line, but I do know basically anyone can submit articles to it. It's a super bad look though and they need to get their shit togeather.

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[-] Evilphd666@hexbear.net 43 points 6 months ago

sicko-fem Time to pay your dues as a captured org sweetie.

[-] Awoo@hexbear.net 41 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

Feds. 100% feds. No other time has it been more true than to call them feds than this exact moment.

[-] Alaskaball@hexbear.net 32 points 6 months ago

I disagree, there's been plenty of points in the past to say it. Folks just don't listen when it's said. Every leader since the death of comrade Hall has been a Democrat tailing sheepdog

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[-] BelieveRevolt@hexbear.net 37 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

They endorsed Hillary, so are you really surprised? fedposting

Edit: fake news.

[-] davel@hexbear.net 28 points 6 months ago

Did they? It looks like this was a debunked story.

[-] BelieveRevolt@hexbear.net 25 points 6 months ago

I thought there was a story about them endorsing her, but seems like that definitely didn't exist. I have to concede that they didn't really endorse her.

lol that Snopes is a lib site, so you know their angle for publishing that was ”The GOP is trying to smear her, we swear Hillary's no filthy commie!”

[-] 0x0520@hexbear.net 23 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

They didn't "endorse" her, but they definitely played the lesser of two evils game.

[-] davel@hexbear.net 18 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

Oh yeah Snopes is as bad or worse than NATOpedia.

[-] Alaskaball@hexbear.net 35 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

Not the only time they post cringe last time I gave enough of a shit to bludgeon my brain through reading their writing, their leader all but directly wrote that any "serious" lenin-dont-laugh communist must vote for Biden to stop trump, citing Cornel West and other campaigns as spoilers ( of course PSL is left out by name but we can easily inferr his thoughts on their campaign as well.)

[-] Gay_Wrath@hexbear.net 33 points 6 months ago
[-] ziggurter@hexbear.net 30 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

I'm an anarchist and have no great love for the organization in general, but I think this little screenshot might be a but misleading, and that's a shit thing to do to other leftists.

Here appears to be recent, relevant posts on CPUSA's actual website: https://www.cpusa.org/?ssearch=palestine&fq=any&sort=date&order=desc

Some of the titles alone:

  • "Gaza: The second wave of genocide"
  • "A ceasefire is the first step toward peace and liberation"
  • "The cost of silencing voices for peace"
  • "CP and YCL take it to the streets: Ceasefire now!"
  • "Stop the war! End the occupation! Free Palestine!" (Note: published Oct 8, 2023)

And here's the first paragraph of that first article:

After several days of ceasefire, Israel again embarked upon its campaign of wanton killing and destruction. This followed yet the latest visit to the region by U.S. Secretary of State, Antony Blinken, underlining for anyone somehow still under doubt that the U.S. is most certainly an accomplice to this genocide being perpetrated by the Israeli occupation forces against the wholly innocent people of Gaza, undertaken of course with an arsenal of U.S. state-of-the-art weaponry, military technology, and intelligence.

I haven't gone into the details of their writing, but this really doesn't sound like an organization of zionists who are condemning Hamas or other Palestinians, or supporting the apartheid regime and its genocide.

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[-] Dickey_Butts@hexbear.net 25 points 6 months ago

White people: Not even once

[-] puff@hexbear.net 24 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

As much as I don't support CPUSA because they're Democrats and CPGB because I hear their stance on trans peoples is problematic, it's very common to see posts like this where the quote itself and the meaning inferred from the quote by the person tweeting it don't seem to align. Do you really think they're aligning with the settlers? The screenshot literally has them calling Israel's response "horrific" and a "humanitarian catastrophe". Where are you getting your take from???

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[-] AssortedBiscuits@hexbear.net 22 points 6 months ago
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[-] shath@hexbear.net 22 points 6 months ago
[-] GnastyGnuts@hexbear.net 21 points 6 months ago
[-] wombat@hexbear.net 20 points 6 months ago

stalin shouldn't have stopped at berlin

[-] HumanBehaviorByBjork@hexbear.net 20 points 6 months ago

lmao. joke party for stupid assholes.

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this post was submitted on 20 Dec 2023
148 points (99.3% liked)

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